What is your idea of a Strong NHRA? (3 Viewers)

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People said many of the same things about the telephone, and radio, and talking movies, and color tv, and the internet, and ... You have to go where the people are if you want to be seen at all.

By the way, that "mass exodus" from Facebook was a 3% drop...

I get it. You're trying to make it look like I'm not seeing the future. I totally get why the internet works, why a telephone works, why a radio works. Social media is none of those. Social Media is akin to a smaller phone (remember those? Before they got bigger again renamed 'smart phones'?). It's a Walkman radio (did anyone actually buy one of those?) It's a version of, not the actual invention.

I won't get into a pissing contest as to who knows more about computers. I am not saying we shouldn't promote racing. That's just silly talk. I'm saying we shouldn't change the product to better suit an ever-changing audience. If your product is good, people will want to come see it. If people come to see it, advertisers will want to display their stuff there. Chasing a crowd of people around begging for a wolf-whistle isn't a pretty sight in my mind. I am not a fool, and think the advertisers can go play in the mud all they want, but the racing should stay, well, racing.

As for people's belief in social media, allow me to quote two sources who aren't me.

My "fickled" case...

Piper Jaffray Study -
A study by Piper Jaffray found Twitter was eclipsing Facebook as the favorite social network of the teen demographic. Just a year ago, 42% of teens surveyed told pollsters they preferred Facebook to all other services; by spring, that had fallen to 33%, and now (Oct 2013) stands at 23%.

My "short term" case...

Princeton University Study -

"Facebook will lose 80 percent of its users in three years, a study paper from Princeton University has claimed, comparing the social network to the spread of "infectious disease" in humans.

The study by the university's Department of Mechanical and Aerospace Engineering claimed that the demise of Facebook will happen due to an aggressive decline in its user base between 2015 and 2017. The report used Myspace as an example of how adoption and abandonment of social media can mimic the spread of disease.

Like Myspace, which was founded in 2003, peaked in 2008 and died by 2011, Facebook will crash and burn due to loss of interest shown between social media users and eventually, their peers, the study claimed.

"Ideas, like diseases, have been shown to spread infectiously between people before eventually dying out, and have been successfully described with epidemiological models," the researchers wrote in their paper, entitled "Epidemiological modelling of online social network dynamics".

"Ideas are spread through communicative contact between different people who share ideas with each other. Idea manifesters ultimately lose interest with the idea and no longer manifest the idea, which can be thought of as the gain of 'immunity' to the idea."

According to the study, Facebook has already "reached the peak of its popularity" and its numbers are in decline, which can be seen by its slump in search frequency after 2012.

The report concluded that as users start jumping the Facebook ship, "recovery" will spread infectiously, meaning that others will soon follow suit after their friends have decided they've had enough."
 
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Thanks for helping with the clarity and for helping with my point. It use to be that a Rulebook came with membership
This is filled with misinformation.

A) the first ones were $200, but many vendors offer them (even the people who sold them at that price) for about $60 now. Hardly a huge expense.
B) the welding option was always part of the rule, from day one. Note, collectors are rarely welded on these days.
C) the change lately was in response to full-bodied full-muffler car owners' complaints. I like that they responded.

Do I like them? No, they look like add-ons. But I also understand people get maimed every year because of collectors coming off. So I have them.

Thanks for clearing this up and helping me make my point. There has been several times when NHRA has made a rule change only to later and change it back.

Another example mounting plates instead of struts for wings mounted behind the driver in a dragster or altered. Now it not applicable until 2015. But my question is how do you adjust the wing for down force?

How about another more popular example. Tethering the bodies on funny cars.
 
I won't get into a pissing contest as to who knows more about computers.
Oh please do! I'd pay money to see that! While I have some knowledge of Chris's pedigree, I know yours much better. I think that would be very entertaining! (my money would be on you...)

Princeton University Study -
"Facebook will lose 80 percent of its users in three years, a study paper from Princeton University has claimed, comparing the social network to the spread of "infectious disease" in humans.
Ivy League School children don't live in the real world. Their world view is that of "I knew about that before it was cool. Now that it is cool, it isn't cool because too many other people like it". I'll bet you a case of beer that the Princeton study proves to be dead wrong.
 
