I'm willing to bet over half of the cars out there were running on less than $3 Mil.
Prudhomme Annouces Retirement (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Bobby Bennett
- Start date
I'm willing to bet over half of the cars out there were running on less than $3 Mil.
danno
Nitro Member
You hit the nail right on the head Rich,costs have to come down.....
none
Nitro Member
What would you say the Championship winning teams' budget was for the last few years?
Horsepower & Heels
Nitro Member
Really sad... a legend retiring is such a hard thing to accept. I hope we still see him around in some capacity.
And I was really having some optimistic thoughts about the economy and its effects on drag racing. I thought it may be rebounding slightly, but this isn't a good sign for sure if one of the most experienced owners is backing out.
And I was really having some optimistic thoughts about the economy and its effects on drag racing. I thought it may be rebounding slightly, but this isn't a good sign for sure if one of the most experienced owners is backing out.
Tim5636sc
Nitro Member
Sure I do Nunz....but it's not the COST of the CARS which is the issue. Let's be honest for a sec....take a look at the standars set up of a 3+ million team. They've got (1) Primary rig which holds the car, some parts, has lounge for driver/crew cheif ect.... (1) Support Rig which holds parts, spare blocks (up to 8 in the top deck btw) head (more than 16 sets at any one time), in trailer mill and shop to maintanence pretty much anything.
Then the crew:
1 sometimes 2 crew cheifs
1 car cheif
1 clutch specialist
2 cylinder head guys (left and right side)
1 fuel specialist
1 bottom end guy
1 tire and wings guy
1 full time driver/ maybe 2
1 PR Person
1 Maketing person
1 Team Manager
1 Driver
add up those salaries.....I'd say 1mill right there.
Then you have your hospitality rig. Usually 2-3 full time employees with set up...budgets of $10,000-$20,000 for support staff, food, entertainment per event so forth and so on..Add on 50-100 EVENT TICKETS ($80-$120) per.
Add travel, entertainment, food, hotel, rental cars, gas, insurance, shipping parts and equipment, salaries, marketing budgets, PR and so on and on and on... and you've got urself a 3.5 mill budget...
Take away some excess items not needed...get creative with marketing partnerships which would reduce your budgets and i'll bet u can still compete for the championship on 1/2 that budget...
Bottom line.... Snake is retired. The reasons exactly why is his business. Not ours. But, i'm just sayin I think you could do it for less and still provide your marketing partners with a solid return on their investment.
I would love to see the costs if a team only had what they needed to run the team realisticly , no luxuries! . That would be an interesting number . I think it is a great shame that he is going to retire .
kingcobrafan
Nitro Member
Talk about someone who just TRAMPLED people in his driving heyday. Have a great retirement, Snake, you deserve it! Thanks for the great memories, too!
sharkman
Nitro Member
Well I wish Snake well!, I will say that just the cost of the rigs to haul the cars and parts are in excess of 300K then add the cost of a T/F car or F/C, what? 100/150K, plus "spare parts", heads are 10 grand a set, blowers 7-8 grand, oil, spark plugs, wires, magnetos, PISTONS/RODS X 8 for a weekend, a set of Bill Miller connecting rods is 1000 bucks, rocker arms, hell I buy cheap ones and they're 200 bucks a set for a smallblock Chevy, Imagine what a T/F motor goes through in a season, valve springs, gaskets, blower belts how about Brake Kleen!!!! permits for the Rig, shoot, I could spend a million bucks without leaving this chair thinking of the stuff it takes to run a quick racecar for a season, let alone a F/C or T/F dragster.
yoda
Nitro Member
The Marketing person makes money????
The two people you have highlighted are usually the first 2 to go when $$ get tight. I should say that is the way it is in the business I work in, Marketing is a luxury not a necessity.
Fireball
Nitro Member
Not if you want to run a team of Snake's caliber.
Tim5636sc
Nitro Member
The Marketing person makes money????
They usually do when the season starts...
And when they are with one of those top flight teams...
