What Do You Expect from the Mater?
- Thread starter clwill
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Buns
Nitro Member
What I expect from the Mater is no different than what I expect from people in everyday life - to be truthful and respectful whether you agree or not. If you disagree, do it respectfully and state why you disagree using facts and not conjecture. I don't believe that is a tough thing to do. We've all said something we wish we could take back but in the internet world where we can proofread everything and rethink it before we hit reply, this shouldn't be a problem.
Attacking Don who is a legend of the sport, gives millions of dollars and the most important of all, his time, to the sport we all love, is ridiculous and should not be tolerated. Like I said, if you disagree, state why you disagree and do it respectfully using truths and nothing else.
I believe we're all capable of adhering to these simple guidelines. If we do, the Mater will be a more pleasant place to come and talk about drag racing instead of reading inflammatory posts that contribute nothing to the value of this forum.
Attacking Don who is a legend of the sport, gives millions of dollars and the most important of all, his time, to the sport we all love, is ridiculous and should not be tolerated. Like I said, if you disagree, state why you disagree and do it respectfully using truths and nothing else.
I believe we're all capable of adhering to these simple guidelines. If we do, the Mater will be a more pleasant place to come and talk about drag racing instead of reading inflammatory posts that contribute nothing to the value of this forum.
vegasnitro
Nitro Member
Ahhh ... the thread as old as the internet itself, the "why can't we all just get along and how do we control the trolls" thread. I first saw this thread on a ratio'd BBS in 1988 when I played text/turn based role playing games on my Commodore 128. Yes, I am a super nerd.
Anywho ... as many have stated, there is no right answer. No one wants a place where you fear having a dissenting opinion, and no one wants an all out bashfest either. Basically, it's up to the Mods to walk that tight rope. Overall, I feel this place does a pretty good job of self-policing, not too many people get away with posting outerageous BS, without another member stepping up and saying something. My personal opinion is that people focus on the negative too much. They see 1 negative post, and that is all they remember, not the 15 positive posts that come behind it. There is NO WAY that can be overcome, it is human nature. The second thing that I have noticed is an unbelievable sense of entitlement people think they have. DSR/Honeywell owe us NO EXPLANATIONS as to why they switched out the driver on the Fram top fueler. Coil owes us NO EXPLANATION as to why he left JFR. Yet some of the folks on here act as if they don't get every last detail, they are being ripped off or insulted in some way. It is startling to me. There is also NO WAY that can be overcome because of the immediacy and the comfortable anonymity the internet provides.
What I want from the Mater is a place to come and talk about Drag Racing. Nothing more, nothing less. The more people the better IMO.
With all of that being said, I have met MANY fantastic people as a result of this board, and got to do things as a fan because of this board that I never would have dreamed possible 5 or 6 years ago. So maintain your civility, hang around a while, and reach out to some people when you are at the track. You will be surprised at the response you get.
Anywho ... as many have stated, there is no right answer. No one wants a place where you fear having a dissenting opinion, and no one wants an all out bashfest either. Basically, it's up to the Mods to walk that tight rope. Overall, I feel this place does a pretty good job of self-policing, not too many people get away with posting outerageous BS, without another member stepping up and saying something. My personal opinion is that people focus on the negative too much. They see 1 negative post, and that is all they remember, not the 15 positive posts that come behind it. There is NO WAY that can be overcome, it is human nature. The second thing that I have noticed is an unbelievable sense of entitlement people think they have. DSR/Honeywell owe us NO EXPLANATIONS as to why they switched out the driver on the Fram top fueler. Coil owes us NO EXPLANATION as to why he left JFR. Yet some of the folks on here act as if they don't get every last detail, they are being ripped off or insulted in some way. It is startling to me. There is also NO WAY that can be overcome because of the immediacy and the comfortable anonymity the internet provides.
What I want from the Mater is a place to come and talk about Drag Racing. Nothing more, nothing less. The more people the better IMO.
With all of that being said, I have met MANY fantastic people as a result of this board, and got to do things as a fan because of this board that I never would have dreamed possible 5 or 6 years ago. So maintain your civility, hang around a while, and reach out to some people when you are at the track. You will be surprised at the response you get.
Professional Fan
Nitro Member
While the internet has provided all of us with access to info and people we never would have access to before, it also allows people to be brave since they don't have to face the person they are talking about. Maybe this is too simple but how about not posting anything you wouldn't be willing to say to that person's face?
I don't post often but I do lurk a lot. A while back I posted a comment about what happened at a PRO meeting that I was told by a racer who attended the meeting. I was criticized by a person on this board. I responded back respectfully that those comments were unwarranted, especially from someone I had never even met. He responded back, "point well taken" and we both moved on without any animosity.