Some points:
  • When I'm looking for information on what's hot, perhaps the last places I turn are a stockbroker or princeton.
  • Lots of people made a lot of money leveraging MySpace. Not investing in it, using it to reach people. Then they moved on. To Facebook. And Twitter. Soon, who knows.
  • Facebook, with "no product" just bought another "no product" company for more than the market cap of Gap, Best Buy, Conagra, and several other "product" companies. Out of petty cash.
  • Facebook and Twitter aren't THE world of social media, just examples of how you reach people today.
  • Remember Vine? The six-second video tool that was scalding hot a year ago? Was any entertainment more suited for it than NHRA? The only Vine I ever saw posted on NHRA's account was two people sitting in a golf cart. Lost opportunity.
  • Wally fully understood reaching out -- one of the first things he did was create National Dragster. Remember magazines? They used to be the social media of the late 20th century. Maybe you've seen one.
  • I don't believe anyone is lobbying to change drag racing into Facebook, or whatever you think that means. Just to leverage all forms of media better, social and otherwise.
  • We are having this discussion on a form of social media. See, even works for old farts like us.
The key points: Go where the people are. Stay flexible.
 
Being my personal view, I'll have to say they need to just drop the "get a new crowd" stuff. I'm not saying getting the next generation into the sport isn't important, I'm saying, don't cater to them. Here's our sport, like it? Great! Here's cheaper tickets for you and your college friends to attend and have fun. Don't like it? Cool, but don't expect us to plop a few rappers into a Escalade with spinner wheels for your enjoyment.

Gotta admit I love this! But some of the other comments are just more whining or complaints! Same old....
 
was kidding Kev but no joke whites hav to b so careful now of wat we say cause the liberal medial and brothers will call us racist that's their only excuse now, most of the drivers in the pro ranks I culd care less 4,, me its bout the machines and racing, hell I catch my self watching
lawnmower racing or bar-stool racing at times
 
FWIW, Wally insisted that "cars are the stars". In fact, one issue Bob Frey had in developing his comprehensive spreadsheets of every lap of pro racing was that in the early years, the cars were listed as winners, not the drivers. He had to interview people and do a bunch of research to find out who was piloting the car in many cases.
 
If Tom Compton was really doing his job properly he would have the brain trust behind him to take some of the pressure he supposedly facing. Sure he has decisions to make every day and they have to be correct, and they should be about making NHRA better. I think he has been is this position to long and is lacking the drive to take it to the next level, he's wore out.
 
I'm still trying to figure out where all the hate is for trying to attract people under 60 50 40 30. I have been to a huge number of NHRA races in the last 40 years and I'm quite sure I've never seen an Escalade with spinners on it going down the track. (Lately, I'm sure that's because Escalades stopped being the "it" car about 10 years ago, and it's been nearly that long since you've been able to buy spinners...)

But I digress... I don't know if any of you have looked around at a drag race, but the crowd is decidedly gray. More dirty gray pony tails (on the men) than you can count. And precious few younger people. Is that because they don't like cars? Heck no. The Fast and Furious franchise, the street racing shows, the huge crowds at heads-up races in the east, the rich ricer aftermarket all prove quite the contrary. But NHRA chased off the cars they like, and the crowd like this one on here hardly welcomes them.

We don't have to change drag racing to create a bigger tent. There are well over 200 different class designations in NHRA racing, why not add a couple dozen more for the front-wheel drive crowd? Why not welcome them in to compete with/near/against all the cars you grew up with? Because they don't have a V8? Because you don't understand it? Bahhh... We lived through the 1980s with probably some of the ugliest pro stock cars in the history of the world. We can live through someone with a pretty darn fast Supra.

No, we don't have to chase NASCAR with every move. Yes, we can and should be more creative. But other than the countdown, I'm at a loss to understand where all the hate is coming from. How exactly has drag racing been bent -- in even the slightest way -- for the younger crowd to so "ruin it" for all you haters? On the contrary, seems like it's done its very best to chase them away.

In sum, let's remember the definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.
 
I'm still trying to figure out where all the hate is for trying to attract people under 60 50 40 30. I have been to a huge number of NHRA races in the last 40 years and I'm quite sure I've never seen an Escalade with spinners on it going down the track. (Lately, I'm sure that's because Escalades stopped being the "it" car about 10 years ago, and it's been nearly that long since you've been able to buy spinners...)

But I digress... I don't know if any of you have looked around at a drag race, but the crowd is decidedly gray. More dirty gray pony tails (on the men) than you can count. And precious few younger people. Is that because they don't like cars? Heck no. The Fast and Furious franchise, the street racing shows, the huge crowds at heads-up races in the east, the rich ricer aftermarket all prove quite the contrary. But NHRA chased off the cars they like, and the crowd like this one on here hardly welcomes them.

We don't have to change drag racing to create a bigger tent. There are well over 200 different class designations in NHRA racing, why not add a couple dozen more for the front-wheel drive crowd? Why not welcome them in to compete with/near/against all the cars you grew up with? Because they don't have a V8? Because you don't understand it? Bahhh... We lived through the 1980s with probably some of the ugliest pro stock cars in the history of the world. We can live through someone with a pretty darn fast Supra.