Tim5636sc
Nitro Member
AND THAT'S THE PROBLEM WITH THE BUSINESS WORLD Mr. Miller. Marketing and PR are very much a necessity. Let me ask you this question..... and I'm goin for the throat with you on this one, Who do you think made Budweiser and KB the success it was. I'll give you a hint... it wasn't KB.
Sure Kenny is a VERY good business man, but what made him good was the fact he hired the right people to help him do things he simply did not know how to do. AA/Dale gave him a solid tune up and MANY of his championships. Ms. Arnold is who made that deal as special as it was. And guess what she does... yup... Marketing and PR. She's the one who got KB into the mainstream media.
I'll go one step further. ASK John Force who made him who he is today. Sure Austin Coil gave him several championships but who put him on the "MAP".... Ever heard of Dave Densmore??? What does he do??? Yup.... PR!
How bout DSR? Judy Stroupus
Who helps spread the Antron message?? Yup... That'd be Teddy Y.
Then there is the guy who helped build Worsham and is helping Tim Wilkerson build his brand... ONE OF THE BEST.. Bob Wilber.
Skip Allum, Todd Myers, Jon Knapp and several others do a great job in this arena as well. Where do you think that Bobby Bennett cat developed a name.
Then there are those other guys like Unk and yours truly....who couldn't hold a stick to the talents of those exceptionally talented people....YET...But we're gettin better.
Perhaps I'm a bit bias on this, but without PR and Marketing guys putting the name of the clients, (THE MARKETING PARTNERS, DRIVERS, RACE TEAM) in the media....There would be NO MARKETING PARTNERS, NO INTEREST in the teams...just a bunch of rich guys racing on a track with small budgets blowin stuff up....
just my .02 cents...
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and so it goes. Another reminder of how old some are. Thanks for the memories
No. 3: Don Prudhomme
Some of the cars I thought were way cool I saw run were the Hot Wheels front engine car with the squared off canopy. Everyone thought it was ugly but me apparently. The red rear engine Hot Wheels wedge car but by the time I got to see it at Englishtown he took the wedge part off because of weight. The yellow lightweight car with the movable rear wing built by Kent Fuller.
I had to hug the spectator side fence to see these cars because I couldn't get into the pits till 1973 due to new jerseys stupid state pit access laws. His hot wheels Cuda. Anyone remember that classic photo of him going through the traps with the front end up in the air on fire? Also the funny car he debuted at the spring nationals in Columbus with the ground effects tunnel which worked so well it slowed the car down, He took off the tunnel for eliminations if i recall. The Army era of Cuda's, Arrow's Monza's, Out of all I thought the Arrow looked the neatest.
Oh and the ramp trucks! Nothing looked so awesome as funny cars of the era on ramp trucks. Big tires jacking the car up at an angle of attack, Deep dark foreboding drivers compartments where you were lucky if you were able to see his aluminized face mask with a 3/4 helmet with "Snake" above the brim visor. The nitrous ere when he rotated the earth with that 5:6X something. I think it was two tenths quicker than anyone else at the time. I almost got tired of him winning during that era, as everyone else was racing for second place. He was a John Force before Force was John Force!! LOL.
Is there anyone cooler and more understated than Prudhomme? Only time I ever saw him show emotion was during the televised US nationals when the front half of Jim Nicoll's front engine top fuel car flew in front of him in the shut down after a clutch explosion. Prudhomme was gonna retire on the spot right there while being interviewed until he found out Jim was alright.
Sometimes I miss being young but I wouldn't trade being old for a second if it meant I had to miss the golden age of drag racing. When you consider that Prudhomme was winning races 3 years before Garlits went west. You have to wonder what fountain of youth Prudhomme was drinking from to stay at it this long!
Thanks for all the memories Snake.
No. 3: Don Prudhomme
Some of the cars I thought were way cool I saw run were the Hot Wheels front engine car with the squared off canopy. Everyone thought it was ugly but me apparently. The red rear engine Hot Wheels wedge car but by the time I got to see it at Englishtown he took the wedge part off because of weight. The yellow lightweight car with the movable rear wing built by Kent Fuller.
