DRO recognizes season long champions (2 Viewers)

[Smiley]

To reference the original post...

I commend DRO for doing what they feel is right, as much as I commend PJ for taking a stand and doing what he feels he has to do (The Petition). Just like Rex and Paul are doing their part to support "The Countdown".
This country was founded on people thinking outside the box and going against the grain for what they believed in, sometimes they got what they wanted, sometimes they didn't. The main thing is THEY ALL TRIED.
I refuse to judge someone personally on what they think of "The Countdown", opinions are like a--holes, everybody has one - some are louder than others. Perhaps a more contructive debate about each others opinions would be better for all of us and would keep this from getting personal. We can all agree to disagree.

A couple of observations I would like to make with regards to the ongoing dispute of "The Countdown"

1. Test Mode- Several drivers (GA, RC, etc) admitted going into "test mode" once thier berth into the countdown was locked. Now this was either a intelligent way of using the rules of the game to gain some ground and valuable data for the "playoffs", or a crock and just a cover story for them falling off. Personally, I believe it's the former. With that being said, their "YTD Points" have been skewed due to this testing (and using the rules of them game). In my opinion, DRO recognizing a YTD Champ isn't truly a representation of what may have been.

2. The format- I think with some fine tuning "The Countdown" could work. The big difference between "The Chase" and "The Countdown" is that once "The Countdown" is limited to 8 cars, there is no guarentee that those 8 cars are going to race each other at any point during the remainder of the season. "The Chase" pretty much has the final 10 cars on the track all at once, which seems to work better.
Perhaps a seperate eliminator for the final 8, 4 and 2 would be best and would let them race for the championship and get the media coverage they deserve (they seem to be the only one's getting it now anyway). Let the remainder of the field run for non countdown points and money, or run them all down and then let the Countdown car race the non countdown car for the Wally. This would also do alot to eliminate the "blocker" cars and "dives" from becoming an issue, even if the cars met in the final, "The Countdown" points would already be settled for the day and they can just outright race for the Wally.


I prefer the system the old way, hell I even signed PJs petition, however "The Countdown" is now and can't be taken back this year. Maybe with some changes "The Countdown version 2.0" it could be a better system next year, maybe not. I guess time will tell.

 

[Rexfiles]

And .............I mean..........wow..........what a Major unbelievable shock the DRO poll is.....................

An internet poll that was probably answered by folks that populate internet forums.......well.........not even probably, absolutely.

As far as the countdown in the beginning I decided I would wait before judgement.

When I saw all the immediate appoplexy over it I started to think that there must be something right about it.......the masses are usually quite wrong.

It has been blamed for everything from a-z and everything in between that has cropped up this season.

It has been tied to being the cause of totally erronious rumors;

Alky cars no longer at national events............Why?

The Countdown of course!!!!

Of course the rumor was BS.

Kalitta Boycotting the last two races.............Why?

The countdown of course!!!!!!!!!!!!

Again?...............BS.

OK............80% of the entire world hates it.

So what.

Even if It WAS a good idea for the sport those against will never admit it, once a mind is prematurely made up it is virtually impossible to change it.

If the countdown tanks, I'll be the first to say farewell if and when it goes.

But we have no proof yet.

Meerly opinions.

REX

 

[Rexfiles]

I do not know how many have read this, but I came across it on ESPN online

:http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?series=8&id=3059018

Sums up why I (as in me....)

Prefer the new format over the old.

REX

 

[PJ]

I generally like Stephens but this collumn is way off base and appears to be misrepresenting the facts. He questions Fuller seasons by saying "In Top Fuel, No. 2 seed Hot Rod Fuller has won only twice so far in 2007 and picked up five first-round losses along the way. Would he be within striking distance of his first POWERade championship in the pre-Countdown era? "

He then says about Capps "In Funny Car, Ron Capps began '07 with a string of steady performances, but stumbled into a second-half tailspin, which has seen him drop seven first-round matchups in the last 12 races while failing to score a national event win since St. Louis in May. Would he be too far back in the points by now under the prior championship package to have a shot at his first Funny Car crown?"