Seems to me it shouldn't be that difficult to be civil to each other and respect other's positions even though we may diagree with those positions and avoid negativity when it is just speculation or opinion and not based on any facts, like some of the Ron Capps thread posts.
I don't post often but I do lurk a lot. A while back I posted a comment about what happened at a PRO meeting that I was told by a racer who attended the meeting. I was criticized by a person on this board. I responded back respectfully that those comments were unwarranted, especially from someone I had never even met. He responded back, "point well taken" and we both moved on without any animosity.
Seems to me it shouldn't be that difficult to be civil to each other and respect other's positions even though we may diagree with those positions and avoid negativity when it is just speculation or opinion and not based on any facts, like some of the Ron Capps thread posts.
megadeth
Nitro Member
I tend to agree with Don and Jim's post. The freedom we are all afforded here to say what we want about whatever we want does come with responsibility!
There has to be some respect when you address a situation we really know nothing about. I have been afforded opportunities I probably wouldn't have if it wasn't for this site.
I have had the good fortune of meeting and working with Bobby Bennett, Roger Richards and Stan Creekmore which helped improve my photography skills.
Watching Bobby, Stan and Roger working an event has given me a new found respect for what they do. I owe it to this site. I've meet Don numerous times during my shoots and he has been very gracious and helpful.
We really need to consider the damage we can do by speculating situations we are only assuming what's happening and not knowing the actual facts.
Some of the stuff posted here is borderline slander in my book!
Don, Bobby, Stan and Roger THANK YOU all for making me feel welcome and the opportunity of a lifetime!
There has to be some respect when you address a situation we really know nothing about. I have been afforded opportunities I probably wouldn't have if it wasn't for this site.
I have had the good fortune of meeting and working with Bobby Bennett, Roger Richards and Stan Creekmore which helped improve my photography skills.
Watching Bobby, Stan and Roger working an event has given me a new found respect for what they do. I owe it to this site. I've meet Don numerous times during my shoots and he has been very gracious and helpful.
We really need to consider the damage we can do by speculating situations we are only assuming what's happening and not knowing the actual facts.
Some of the stuff posted here is borderline slander in my book!
Don, Bobby, Stan and Roger THANK YOU all for making me feel welcome and the opportunity of a lifetime!
vegasnitro
Nitro Member
Actually, when you distill internet posts down to their truest essence, this is probably the best advice that has been given on this board/in this thread.
If you wouldn't say it, don't type it!
Tumbleweed
Nitro Member
Gutter Brain
Nitro Member
Lance and Chris sum things up pretty good. There have been a few posts that I wrote, read and decided not to post because it would not add to the topic.
I have enjoyed reading a lot of stuff on here. Some posts I may not agree with, but respect the person to have their own opinion.
As many have said, hopefully we can work on thinking before we speak/type.
I would think if anyone that has ever quit, retired or gotten fired from DSR, really felt they were wronged in a horrible way, we'd have heard about it by now. I mean seriously. All the people that have come and gone from that organization, and I don't really recall anyone coming out and saying what a jerk and terrible guy Don is to work for. Did I miss someone saying anything negative about their experience with DSR? I gotta believe if it was that bad, somebody would have had the balls to speak out by now. Or maybe they are that afraid of "The Don"!(Relax, it's a joke!)
I sure haven't heard of anyone that's been afraid to go to work for Don either.
I had the opportunity to work for DSR several years ago. It was just for a short time, Richard Hogan brought me in to finish out the season on Mealnie's car, but was a very good experience. Don and everyone I dealt with during my time there treated me fantasticly. In talking with people from most of the DSR teams, I got the opinion that they were very well treated. Several advised me to stay on for the next year if the opportunity arose. Wish I could have been faced with that decision, but it wasn't to be. Thank you Mr. Schumacher for giving me the opportunity to spend some time at a very professional organization.
This is indeed good advice and I personally intend to do a better job of adhering to it. There's only one problem with it though, Chris - no matter the circumstance, you will always - always - have a small (but vocal) group of internet snipers who hate flowers, fresh air and little kids. Makes 'em feel tough by being able to talk smack to a high-profile individual, something they could never get away with in person. You cannot prevent this from happening. You can, however, effectively deal with it. And mods must remember, even respected members 'lose it' on occasion, or maybe they've just had a bad day. They too must be dealt with, but again, case by case.
Some rough-and-tumble is permissible and even desirable. If we were all on the same page on every single subject, this place would soon die out, the result of everyone being bored to tears. And it can be easily and effectively controlled by simply using COMMON SENSE.
