Off season topic: If you had the power to change sportsmen classes or format? (3 Viewers)

[twostep]

People LOVE complaining about the throttle-stop classes, but they serve this purpose well while being good participant classes for sportsman racers. They always fill their quotas, rarely have on-track issues, and wouldn't be replaced by anything more fan-appealing anyway, so what's to be gained by messing with them?

All this would do is push out the few cars showing up who are between those and the current indexes all-out, especially SSt. The only viewing difference is that the cars would be on the stops for less time, but being on the stops at all is the (main) fan issue. The classes would need a complete overhaul to make them more entertaining, although that would do more to kill them entirely than make them more appealing to anybody.

I don't love complaining about them but I sure as hell don't care for them. Doesn't mean I don't love the diversity within the classes and the wonderful, dedicated 'little guys' who compete in them. Doesn't mean I don't love seeing the stripe battles as seen from standing alongside the fence at the stripe watching them. I've been told that primary reason for the stops is there's theory behind a car running 9.90/170mph standing a better chance of a win than a car running 9.90/140mph but I'll be dipped if I understand why other than just the thrill of running a big speed. Neither do I understand why they makes the class more competitive, or more fun, or more appealing. They don't allow the damn things in Comp which is effectively a Super class with a variable and usually quicker index. So let's STOP THE STOP.

But trying to talk a Super class racer down out of a throttle stop tree is akin to groping his wife, perhaps worse, so y'all go right ahead. I'll still sit at the stripe and watch the games. Not that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things anyway.

What would I really like to see at national events regarding sportsmen classes? Figure out a way to give 'em their own day. I've seen people storm out of the stands and head for the pits right after the 330mph runs. But if the nitro cars weren't running that day, people would see just how fascinating those classes are to watch. Dunno about you but to me, a TAFC running 5.40/270 is exciting as hell. And hey, NHRA, how about let's increase the purse for these classes? Those people don't get paid CRAP and for the show they put on, they deserve it.

 

[ZWeinstein]

What would I really like to see at national events regarding sportsmen classes? Figure out a way to give 'em their own day. I've seen people storm out of the stands and head for the pits right after the 330mph runs. But if the nitro cars weren't running that day, people would see just how fascinating those classes are to watch. Dunno about you but to me, a TAFC running 5.40/270 is exciting as hell.

Unfortunately if there are no nitro cars, the crowds do not seem to pack the place. Firebird put on a regional race with Alky cars back in October along with a bracket race, a few nostalgia cars testing and Winefsky family making a squirt in the big show car and not a lot of people showed up even though they (the track) really advertised it pretty well. A few years ago when I was shooting a double divisional I had several fans stop me at times and ask "where are the Top Fuel guys". Even in years past when the Divisional race was the week after the Nationals and you could use any ticket from the Nationals to get into the divisional race for free not a lot of people show up.

 

[sammi]

Lose the delay boxes. Tune the car to run the number, leave off the bottom bulb.

 

[Mike]

Mark Jones, CW's car is a true no electronics car. 82 firebird and has none of the factory electronics left on the car. He was No E in Vegas and always is no E

 

[M Jones]

Mark Jones, CW's car is a true no electronics car. 82 firebird and has none of the factory electronics left on the car. He was No E in Vegas and always is no E

Thanks Mike, I have a new favorite driver to add to my list, very impressed

 

[twostep]

Unfortunately if there are no nitro cars, the crowds do not seem to pack the place. Firebird put on a regional race with Alky cars back in October along with a bracket race, a few nostalgia cars testing and Winefsky family making a squirt in the big show car and not a lot of people showed up even though they (the track) really advertised it pretty well. A few years ago when I was shooting a double divisional I had several fans stop me at times and ask "where are the Top Fuel guys". Even in years past when the Divisional race was the week after the Nationals and you could use any ticket from the Nationals to get into the divisional race for free not a lot of people show up.

I know. That's part of the problem and one of the reasons few people have or would consider it.

 

[Marchboom]

Racers will not stop racing if you take away throttle stops. And they will still be racing on the same playing ground.

If you need a throttle stop to make you competitive then you either have to work on your car more to make it quicker or find another hobby.

 

[Mike]

John, when everyone in the class has a tool you dont it makes it very tough. Ed DeStaute was the last man to win a Lucas Championship with a manual stop and that was 2001

 

[Just Paul]

Racers will not stop racing if you take away throttle stops. And they will still be racing on the same playing ground.

If you need a throttle stop to make you competitive then you either have to work on your car more to make it quicker or find another hobby.