I had to hug the spectator side fence to see these cars because I couldn't get into the pits till 1973 due to new jerseys stupid state pit access laws. His hot wheels Cuda. Anyone remember that classic photo of him going through the traps with the front end up in the air on fire? Also the funny car he debuted at the spring nationals in Columbus with the ground effects tunnel which worked so well it slowed the car down, He took off the tunnel for eliminations if i recall. The Army era of Cuda's, Arrow's Monza's, Out of all I thought the Arrow looked the neatest.
Oh and the ramp trucks! Nothing looked so awesome as funny cars of the era on ramp trucks. Big tires jacking the car up at an angle of attack, Deep dark foreboding drivers compartments where you were lucky if you were able to see his aluminized face mask with a 3/4 helmet with "Snake" above the brim visor. The nitrous ere when he rotated the earth with that 5:6X something. I think it was two tenths quicker than anyone else at the time. I almost got tired of him winning during that era, as everyone else was racing for second place. He was a John Force before Force was John Force!! LOL.
Is there anyone cooler and more understated than Prudhomme? Only time I ever saw him show emotion was during the televised US nationals when the front half of Jim Nicoll's front engine top fuel car flew in front of him in the shut down after a clutch explosion. Prudhomme was gonna retire on the spot right there while being interviewed until he found out Jim was alright.
Sometimes I miss being young but I wouldn't trade being old for a second if it meant I had to miss the golden age of drag racing. When you consider that Prudhomme was winning races 3 years before Garlits went west. You have to wonder what fountain of youth Prudhomme was drinking from to stay at it this long!
Thanks for all the memories Snake.
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Rumblebones
Nitro Member
Snake retires. Yea right.
He may not run a car, but he'll be around. Nobody retires from hotrodding.
Viva le Vipe.
He may not run a car, but he'll be around. Nobody retires from hotrodding.
Viva le Vipe.
Dave
Nitro Member
I suspected this announcement would be coming. I do not believe the sky is falling in NHRA Drag Racing and this is not a gloom and doom post. I feel that the announcment by Snake is just one more remonder of the overall picture of present day NHRA Drag Racing.
Over the last several seasons, I have noticed a few things. The cost to go Drag Racing keeps going up, and every year a few more cars get parked. I'm not sure who is to blame, I suppose it's the racers, but NHRA can't be left out of this discussion. When Don Prudhomme, Shirley Muldowney, Bob Glidden and other Legends of this sport started their careers, I'd bet they were in it to enjoy themselves and have some fun. As we all know, these people helped mold the sport into something wonderful. Because of people like these, Drag Racing was a sport that millions fell in love with - myself included. In my opinion, the wonderful sport these people helped build, is long gone.
As times went on, the costs kept going up along with the performance of the Race Cars. Funding needed to be found - many were able to do so - to keep doing what they loved. I would surmise that the cost of Drag Racing in the 70's and early 80's, was not totally out of control. Big difference between those days and now.
Slowly, one by one of these stars of the QUARTER MILE began to get out of the driver's seat, some - to leave the sport forever. I would guess that the leading reason most people get out of Drag Racing, is lack of funding. I would also bet that lack of fun is a close second.
I can't speak for Snake, but I have a feeling I know what happened. NHRA Drag Racing is so expensive and costs are so out of control, you realize you can't even remember when the fun ended. It's big business and you have to think as a business person. I know I'll catch hell for this, but being a competitor in NHRA Drag Racing might not be such a good business move. To the folks out there that can find the funding to run a team, I tip my hat to you. You have done a great job selling the sport. The folks that can't find the money, you have nothing to feel bad about. After all, how can you sell something that nobody wants - and for a rediculas fee.
For those of you that Race, I'm sure you will know what I'm talking about. Those that don't, may not understand. I can't tell you how hard it is to try to come up with enoungh money to go Racing every year. When you can't find the money, it damn near tears your heart out. After a while of going through this, you start to realize that Drag Racing ain't all the fun it used to be. When you want to Race and you can't, it's tough. People begin to have a little reality check and you realize there is more to life that NHRA Drag Racing. What started out as fun, is now a real pain in the ass. Some might argue that the problem is the current economy. I'm sure that plays a part, but it's not all. People are losing interest in the sport and nobody seems to care. Recently, Dean Skuza, Bob Glidden, and a few others have publically disclosed there lack of enthusiasm for Drag Racing. I will add my myself to the list. Sure, I'm still a fan, but I really have lost interest in competing anymore. So much money is needed to compete that it is hard to justify the enjoyment level. Running a sportsman car is even out of control.