You wouldn't walk up and yell at a stranger over some rumor you heard...so don't do it here, either. This may be cyberspace, but words typed here have equal effect on those reading them. Be respectful, and be careful. There's an old saying - speak (or type) words in good taste, because one day you may be forced to eat them.
Alan Barrett, thanks for the flowers, my friend.
I tried my level best to share feelings and experience with others here on this site, and not for any personal gain. If one person reads those words and benefits from them, then the effort was worth it. And from me to others here, thank YOU for your input and thoughts. I'd like to think I'm a better person, too, as a result.Most everyone here is in agreement with how we need to keep the house in order, so now that we've established the parameters, let's get the show on the road. How about it, moderators? You asked, we told; what say you?
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Randy
Nitro Member
It got so bad here for a while there was little choice but for Nitromater to require actual names and not "handles" so people knew who was doing the posting. Your name and your reputation became tied to what you posted from that point on.
clwill
Nitro Member
- Thread starter
- #53
Trying to sum up then, I think it's good to think of the Mater as drag racing's neighborhood bar and grill. We all want a nice place where people feel welcome and comfortable, were the conversation is lively, where interesting people stop in frequently, and where fights are few and far between. Disagreement is fine, but respect is required.
In many ways, therefore, it's up to all of us to maintain decorum. When someone says something out of line, it's up to all of us to say "hey, this isn't that kind of place." Sure, the management (the mods) will try their best to keep things under control, but it's the patrons that really steer the culture of a place. Bars most of us want to be in don't rely on the cops to set the tone of the place, and we shouldn't do that here. Sure the mods in their police uniforms will toss people (or posts) when they are truly out of line, but the patrons carry the largest weight.
The Mater doesn't allow people in who are wearing masks (handles) to hide their identity, and that makes everyone a little bit more civil. But you can't legislate civility. That comes from the broader base.
When someone says something over the line, many of us should say "whoa, wait a second, that was uncalled for." The power of many people responding like that is much stronger than waiting for some moderator to come in and save the day.
I'm not suggesting a group mugging when someone gets out of line, but if you think something's disrespectful, or out of line, call them on it. Nicely, gently, and not with venom. As my mother says "we don't do that here". When they see that this place is different than some other places on the drag racing net, the people wanting a fight will go elsewhere. And the Mater will remain a place where the rest of us want to be.
That's my $0.02. Worth every penny
Chris
In many ways, therefore, it's up to all of us to maintain decorum. When someone says something out of line, it's up to all of us to say "hey, this isn't that kind of place." Sure, the management (the mods) will try their best to keep things under control, but it's the patrons that really steer the culture of a place. Bars most of us want to be in don't rely on the cops to set the tone of the place, and we shouldn't do that here. Sure the mods in their police uniforms will toss people (or posts) when they are truly out of line, but the patrons carry the largest weight.
The Mater doesn't allow people in who are wearing masks (handles) to hide their identity, and that makes everyone a little bit more civil. But you can't legislate civility. That comes from the broader base.
When someone says something over the line, many of us should say "whoa, wait a second, that was uncalled for." The power of many people responding like that is much stronger than waiting for some moderator to come in and save the day.
I'm not suggesting a group mugging when someone gets out of line, but if you think something's disrespectful, or out of line, call them on it. Nicely, gently, and not with venom. As my mother says "we don't do that here". When they see that this place is different than some other places on the drag racing net, the people wanting a fight will go elsewhere. And the Mater will remain a place where the rest of us want to be.
That's my $0.02. Worth every penny
Chris
Bullard Anderson
Nitro Member
Don't get lost in your own subjectivity to understand the big picture.
Have refrained from posting on this due to stopping to delete a few lengthy tirades. (delete key works I use it A LOT)
Funny none of the fire starter types have posted as to what they expect from here.
Mr. Schumacher, thanks for your time in Pomona (you know what I mean on that) Class act as usual.
Mr. Jannard, as always thanks for just being you.
Mr. Asher, spot on.
And most of what everyone wrote is very good. Golden rule basically.
Lest anyone forget it is all an entertainment business. Period. Call it what you will. Whether it is a sportsman car or otherwise a bigger operation. Yes a sport but still a business, an entertainment business.
I had better go now before I type the rest of what I would really like to say and get the thread closed or I get banned.
Funny none of the fire starter types have posted as to what they expect from here.
Mr. Schumacher, thanks for your time in Pomona (you know what I mean on that) Class act as usual.
Mr. Jannard, as always thanks for just being you.
Mr. Asher, spot on.
And most of what everyone wrote is very good. Golden rule basically.
Lest anyone forget it is all an entertainment business. Period. Call it what you will. Whether it is a sportsman car or otherwise a bigger operation. Yes a sport but still a business, an entertainment business.