No, we don't have to chase NASCAR with every move. Yes, we can and should be more creative. But other than the countdown, I'm at a loss to understand where all the hate is coming from. How exactly has drag racing been bent -- in even the slightest way -- for the younger crowd to so "ruin it" for all you haters? On the contrary, seems like it's done its very best to chase them away.

In sum, let's remember the definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

Post of the year candidate!
 
Spot on Christopher ... As I said in one of the myriad threads on this subject, if I was 25 years old I would build a drift car. Car costs about the same as a decent drag car, you get way more seat time (bang for the buck) and you aren't treated like a second class citizen or out-right ignored like you would be at a drag strip. At a VegasDrift event in the middle of January, they had 49 cars show up (going for 16 spots). Think NHRA/The Strip at LVMS would like to have 49 more full time drag racers, most under the age of 30? Almost all of whom are very active in social media (particularly Instagram and Twitter) and posting multiple GoPro vids on their own website and YouTube?

As for the original question, what constitutes a strong NHRA is full grandstands and a high car count in the pro categories. Everything else will fall in line when/if we get back to that 2 part formula.
 
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First thing that needs to happen is hostile and need be violent takeover to return the voting rights to the members. Second the removal of Compton and Light. Third, pay the Baders what ever they want to run the NHRA the right way.
 
I'm still trying to figure out where all the hate is for trying to attract people under 60 50 40 30. I have been to a huge number of NHRA races in the last 40 years and I'm quite sure I've never seen an Escalade with spinners on it going down the track. (Lately, I'm sure that's because Escalades stopped being the "it" car about 10 years ago, and it's been nearly that long since you've been able to buy spinners...)

But I digress... I don't know if any of you have looked around at a drag race, but the crowd is decidedly gray. More dirty gray pony tails (on the men) than you can count. And precious few younger people. Is that because they don't like cars? Heck no. The Fast and Furious franchise, the street racing shows, the huge crowds at heads-up races in the east, the rich ricer aftermarket all prove quite the contrary. But NHRA chased off the cars they like, and the crowd like this one on here hardly welcomes them.

We don't have to change drag racing to create a bigger tent. There are well over 200 different class designations in NHRA racing, why not add a couple dozen more for the front-wheel drive crowd? Why not welcome them in to compete with/near/against all the cars you grew up with? Because they don't have a V8? Because you don't understand it? Bahhh... We lived through the 1980s with probably some of the ugliest pro stock cars in the history of the world. We can live through someone with a pretty darn fast Supra.

No, we don't have to chase NASCAR with every move. Yes, we can and should be more creative. But other than the countdown, I'm at a loss to understand where all the hate is coming from. How exactly has drag racing been bent -- in even the slightest way -- for the younger crowd to so "ruin it" for all you haters? On the contrary, seems like it's done its very best to chase them away.

In sum, let's remember the definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

I have been to 6 NASCAR races, and I don't see the huge until 25 year old Demo everyone talks about! I see an awful lot of 40-65 year olds!
 
great one John,, NHRA members shuld vote these guys out,
There is not enough back bone to challenge them, when you see Force, Jeg, and other racers with big smiles on there faces when standing on podium with them, but how do they really feel. They know this is all they have and are just trying to get along. To change NHRA it's going to take some sacrifice.
Back in seventies you had more leverage with AHRA and IHRA being strong organizations.
 
I'm still trying to figure out where all the hate is for trying to attract people under 60 50 40 30. I have been to a huge number of NHRA races in the last 40 years and I'm quite sure I've never seen an Escalade with spinners on it going down the track. (Lately, I'm sure that's because Escalades stopped being the "it" car about 10 years ago, and it's been nearly that long since you've been able to buy spinners...).

I'll say it again. I'm not against getting the next generation into drag racing, I'm saying here it is, this is what we do, like it? Fantastic! Oh, you don't? Well sorry, I'm not going to make it look like a cute little Anime figurine so you'll walk through the gate.

The Escalade and Spinners? I know the audience I speak to. Somehow, a Land Rover with all but two seats being amplifiers didn't have the same impact.

But NHRA chased off the cars they like, and the crowd like this one on here hardly welcomes them.

Nah, they didn't chase them off, they let them play on their tracks, and they died of their own accord. The kids lost interest in it not because the NHRA didn't embrace them, but because they are kids, and they moved on to the next "thing" where girls do topless dancing and the pits looked more like a concert was happening rather than a race was happening. The real answer was that most the high-performance was front wheel drive monstrosities. You call the pro stockers from the 80's ugly (they looked like the cars they actually were)? You failed to mention just how un-tasty a car with giant slicks on the front wheels and little wagon wheels on the back look. That's what killed their interest. Cool quickly moved on. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there's nothing to prevent those cars from entering an NHRA race, right? A Supra can still race, a FWD can still race, they just need to conform to a certain class...but they don't.