NHRA has quite a problem on their hands and I hope they can figure out how to make this sport survive. I'm sure their job is not easy, I wouldn't want it. These people continue to do things that the customers don't like, and they seem to be oblivious the empty grandstands and dwindling TV ratings. Some big changes are needed or NHRA Drag Racing will surely die.
Snake, thank you sir, for sharing your life with ours.
Dave
Over the last several seasons, I have noticed a few things. The cost to go Drag Racing keeps going up, and every year a few more cars get parked. I'm not sure who is to blame, I suppose it's the racers, but NHRA can't be left out of this discussion. When Don Prudhomme, Shirley Muldowney, Bob Glidden and other Legends of this sport started their careers, I'd bet they were in it to enjoy themselves and have some fun. As we all know, these people helped mold the sport into something wonderful. Because of people like these, Drag Racing was a sport that millions fell in love with - myself included. In my opinion, the wonderful sport these people helped build, is long gone.
As times went on, the costs kept going up along with the performance of the Race Cars. Funding needed to be found - many were able to do so - to keep doing what they loved. I would surmise that the cost of Drag Racing in the 70's and early 80's, was not totally out of control. Big difference between those days and now.
Slowly, one by one of these stars of the QUARTER MILE began to get out of the driver's seat, some - to leave the sport forever. I would guess that the leading reason most people get out of Drag Racing, is lack of funding. I would also bet that lack of fun is a close second.
I can't speak for Snake, but I have a feeling I know what happened. NHRA Drag Racing is so expensive and costs are so out of control, you realize you can't even remember when the fun ended. It's big business and you have to think as a business person. I know I'll catch hell for this, but being a competitor in NHRA Drag Racing might not be such a good business move. To the folks out there that can find the funding to run a team, I tip my hat to you. You have done a great job selling the sport. The folks that can't find the money, you have nothing to feel bad about. After all, how can you sell something that nobody wants - and for a rediculas fee.
For those of you that Race, I'm sure you will know what I'm talking about. Those that don't, may not understand. I can't tell you how hard it is to try to come up with enoungh money to go Racing every year. When you can't find the money, it damn near tears your heart out. After a while of going through this, you start to realize that Drag Racing ain't all the fun it used to be. When you want to Race and you can't, it's tough. People begin to have a little reality check and you realize there is more to life that NHRA Drag Racing. What started out as fun, is now a real pain in the ass. Some might argue that the problem is the current economy. I'm sure that plays a part, but it's not all. People are losing interest in the sport and nobody seems to care. Recently, Dean Skuza, Bob Glidden, and a few others have publically disclosed there lack of enthusiasm for Drag Racing. I will add my myself to the list. Sure, I'm still a fan, but I really have lost interest in competing anymore. So much money is needed to compete that it is hard to justify the enjoyment level. Running a sportsman car is even out of control.
NHRA has quite a problem on their hands and I hope they can figure out how to make this sport survive. I'm sure their job is not easy, I wouldn't want it. These people continue to do things that the customers don't like, and they seem to be oblivious the empty grandstands and dwindling TV ratings. Some big changes are needed or NHRA Drag Racing will surely die.
Snake, thank you sir, for sharing your life with ours.
Dave
AND THAT'S THE PROBLEM WITH THE BUSINESS WORLD Mr. Miller. Marketing and PR are very much a necessity. Let me ask you this question..... and I'm goin for the throat with you on this one, Who do you think made Budweiser and KB the success it was. I'll give you a hint... it wasn't KB.
Sure Kenny is a VERY good business man, but what made him good was the fact he hired the right people to help him do things he simply did not know how to do. AA/Dale gave him a solid tune up and MANY of his championships. Ms. Arnold is who made that deal as special as it was. And guess what she does... yup... Marketing and PR. She's the one who got KB into the mainstream media.