He knows under the old points system that both of these guys would be in in first place yet he makes it sound like they only have a chance now beacause of the countdown. Thats not right or true???

 

[PJ]

I love how some complain about the people who complain, isn't that complaining Could we then complain about the people who complain about complainers?


I do believe people can change things. If as a mass group people turn away from drag racing then maybe nhra will reverse this. I believe that would hurt the sport even more though. Sponsors seeing people leave will in turn leave and may not return if and when the people do. I prefer a first step to be protesting, making nhra and powerade aware of the general dislike of the countdown. Are the odds against us, yes, but I prefer to at least make the attempt.

A common statement by countdown lovers seems to be if we don't like it leave. Lets say we did that, countdown haters just stop watching and don't go to the track. Do you really think that enough new fans have been brought into the fold to make up for losing us? If you want nhra drag racing to survive you don't really want us to go. You need us...or more importantly our money and our eyes watching the telecast to help with ratings. Ideally you would just rather censor us and have us shut up. I can't do that. If something is wrong I have to say so, if something is broke I want to fix it. I want nhra to be a strong, prosperous organization. Hell I would love to get a call from Glendora to help change things (yeah I know fat chance lol).

Lets say Capps doesn't win the title this year, yet under the old system would have. I would feel guilty to say, well yes you scored 100 more points then anyone else, but see I have to be entertained and that is why you have to lose. Funny thing is going into vegas under the old system, these races would still be up for grabs, however people would have more faith in it.

Now its the year of the asterisks

 

[Rajunz]

........................if anyone but, fuller, capps and anderson win , its a farce!

How can you write this Jeff. Once again, go look at the numbers. Fuller, Capps, Smith and especially Anderson are all in a position to lose the Championships, even under the old system. Dixon and Hines would have the hardest shot at it, Hight only needs 3 rounds and some qualifying positions, and Connolly is less than 2 rounds out of it.................

Everyone is acting like some of these guys backed into this deal, but of all 4 classes, every driver that made the final 4 would still be there except for Lewellyn................it would have been Angelle.

 

[Rexfiles]

I love how some complain about the people who complain, isn't that complaining Could we then complain about the people who complain about complainers?


I do believe people can change things. If as a mass group people turn away from drag racing then maybe nhra will reverse this. I believe that would hurt the sport even more though. Sponsors seeing people leave will in turn leave and may not return if and when the people do. I prefer a first step to be protesting, making nhra and powerade aware of the general dislike of the countdown. Are the odds against us, yes, but I prefer to at least make the attempt.

A common statement by countdown lovers seems to be if we don't like it leave. Lets say we did that, countdown haters just stop watching and don't go to the track. Do you really think that enough new fans have been brought into the fold to make up for losing us? If you want nhra drag racing to survive you don't really want us to go. You need us...or more importantly our money and our eyes watching the telecast to help with ratings. Ideally you would just rather censor us and have us shut up. I can't do that. If something is wrong I have to say so, if something is broke I want to fix it. I want nhra to be a strong, prosperous organization. Hell I would love to get a call from Glendora to help change things (yeah I know fat chance lol).

Lets say Capps doesn't win the title this year, yet under the old system would have. I would feel guilty to say, well yes you scored 100 more points then anyone else, but see I have to be entertained and that is why you have to lose. Funny thing is going into vegas under the old system, these races would still be up for grabs, however people would have more faith in it.

Now its the year of the asterisks

to paraphrase Sylvester Stallone in First Blood........"You drew First Whine"

Complain all ya' want.

You can try whatever you want.

It's a free country.........you are free to try to change things,

I am also free to block your path if I can.

I only get stronger with resistance

REX

 

[Rajunz]

Let's go back to this BS contest that is really the heart of this thread. Matt Smith is getting screwed, if you took his points total and divide it by the number of races that he's raced you get an average of 81 points per race. Add it all up and he would have 1707 points, right in the running for this condo.