How exactly has drag racing been bent -- in even the slightest way -- for the younger crowd to so "ruin it" for all you haters? On the contrary, seems like it's done its very best to chase them away.

In sum, let's remember the definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

How exactly? Take your average televised run of two cars. I don't get the feeling I'm about to watch two vehicles that could pull the foundation from underneath the Empire State Building, I get the feeling I'm watching two cars about to throw a baseball. I learn more about a person's twitter habits and the color of their drapes at home than the car they are driving. I guess we speak of two different things. You speak of retaining the NHRA's claim to be the largest sanctioning body (through membership and car turn-out), and I speak of the Pro ranks that most all people go to see. The average spectator. Yes, the average spectator has gotten older, but it's drag racing. If they've failed to entice people to experience the thrill that could be, it's because they've changed it....the formula. When I say they shouldn't morph the deal, I mean they should leave it to the racing, and not glop on all that frosting that is the drama that "kids" seem to like. And they have done exactly that. Television should serve to showcase the sport and entice folks that have never experienced to go to the track and try it. What they're doing right now is simply giving them every reason to forego that experience, and just enjoy the spectacle of the Facebook version of drag racing.

Honest, I have nothing against seeing a 4-banger beat the hell out of a muscle car.

Oh please do! I'd pay money to see that!

If it's a pissing contest, you well know I can do these frequently, at a rate of one contest for every beer (my homage to the itty bitty bladder committee)

While I have some knowledge of Chris's pedigree, I know yours much better. I think that would be very entertaining! (my money would be on you...)


Ivy League School children don't live in the real world. Their world view is that of "I knew about that before it was cool. Now that it is cool, it isn't cool because too many other people like it". I'll bet you a case of beer that the Princeton study proves to be dead wrong.

Oh, you're on Bob-O. My thoughts are that people that love the internet, and the community within (it IS a wonderful thing) will eventually grow tired of being an unwitting host to what has become basically, a parasitic relationship between user and advertisers. This wasn't a bunch of lawyers writing a paper, this was a scientific division, and I have to agree with it. As many people that "tweet" or post to "facebook", their actual audience is no larger a number than if they built their own website, and had their friends visiting them. (Bill Gate's push/pull technology dream will be over) Twitter is just a messenger program without privacy walls. Facebook is just a website generator that offers prebuilt format for users. It's all about convenience. The only people it truly has benefited is the advertisers. No one is listening. Everyone is talking. I'm all for file hosting sites (youtube for videos, tumblr/flickr for photos). I'm not saying there won't be a "next fad", as that's guaranteed. What I'm saying is that once this ease of "sharing" hits it's saturation point (most likely occurred already), it will wane, and the internet will slowly revert to the basics of the user searching for what they want, and finding it without being molested by advertising aimed directly at them because they've been spied on. I know it sounds like I am a technology curmudgeon, but honest, ever since you got me that present of Prodigy, I've known the value of a platform for mass communication between people. It works, that's for sure. But like everything else, there comes a point where no one wants a middle man for a handshake.

My only real point was that racing shouldn't alienate people that just like the racing, simply to go chase these highly unlikely converts to the drags. They know about us. They just don't care. The one's that do, know where to find it.

Someone posted an old Diamond P broadcast next to an old IHRA broadcast. Those two together showed that at that time, during this sports largest growth period, they talked about the cars, not stats, not life away from the strip, not what famous baseball pitcher is taking photos at the track. Compare a run from either of those old broadcasts, to one from Phoenix this weekend. Rieff mentions "big unit" so many times, I wanted to scratch my eyes out, and stats? Oh man, seriously, National events won is a stat. World championships is a stat. Elapsed time is a stat. Reaction times is a stat. Telling me that a driver won this race 3 out of 11 times in the last 12 years, and raced the other guy 3 times and won twice, and that they remind the commentator of that time when that one driver had a 4 out of 11 record (ad nauseam) and this is all while the poor car is backing up from a burnout, I sit here wishing as hard as anyone has ever wished that I could just turn certain audio channels off. I know they are trying to appeal to the baller types, but personally, I can hear channels turning as they speak. Here are two of the loudest, most raucous vehicles anyone has ever seen in the world about to be unleashed, and all I hear is statistics.

Okay. Never mind. I guess I am a curmudgeon. -smile-
 
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