Wait, if I’m running an 8.90 super comp car, and using a throttle stop like everybody else…. You want them taken away… Which will naturally make the cars faster… Then I have to “work on my car” to make it run even quicker yet? When I’ll already be too quick?? This post makes zero sense.

 

[Marchboom]

Wait, if I’m running an 8.90 super comp car, and using a throttle stop like everybody else…. You want them taken away… Which will naturally make the cars faster… Then I have to “work on my car” to make it run even quicker yet? When I’ll already be too quick?? This post makes zero sense.

The last time I checked, the whole idea of drag racing is to go quicker. It is not to build a car that can run a specific e.t., and no quicker. How boring is that? If every car has their stop removed then those classes will be much more interesting to watch. Stock and Super Stock are much more interesting to watch.

 

[none]

John, not arguing, just discussing. Yes, most Drag Racing classes are about performance. But if you told the Super Comp class take off the stops and run flat out, it would be Top Dragster. And not everyone who wants to race can afford a car that will run 6.0.

Pure Drag Race mentality. TD came about because there were guys who wanted to bracket race without the throttle stop. Mostly the big dollar racers that wanted a shot at a Wally.
NHRA said OK.
Then they wanted power adders.
NHRA said OK.
Then the guys with money all built TADs for bracket competition.
Then they had to be told that you can't run in the 5's.
It is now very common for a bump to be 6.50 or better and the guys who wanted the class in the first place (those big dollar braclet racers) most who run 7.0 to 7.50 think NHRA should do something. When what NHRA did was give them what they asked for.

And how often do you see one of those 6.0 cars at the Flings? Next to never.

We have classes for people to compete without having a million dollar budget to do so.

I know a guy a few years back who raced TD and won at his home track. A BIG DEAL for him, friends and family that don't come to weekend bracket events came to the Nationals and got to see him win. The next year he didn't enter. I asked why? and he said he couldn't qualify, he has a 7.40 car and he looked at the entry list and figured the bump would be 6.80 something. I think a guy like that needs a class to comptete in. If he supports the track all year, there should be a place for him when the big show comes to town.

If you're not a fan of the .90 classes, then grab a burger or a t-shirt while they run. But don't ban them from competition.

Strictly my opinion.
Alan

 

[DG]

John, not arguing, just discussing. Yes, most Drag Racing classes are about performance. But if you told the Super Comp class take off the stops and run flat out, it would be Top Dragster. And not everyone who wants to race can afford a car that will run 6.0.

Pure Drag Race mentality. TD came about because there were guys who wanted to bracket race without the throttle stop. Mostly the big dollar racers that wanted a shot at a Wally.
NHRA said OK.
Then they wanted power adders.
NHRA said OK.
Then the guys with money all built TADs for bracket competition.
Then they had to be told that you can't run in the 5's.
It is now very common for a bump to be 6.50 or better and the guys who wanted the class in the first place (those big dollar braclet racers) most who run 7.0 to 7.50 think NHRA should do something. When what NHRA did was give them what they asked for.

And how often do you see one of those 6.0 cars at the Flings? Next to never.

We have classes for people to compete without having a million dollar budget to do so.

I know a guy a few years back who raced TD and won at his home track. A BIG DEAL for him, friends and family that don't come to weekend bracket events came to the Nationals and got to see him win. The next year he didn't enter. I asked why? and he said he couldn't qualify, he has a 7.40 car and he looked at the entry list and figured the bump would be 6.80 something. I think a guy like that needs a class to comptete in. If he supports the track all year, there should be a place for him when the big show comes to town.

If you're not a fan of the .90 classes, then grab a burger or a t-shirt while they run. But don't ban them from competition.

Strictly my opinion.
Alan

In Div. 7, we had a 7.90 "Super" class before Top Dragster came along for those that wanted to "Go Faster".

No National events, but usually a good turn out.

We ran a 409 ci Buick/Dart small block and had fun until moving up to Top Dragster!

 

[Mike]

Dave, dont forget that before the 7.90 Super E there was Top Gas West.

 

[Nappy]

You don't have to make the classes with the throttle stops with lower ET for the classes, keep them the same (8.90, 9.90 etc ). It would just require tuning them to keep from breaking out ! That could possibly lower costs. Just my opinion though.

 

[DGK]

You know I have thought about this over the years as I just hate electronic or pneumatic stops I have very simple fix I believe,an adjustable fixed throttle stop.A good friend of mine had Holley base plate that he could adjust the butterflies a spacer on top then carb on the spacer. I cant remember if he won Div6 super comp 2 or 3 years in an a row back when the class first started up many years ago.It was an idea that was dreamed up by a gentleman named Bruce Flodin in B.C. (very smart guy)Al claimed it was how he was able to win it all.The only problem with implementing this is you would have alot of pissed off manufactures and racers who like the speed and now they are going to probably saying what the hell am I suppose to do with my engines and fair enough.They would probably have to build an engine that would run just a little under the number because I suspect you would not want to shut down the stop to much.