They really need to make this right for him, or don't bother having this BS contest in the first place.
It's not fair I tell you, it's not fair!

 

[blackbeard]

excellent post!!!!!!!!! it seems this fake countdown crap is playing right into dsr hand. 12 1st rd losses and you know thell probaby win the last 2 and win it all again if anyone but, fuller, capps and anderson win , its a farce!

yeah anderson deserves the championship because connolly got "lucky" five times in a row

 

[Rexfiles]

I love how some complain about the people who complain, isn't that complaining Could we then complain about the people who complain about complainers?


I do believe people can change things. If as a mass group people turn away from drag racing then maybe nhra will reverse this. I believe that would hurt the sport even more though. Sponsors seeing people leave will in turn leave and may not return if and when the people do. I prefer a first step to be protesting, making nhra and powerade aware of the general dislike of the countdown. Are the odds against us, yes, but I prefer to at least make the attempt.

A common statement by countdown lovers seems to be if we don't like it leave. Lets say we did that, countdown haters just stop watching and don't go to the track. Do you really think that enough new fans have been brought into the fold to make up for losing us? If you want nhra drag racing to survive you don't really want us to go. You need us...or more importantly our money and our eyes watching the telecast to help with ratings. Ideally you would just rather censor us and have us shut up. I can't do that. If something is wrong I have to say so, if something is broke I want to fix it. I want nhra to be a strong, prosperous organization. Hell I would love to get a call from Glendora to help change things (yeah I know fat chance lol).

Lets say Capps doesn't win the title this year, yet under the old system would have. I would feel guilty to say, well yes you scored 100 more points then anyone else, but see I have to be entertained and that is why you have to lose. Funny thing is going into vegas under the old system, these races would still be up for grabs, however people would have more faith in it.

Now its the year of the asterisks

So far your "Mass group" is represented by what?? 1557 people? (your petition) and that has accumulated over one year.

I'll hand it to you for the sake of trying.......but sorry........ya' ain't got the muscle that you need.

And I know several of my freinds and aquaintances that like the format because it is no longer a lock that pure $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ will win the title any longer.

And yes Virginia, it is ALLLLLLL about the MONEY!!!!

The richest teams can afford the best of everything..........and I do mean everything.

I applaud their success........I am a capitalist through and through, but the rest out there work as hard or even harder to get where they are.

Besides........all the top tier teams are still there.......Luigi Novelli (sorry Luigi) has not been vaulted to the top overnight.

If that were the case I would start a petition.

This is mixing it up and stirring the pot.

And if at the end of the day........GA, Fuller, Capps and Smith.......who are still in the running.........win..........What will we have to gripe about then

REX

 

[sdwarf36]

Personally, I watch the races one event at a time. The quickest 16 still get in the field-2 cars still stage at the same time-and the event winner is the guy (or gal) that wins the last round. NHRA can add it up anyway they want. Just pretend Vegas II is Vegas I---and turn away from the tv when Dunn+ Page start with the "if the season ended now" crap.

 

[Paul]

I do believe people can change things. If as a mass group people turn away from drag racing then maybe nhra will reverse this. I believe that would hurt the sport even more though. Sponsors seeing people leave will in turn leave and may not return if and when the people do. I prefer a first step to be protesting, making nhra and powerade aware of the general dislike of the countdown. Are the odds against us, yes, but I prefer to at least make the attempt.

You did try to do something to stop the Countdown and you failed with your petition. If so many people are against the Countdown, like you and others have said, then more people would have signed the petition and tried to make a difference. The 1556 people who signed your petition out of all the people who attend and watch the races each year is very small and probably gets covered up in the rounding of the numbers. Here again I am providing some facts, while you speculate with your asterisk statement because there will be no asterisks in the record books that count.