I'll go one step further. ASK John Force who made him who he is today. Sure Austin Coil gave him several championships but who put him on the "MAP".... Ever heard of Dave Densmore??? What does he do??? Yup.... PR!
How bout DSR? Judy Stroupus
Who helps spread the Antron message?? Yup... That'd be Teddy Y.
Then there is the guy who helped build Worsham and is helping Tim Wilkerson build his brand... ONE OF THE BEST.. Bob Wilber.
Skip Allum, Todd Myers, Jon Knapp and several others do a great job in this arena as well. Where do you think that Bobby Bennett cat developed a name.
Then there are those other guys like Unk and yours truly....who couldn't hold a stick to the talents of those exceptionally talented people....YET...But we're gettin better.
Perhaps I'm a bit bias on this, but without PR and Marketing guys putting the name of the clients, (THE MARKETING PARTNERS, DRIVERS, RACE TEAM) in the media....There would be NO MARKETING PARTNERS, NO INTEREST in the teams...just a bunch of rich guys racing on a track with small budgets blowin stuff up....
just my .02 cents...
I will kick this around with you. I can only speak from my business experience, but when revenues decline like we have seen in this recession the first place that is looked at is the $$ spent to support the product/service you are selling. I have worked in Marketing in previous roles, but my current role is on the Commercial side of the business and I evaluate the efficiency of the operations to determine we are generating enough margin to justify the marketing dollars spent on particular programs. Based on the premise your fixed overhead costs are at benchmark top tier levels, the majority of your flexible spending is in Marketing and IT. Our like for like margin has declined by roughly 10% in the past year and a half and we have had no choice but to evaluate all of our marketing programs. You have to make the tough call to keep the programs that deliver the biggest return and scrap the programs that fall into the bottom half of the evaluation. In normal business conditions where margin is growing, you can justify spending marketing dollars in areas that deliver moderate returns, but in this environment you evaluate things differently. When I worked in Marketing, I believed the world evolved around the group, but I have since taken the blinders off and I understand what makes a business successful in these tough times. I agree with what you said about the PR individuals you spoke of above, but my point is when times are tough and you have to answer to shareholders, sometimes tough decisions are made and unfortunately many of the cuts are on the Marketing side of the business. We are starting to see signs that we are restoring some of the revenues lost in this recession and early indications for the upcoming year is that we will see growth, so hopefully the worst is behind us and companies will be in a position to start spending money again to support growth.
sammi
Nitro Member
Sadly Snake, next year Bernstein and the Pedregons, and down the road Force, are victims of what they helped create. In their all consuming passion to beat the ^%@ out of their competitors, they brought corporate sponsorship to the sport. Now the bar is raised a lot higher. The deal with the devil that they made was to live for today with money from a partner who doesn't give a &%# about the sport, we'll worry about tomorrow down the road. Sadly tomorrow is here for the Snake and is coming quick for Bernstein and Force. These gentlemen, along with others, sold out drag racing's future for their own interests. The legacy they leave us may be wreckage of a once glorious endeavor.
Did anyone actually think once these "legends" stopped generating more profit for their overlords than the overlords paid in, that some benevolent white knight from the company would save them? The only white knight I have seen lately was Jin Jannard and now he's gone.
So how does this fall on NHRA? It is NHRA's responsibility, as caretaker of the sport, to maintain an environment that allows maximum safe participation. They can only be viewed as successful in their role as guardian of the sport when they are having meetings to discuss how to park 50 top fuelers in the pits at an event.
How good is Dixon's move going to be is the Prince waltzes over to Williams Grand Prix Engineering next year?
Mark
Did anyone actually think once these "legends" stopped generating more profit for their overlords than the overlords paid in, that some benevolent white knight from the company would save them? The only white knight I have seen lately was Jin Jannard and now he's gone.
So how does this fall on NHRA? It is NHRA's responsibility, as caretaker of the sport, to maintain an environment that allows maximum safe participation. They can only be viewed as successful in their role as guardian of the sport when they are having meetings to discuss how to park 50 top fuelers in the pits at an event.
How good is Dixon's move going to be is the Prince waltzes over to Williams Grand Prix Engineering next year?
Mark
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