 

[Randy]

Dave, dont forget that before the 7.90 Super E there was Top Gas West.

I did that...

Top Gas West sticker on the fuel tank. Photos by Steve Reyes.

We had a lot of fun running Top Gas West before switching to Top Alcohol, with Lena, Rizolli, Oliver, Hutchison, Hooper, Lang, Anderson, Ahten, Rheel, Kruzick, Stinnett, Slick, Ogle, Dye, Maropulos, McCoy, etc.

 

[Dragracer]

When we (Cerny's and me) started SuperComp racing we couldn't afford any electronics. We had a screw to set how far the throttle pedal could be pushed. We also were running a 454 Chevy we got from a acquaintance we had at GM and it showed up in a crate one day. We changed the cam, rockers and carb. On it's best day wide open it could run 8.85 so we had to show it down a little sometimes. We got it to run real consistent 8.91-8.93 at 152-154mph.. We wanted to be sure we never broke out. The car ran full throttle from the green light to the end. We were very completive in the SoCal super Comp assn and at Division races and won more than we lost at the association races. We raced and won at the Pomona World Finals in 1994. The top cars at the time were the Richardson Brothers. We talked to them during the rounds and remarked how hard it was to race a car like ours because they didn't know whether they would break out or not catching us. We ran two more Mike Spitzer factory cars with a mild Steve Smit engine and we went to the the semi Finals at both races we ran them. Ran them the same as we had run our pretty stock car. Mike sold 2 cars to
People who wanted to race so we let them ride with us. Our dragster was originally the T/F Over-the-Hill car that Kelly Brown drove to the Championship then to Dale Smart that ran it in Top Alcohol with a Arias then Dave Cerny bought it and had it back halfed and raced it in S/C until the Over-the-Hill guys wanted it back to restore. You really don't have to have all the electronics and a $30k engine to win. Just a consistent car with a REAL good driver.

 

[Marchboom]

John, not arguing, just discussing. Yes, most Drag Racing classes are about performance. But if you told the Super Comp class take off the stops and run flat out, it would be Top Dragster. And not everyone who wants to race can afford a car that will run 6.0.

Pure Drag Race mentality. TD came about because there were guys who wanted to bracket race without the throttle stop. Mostly the big dollar racers that wanted a shot at a Wally.
NHRA said OK.
Then they wanted power adders.
NHRA said OK.
Then the guys with money all built TADs for bracket competition.
Then they had to be told that you can't run in the 5's.
It is now very common for a bump to be 6.50 or better and the guys who wanted the class in the first place (those big dollar braclet racers) most who run 7.0 to 7.50 think NHRA should do something. When what NHRA did was give them what they asked for.

And how often do you see one of those 6.0 cars at the Flings? Next to never.

We have classes for people to compete without having a million dollar budget to do so.

I know a guy a few years back who raced TD and won at his home track. A BIG DEAL for him, friends and family that don't come to weekend bracket events came to the Nationals and got to see him win. The next year he didn't enter. I asked why? and he said he couldn't qualify, he has a 7.40 car and he looked at the entry list and figured the bump would be 6.80 something. I think a guy like that needs a class to comptete in. If he supports the track all year, there should be a place for him when the big show comes to town.

If you're not a fan of the .90 classes, then grab a burger or a t-shirt while they run. But don't ban them from competition.

Strictly my opinion.
Alan

Just the thought of having a car start at full throttle, then immediately drop down to an idle for 200', then back to full throttle is against everything drag racing is about...IMO.

Maybe this is drag racing's DEI program.

 

[DG]

I did that...

Top Gas West sticker on the fuel tank. Photos by Steve Reyes.

We had a lot of fun running Top Gas West before switching to Top Alcohol, with Lena, Rizolli, Oliver, Hutchison, Hooper, Lang, Anderson, Ahten, Rheel, Kruzick, Stinnett, Slick, Ogle, Dye, Maropulos, McCoy, etc.

We didn't know that those were the "Good Ol' Days"!

 

[Sparky]

Well if they have to be involved tell them to stage it and run,its not top fuel,they take forever

If you have never tuned a Jr. please don't chastise. There is a lot more to it than you think to get one to run down the track. When they are on the track at a national event you want them to run not pop and fart down the track. Also, if four or five jrs at a national event gets one or more kids drag racing it is doing its job.