 

[PJ]

You are right the petition did not get the names it needed. I blame myself for not being able to get it out to a larger audience. Media outlets (save comp plus and espn.com) did not pick it up. Local media in places where nhra goes could care less, national media outlets wouldn't budge. Name people who do support it can't publicly and I understand the politics behind that. My hope was that someone else, bigger and more connected, would take it and run. Imagine if Dunn mentioned it on air, do you think the numbers would jump drastically? I do. Judging from what I've heard while at the races, nationals events as well as local, more are against it than for it.

As a side note, just so I'm clear its ok to use the internet to knock the petition numbers but when people point to internet polls stating that roughly 70-80% of people are against it, we can't count those numbers?????

While the nhra record books will count whomever wins this year as the champs. Depending on how it shakes out many people will consider it the asterisks or the fake or however you want to word it. Barry Bonds is in the record books as the all time home run champ....but we all know the public opinion on him and the record.
no I am not equating the countdown to steroid use, just how public opinion and perception play a role. The countdown has cheapen the championship.

 

[megadeth]

You did try to do something to stop the Countdown and you failed with your petition. If so many people are against the Countdown, like you and others have said, then more people would have signed the petition and tried to make a difference. The 1556 people who signed your petition out of all the people who attend and watch the races each year is very small and probably gets covered up in the rounding of the numbers. Here again I am providing some facts, while you speculate with your asterisk statement because there will be no asterisks in the record books that count.

Drag racings fan base is minute to the rest of motorsports.
That is why they have to pay to get air time instead of the other way around!

 

[Paul]

As a side note, just so I'm clear its ok to use the internet to knock the petition numbers but when people point to internet polls stating that roughly 70-80% of people are against it, we can't count those numbers?????

How many people voted in those polls? The most votes I have seen in one of those polls is 1700 so if you back out the 20% who like the Countdown, you are back down to the level of support of your petition. So, to answer your question, you can count those numbers because they are the same exact people who are in your petition. Like I said prior, the total number of people who support your view is a fraction of the total fan base. Again, here are some more facts to support my view while you continue to speculate what everyone thinks about the Countdown. I would recommend you trying to get some hard facts to support your views.

 

[PJ]

I could explain polling and sampling mathematics but why. You choose to believe out of everybody in the world, or at least drag racing world, only 1546of us are aginst the countdown. I think you are smarter than that.

 

[Ma Green]

Aside from the fact that I've hated the Countdown since its inception, I've spoken to quite a few crew chiefs, drivers, and crew members this year. Not one of them likes the new system.

For the past several years, Ron Capps has been so close and worked so hard for the Championship. It will be criminal if, even though he has the points lead (under the old system), he is once again denied the crown.

BTW, did anyone else realize that the final payout is down to 8, from 10. And, unlike previous years, there's no chance to move up after you've missed the final 8 or 4. To me, that in its self, is one reason to dislike the new system.

 

[Paul]

I could explain polling and sampling mathematics but why. You choose to believe out of everybody in the world, or at least drag racing world, only 1546of us are aginst the countdown. I think you are smarter than that.

I think the 1500 people who signed the petition are the ones who cared enough to speak up. I think the other people who are currently not totally in favor of the Countdown are sitting back and waiting to see how the chase pans out before saying it is bad for the sport. I think you will agree, all of the polls are sampling the same diehard fans. I am pretty sure the poll results will be different if you poll average fans. My father is not a fan of the Countdown, but he is starting to like the excitement the Countdown is bringing to the back half of the season and is starting to say some good things about the Countdown. Hell, he was praising the Countdown before Indy because Force was back into realistic title contention.

 

[PJ]

Look at this we agree lol

The polls at racing websites are the die hard fans. If done at the races, based on what I've seen, the haters would go down some, the lovers wouldn't move to much but those who could care less would rise a bunch.

 

[JAG]

The one thing I find funny is....PJ predicted when this whole countdown thing started about NHRA's involvement with WWE...Now, who is it that's the Grand Marshal at Las Vegas? lol