Force and T Ped going at it in the shutdown? (2 Viewers)

[Randy]

Furthermore .. if the situation had been reversed, would Cruz have taken a dive for Tony .. my guess is yes.

I keep seeing these types of comments. You guys obviously didn't watch Brainard. I figured Tony would dive, and so did everyone else. But Tony beat him fair and square.

I also keep reading comments about how Tony would be nothing more than a 3rd string fill in test driver if it weren't for Force. I disagree.

There are a lot of folks who were able to start a team on nothing and become very competitive just because they had the desire burning in them. Truck driver John Force comes to mind. Photographer Whit Bazemore comes to mind. Alky dragster crew member Ron Capps comes to mind. Gas Station owner Tim Wilkerson comes to mind. Car Painter Don Prudhomme comes to mind. Should I go on?

Tony stands on his own two feet. No driver in the pits looking for a ride would have turned the Force ride down. Back when he took the ride Force was dominating. The big fight in points was to see who was going to be number two, not number one because Force had it locked.

Now the man on his own despite multi car teams has won a championship (2007) and JF had nothing to do with it. Tony Schumacher is proving there is more to winning than having one person watching your back. Like Gerrold said when he put his foot in his mouth when interviewing Tony after a run "Everybody wrote this team off..." Really?

RG

.

 

[clwill]

I'd like to nominate Bill Stephens for several additional "mater cred" points. Some of the best posts we've had here in a long time.

But alas, it's lost on most of the folks here. Bill, you have to stop making so much sense...

 

[Randy]

If there is any justice in the world, Tim Wilkerson will go on a tear now and win the 2009 championship. And he will earn enough points that the mathematicians will determine that he would have won it under the more traditional format too.

That will make everyone happy and finish the year up on a high note!

We can only hope!

Go Wilk!

 

[kingcobrafan]

You had me until this sentence........

How can you feel any pride in a race or championship won with team orders?

Sean D

On the button, Sean.

 

[clwill]

I'm pretty much all over the place on this. I completely understand Force taking the dive. He had to, he did it, and he couldn't admit it. I understand the Pedregons being indignant. They had to and they did it. Up to that point, I'm good.

Where I lose it is where John lost it. A smart businessman like John absolutely has to learn to control his temper. Castrol, Ford, Brand Source, AAA, and the NHRA don't need a guy only making SportCenter because he had to be restrained. He shouldn't have done any interviews, because he doesn't lie well (and he had to lie). And he should've just ignored TPed and enjoyed Ashley's win.

Did TPed push his buttons? Yep. So do my kids, my wife, and my mother. The difference between an adult and a kid is how you handle that kind of thing.

 

[Lori]

I'm pretty much all over the place on this. I completely understand Force taking the dive. He had to, he did it, and he couldn't admit it. I understand the Pedregons being indignant. They had to and they did it. Up to that point, I'm good.

Where I lose it is where John lost it. A smart businessman like John absolutely has to learn to control his temper. Castrol, Ford, Brand Source, AAA, and the NHRA don't need a guy only making SportCenter because he had to be restrained. He shouldn't have done any interviews, because he doesn't lie well (and he had to lie). And he should've just ignored TPed and enjoyed Ashley's win.

Did TPed push his buttons? Yep. So do my kids, my wife, and my mother. The difference between an adult and a kid is how you handle that kind of thing.

bingo!! my thoughts exactly. Why lie? Just say something that has been thought of long before you knew you were going to have the camera asking what you knew was going to be asked. Making a fool of yourself and loosing it isn't impressive. Have a little respect for yourself and the sanctioning body that you represent. This was embarrassing. I couldn't watch much of it myself.

 

[Billy]

On the button, Sean.

Well, there would be no pride or satisfaction for anyone if you told your sponsor you had a shot at the championship, opted to let the chips fall where they may, and in the process saw another team win the title. "OK, Mr. Sponsor, can I have $4 million again next year and potentially miss out on another championship because I won't employ the same team strategies all my opponents use?" Again I say, racers in every series are very intelligent people and understand that team orders can have a direct impact on a championship outcome, and in the 20 years I've been covering motorsports, I can't recall any driver or any team taking any less pride or satisfaction in winning a championship after utilizing team orders. Not one.

Tim Wilkerson would agree. It's no coincidence that after being edged out of the championship with a single-car operation last year, he's joined Bob Tasca III. The last time a single-car team won the Funny Car championship was......John Force in 1995.

 

[jackass]

I'm pretty much all over the place on this. I completely understand Force taking the dive. He had to, he did it, and he couldn't admit it. I understand the Pedregons being indignant. They had to and they did it. Up to that point, I'm good.

Where I lose it is where John lost it. A smart businessman like John absolutely has to learn to control his temper. Castrol, Ford, Brand Source, AAA, and the NHRA don't need a guy only making SportCenter because he had to be restrained. He shouldn't have done any interviews, because he doesn't lie well (and he had to lie). And he should've just ignored TPed and enjoyed Ashley's win.

Did TPed push his buttons? Yep. So do my kids, my wife, and my mother. The difference between an adult and a kid is how you handle that kind of thing.

Great post...

 

[Joker]

bingo!! my thoughts exactly. Why lie? Just say something that has been thought of long before you knew you were going to have the camera asking what you knew was going to be asked. Making a fool of yourself and loosing it isn't impressive. Have a little respect for yourself and the sanctioning body that you represent. This was embarrassing. I couldn't watch much of it myself.