I had better go now before I type the rest of what I would really like to say and get the thread closed or I get banned.
Friendly debate is always good. Getting crazy isn't. Most here have pointed out obvious good and bad points. The issue comes when it gets into that gray area.
I do miss having as many drivers and insiders on here as before. They added another dimension to the site. It's easy to say that maybe some shouldn't be thin skinned but on the other hand would you want to go to a site where you might be ripped on? Sure many of us have been ripped on here but I know if I fire back at someone I don't have to be mindful of what a sponsor may think. Drivers/owners do have to think of such things.
The name change a few years back did help. Sadly it did chase away many of the hiding names of the sport, but it also got rid of many of the trolls. I have spent time on many other boards through the years. Many are troll fest, pointless or just dead. Here and draglist seem to have good things going on.
While we are by no means perfect I do believe that it is a great place. Like others, I come here for info, to chat and have ended up meeting some great friends along the way.
Just think before you hit submit. Disagree, just do with with class and dignity. I've seen the names of the sport come on and debate things, which is great for everyone, that only happens if done the right way.
With that said, Don I am upset at the Cory deal. I wish he was still there but if you had to make the move to a younger driver then why not me. See so now I am mad twice
I do miss having as many drivers and insiders on here as before. They added another dimension to the site. It's easy to say that maybe some shouldn't be thin skinned but on the other hand would you want to go to a site where you might be ripped on? Sure many of us have been ripped on here but I know if I fire back at someone I don't have to be mindful of what a sponsor may think. Drivers/owners do have to think of such things.
The name change a few years back did help. Sadly it did chase away many of the hiding names of the sport, but it also got rid of many of the trolls. I have spent time on many other boards through the years. Many are troll fest, pointless or just dead. Here and draglist seem to have good things going on.
While we are by no means perfect I do believe that it is a great place. Like others, I come here for info, to chat and have ended up meeting some great friends along the way.
Just think before you hit submit. Disagree, just do with with class and dignity. I've seen the names of the sport come on and debate things, which is great for everyone, that only happens if done the right way.
With that said, Don I am upset at the Cory deal. I wish he was still there but if you had to make the move to a younger driver then why not me. See so now I am mad twice
funnycarguy
Nitro Member
Thank you Don and Jim for posting!!
I have never understood and have posted my thoughts before.....hard to take all the negativity about a sport I love. I do not have time to participate full time due to business over the last 3 years but enjoyed Las Vegas both weekends this year.
I am grateful my parents used to say......if you cant say something nice don't say anything at all. Or course respectful opinions and debate are healthy and fun.
I was so pleased talking to one of Don's employee's at dinner unsolicited how he loved working for DSR. And he only thought I was an informed fan because I didn't say anymore.
We should only discuss facts when we know for sure. Lets just play nice !
I have never understood and have posted my thoughts before.....hard to take all the negativity about a sport I love. I do not have time to participate full time due to business over the last 3 years but enjoyed Las Vegas both weekends this year.
I am grateful my parents used to say......if you cant say something nice don't say anything at all. Or course respectful opinions and debate are healthy and fun.
I was so pleased talking to one of Don's employee's at dinner unsolicited how he loved working for DSR. And he only thought I was an informed fan because I didn't say anymore.
We should only discuss facts when we know for sure. Lets just play nice !
Ted
Nitro Member
Don, Virgil, Jim, and others, keep coming in here. I know you guys have businesses to run, professional images to maintain, but we really appreciate it.
Mods- Thanks for all your hard work! This is a great site.
I think it's okay to criticize driver/crew chief hirings and firings, just no personal attacks. Keep it civil, that's all.
Mods- Thanks for all your hard work! This is a great site.
I think it's okay to criticize driver/crew chief hirings and firings, just no personal attacks. Keep it civil, that's all.
I was NITRO BREATH
Nitro Member
I am thankful for the don shumachers of our sport, we all should be. But Don, this is a place for opinions and discussion and most of the folks on here dont know facts. They are venting and spouting opinions. And i come here to hear those opinions and offer mine. And sometimes truth is told here .If along the way i learn a few things about drag racing thats great.. And i have learned volumes over the years. I like when Don comes on to give " his version of the facts''. but it kinda feels like when i was a kid and my friends father left the grown up discussion and played with us kids. it was fun to have him with us but i always felt like he was in the wrong group. And don when you come on here I always feel like you are talking with the kids and you should stay with the grown ups. But if you do come here dont tell us how much it hurts to read these baseless opinions and slanted half truths. Cause we all know that most of the talk on here is just that.. and if you dont want to get dirty dont go down into the mud of this forum
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