For the love of god people, he cant just come out and say it. Do you follow the sport? It happens all the time but you cant just come out and do it. Thats when they will step in. It goes on in every sport. Its called Business. Does it suck? Yes. Do I like it? No. Would I do it? Yes.

 

[Bullard Anderson]

Steve, are you willing to admit all the others who have done it over the years and say the same about them or is this simply an opportunistic jab at Force? Let's be honest with ourselves. This isn't the first dive, first arguement, first NHRA rule questioned and/or first team to be involved.

I am willing to admit that if I paid my $300 in tickets, travel, and food and Don Schumacher told my driver to lay down in any round I would ask to be reimbursed. And then I would find something else to do.

And I admit Bobby that this has happened many times in the past with all teams. All I can do as a fan is voice my displeasure and hope it ends.

 

[FC138fan]

I liked how in Tony's last interview he said (with a smile on his face) he was suprised him and Cruz were the only drivers crying foul.

It takes some major kahones to speak out against the most popular guy in the sport, probably knowing millions of fans will support Force no matter what his decisions are/were - right or wrong.

I'm now a huge Pedgregon Brothers fan! Love the birth of a new Hofmann / Force of the 90's type rivalry.

 

[Lori]

For the love of god people, he cant just come out and say it. Do you follow the sport? It happens all the time but you cant just come out and do it. Thats when they will step in. It goes on in every sport. Its called Business. Does it suck? Yes. Do I like it? No. Would I do it? Yes.

Yep, I follow this sport very closely and knew when they were paired up who was going to win.
My point was, Justin, he shouldn't have denied he did it by giving that stupid interview and lame excuse after the fact. I am not here to say whether it was right or wrong, but he could have had a statement ready that wasn't a lie. I don't have a lot of regard for dishonest people. Just say 'Hey, I am the team owner and I make the calls' or something like that.
It does suck, I don't like it , and I can't comment on whether I would do it or not because I am not in his shoes. I just know that I was irritated how the interview (pre-fight) went off and chose to not watch it any longer. That is how I feel. If that makes me look like naieve or a fool to you, than that is ok. At least you are being honest.
Carry on...........

 

[Jenn]

My point was, Justin, he shouldn't have denied he did it by giving that stupid interview and lame excuse after the fact.

Had he denied it, he'd have been in direct violation of the NHRA rule, as opposed to this indirect grey area that we have now.

I really don't care that he dived or not. He's the owner, his choice, it's his driver and it's him that has to wake up and look in the mirror and say "I made the right decision for the right reasons".

Sometimes you gotta see the forrest for the trees.

 

[Bubba]

A pretty extensive 'Tube of the whole incident including the Dunn pre-race commentary can be found at YouTube - John Force a Cheater? (You Decide) U.S. Nationals 2009

Probably won't be posted all week due to NHRA copyright so view it while you can.

Regards
PiPPi
HarleyDrags.com

John's behaviour was unacceptable. He should be fined and/or suspended. You DO NOT, repeat, DO NOT shove an official EVER.

There’s no question team orders exist. Don't lie to the fans, we’re not stupid.

 

[Bubba]

All this talk of "fine them" and suspentions....for what.?? Two guys had a shouting match - nothing more. Neither Tony or John put their hands on each other. The only contact was the officials in the black & white shirt & the guy in the red shirt that kept grabing John and draging him away. FINE THEM

That's ridiculous. By that logic, the NHL referees should get penalties for preventing hockey fights.

 

[Bullard Anderson]

I liked how in Tony's last interview he said (with a smile on his face) he was suprised him and Cruz were the only drivers crying foul.

It takes some major kahones to speak out against the most popular guy in the sport, probably knowing millions of fans will support Force no matter what his decisions are/were - right or wrong.

I'm now a huge Pedgregon Brothers fan! Love the birth of a new Hofmann / Force of the 90's type rivalry.

I agree Nick! Things were pretty hectic late Sunday. I'm sure ESPN will do a lot of preproduction with drivers and opinions before Charlotte/ZMax.

 

[Lori]

Had he denied it, he'd have been in direct violation of the NHRA rule, as opposed to this indirect grey area that we have now.

I really don't care that he dived or not. He's the owner, his choice, it's his driver and it's him that has to wake up and look in the mirror and say "I made the right decision for the right reasons".

Sometimes you gotta see the forrest for the trees.

I understand what you are saying.
That is all he had to say to the camera, that he loves to talk to every single race telecast...
"I made the right decisions for my team" as the owner.
I still don't like it, but I am not in his shoes.
Never mind, I give up.....

 

[ColeCoonce]

With all the finger-pointing, I thought this image might be appropriate. (Taken a couple of years ago at Pomona.)

(photo by Cole Coonce)

 

[my friends call me Zappy]

That's ridiculous. By that logic, the NHL referees should get penalties for preventing hockey fights.

Ridiculous?? Many on this thread are calling for Tony, or John, or BOTH to be fined. They never touched each other. Why fine them just for a verbal argument???? Thats ridiculous.

 

[force fan]

With all the finger-pointing, I thought this image might be appropriate. (Taken a couple of years ago at Pomona.)

(photo by Cole Coonce)

Love this pic, it is now my screensaver!!!!!!!