I'm sure glad . . . (1 Viewer)

[Baron]

The NHRA gave Bob Frey the Don Prudhomme award at the Championship banquet. Well deserved for Bob and very classy of the NHRA to honor him in that way. Congratulations, Bob and thanks to the NHRA.

 

[SoCal Racer]

The original poster hit it right on - all the claims NHRA made about 1,000 ft. being the miracle cure are false.

Track prep - or the lack thereof - isn't the only easy way to slow fuel cars down. Take away blower overdrive (or size), fuel pump volume, tire size, wing, or some combination of those. AA/Dale Armstrong experimented with lower compression ratios and found the engines lived a lot longer, so there's another alternative. NHRA simply made a knee-jerk reaction to the situation without thinking, and hell will freeze over before they ever admit a mistake or rescind a ruling.

That said, I would like to see the cars run all-out at 1320, but that's no longer feasible. And with TF running over 330 now at 1,000 ft. they're going to need to slow the cars down for this abbreviated distance. So where does it end? I've been around this sport nearly four decades and can GUARANTEE you that racers will find a way to go a little quicker and faster every year. As someone else mentioned, other organizations keep speeds under control by limiting boost or requiring smaller restrictor plates. NHRA needs to similarly get a handle on how to dial the fuel cars back, then get the cajones to do it.

 

[Toejam]

dave, when did NHRA proclaim 1000'. Racing as the miracle cure for anything? Other than giving some of the shorter tracks on the tour an extra 320 ft?

 

[dboxell]

What if we're going about this all wrong? Find a way to make the cars self limiting. Instead of gluing the crap out of the racetrack surface limit the amount of track prep. If the tires don't stick as well the crew chiefs have to back down the tune up. It would change the game from who can make the most horsepower to who can apply a limited amount of horsepower to a less grippy track. Looking back at some of the match race greats, the successful ones were the ones who could make the most out of questionable track surfaces.

Good idea but will nhra ever get the balls to do such a thing. The only way to monitor it would be to take readings of "stickiness" then you would have more crying about unequal track prep.. Most of the time if a car gets too much wheel speed it goes fat, then boom when the engine gets a load on it. Pro Stock don't really want the massive stick the fuel cars require.

It would appear that I they want to slow the fuel cars down would be to limit tire size, fuel pump size, blower size and overdrive, they already have 500 cu/in limit

 

[my friends call me Zappy]

What if we're going about this all wrong? Find a way to make the cars self limiting.

Ding Ding Ding!!! Ladies & gentlemen we have a winner. I have full confidance that given the chance, the teams & CC's will continue to go quicker and faster. As Mr. Keech suggested, just make them "self limiting".

Put a speed limit on them. Problem solved. You still prep the track for the safety of ALL classes.

Could also bring back 1320 at some tracks...

 

[T.Smith]

Blah, blah, blah.

 

[BaldyLochs]

I stood between my wife and my mother in law arguing about Thanksgiving dinner. Both were louder than a top fueler.....

Holy crap dude; I'd take a top fueler over that any day - with no earplugs and no gas mask. And by the way, that's with me sticking my head like 8 inches above the header outlets, directly in the exhaust plume. Thank God; the car will eventually be shut off, or starve itself of fuel. Your situation on the other hand....... Ugh....

 

[Justin@NRE]

I've tried to make this point several other places, and I'll try the same here.

1000' racing wasn't intended to slow the cars down, it was intended to give the cars an extra 320 feet of shutdown. I thought I would hate it too, but I'm more impressed with the performance and racing now than I was at 1320'.

So what's the solution? Slow them down? Anything you do to slow a car down will only be temporary. Racers are racers and always find a way to go faster in a given set of rules. And a speed limit? What are we talking about there? Top Fuel Bracket racing?

You also seem to be under the impression that the teams are stepping on the motors too hard causing them to explode. Most of the teams stepping on their stuff harder have a much shorter service life on their parts, but they are aware of having to replace parts more often. Stepping on em too hard is actually not often the cause, as the big boomers usually come from dropping a valve, something mechanical failing or drivers keeping their foot in it too long after the motor starts to lay over (in eliminations, you gotta do what you gotta do). Some of that may stem from trying to stretch an extra lap out of parts, others are just dumb luck or miscalculation and the fact it takes very little to anger a top fuel motor. Bottom line is that anytime extreme cylinder pressures are involved with a lot of fuel, a blower and a welder for an ignition system, no matter what the fuel is, you've got a better than average chance something will fail.

 

[Pete]

A lot of folks, both fans & spectators as well as racers and crew chiefs themselves stated rather succinctly that it wouldn't take very long for the crew chiefs to "shorten the wick" and begin hurting parts at or prior to 1,000'. Nobody should be surprised that we're seeing that today - If you are, you either weren't around when they decided to go 1,000' racing or you weren't paying attention.

Furthermore, the majority of teams that are blowing things up are using second hard parts because it's what they can afford - Not all, mind you, but most. (Beckman at the World Finals comes immediately to mind, but look at Lesenko, Diehl, etc.) Anyway, the low budget teams are forced to push the performance envelope using equipment that the high dollar teams weren't willing to push with just to run hard enough to get in the show and be mildly competitive. Again, we shouldn't be surprised when nitro motors with second hand parts go boom!

Lastly, you suggest decreasing performance and in the same breath refer to them as the "premier classes." NHRA is in a very tough spot and I don't envy them. First of all, if they force lesser performance on the fuel cars they create a huge expense for everyone because a lot of the equipment they're currently using will be obsolete. Then, who do they sell it too? It's useless - nobody will buy it. Also, where do the aforementioned low-budget teams buy their second hand stuff - there won't be any, at least initially. And then there's the TAD/TAFC dilemma - Are you going to decrease performance in the TAD & TAFC classes too? Assuming decreased performance in the fuel cars, it's not a stretch to think that at some point TAD/TAFC may be almost as quick and fast as the "premier classes" and we definitely don't want that, do we? And to suggest decreasing their performance too would be ridiculous (see cost effect above).

Look, when you're using CH3NO2 as your fuel source, things are sometimes going to go BOOM, whether you're using new stuff or old - it's a fact of NHRA racing.

I was told by a well known TAFC owner/driver that the cars are pretty much at their limit...50's with a few dips into the .40's now and again.

 

[JF]

I was told by a well known TAFC owner/driver that the cars are pretty much at their limit...50's with a few dips into the .40's now and again.

Ya, That's what I heard too, In the 70s, 80s, 90s, 2000's

 

[TooTall999]

Ding Ding Ding!!! Ladies & gentlemen we have a winner. I have full confidance that given the chance, the teams & CC's will continue to go quicker and faster. As Mr. Keech suggested, just make them "self limiting".

Put a speed limit on them. Problem solved. You still prep the track for the safety of ALL classes.

Could also bring back 1320 at some tracks...

I don't advocate putting a speed limit on the cars. My idea was to limit the amount of "glue" being applied to the racing surface. Instead of gluing the crap out of the track, just drag it with rubber, or use less glue. This would limit the amount of traction available, resulting in the tuners dialing back the performance. It seems to me this would keep the playing field level for all competitors. Other suggestions involving smaller fuel pumps, supercharger restrictions, et al would require low buck teams to either buy alot of new parts or quit. By limiting the available traction, you limit the attainable speeds.

 

[my friends call me Zappy]

To limit traction becomes a safety issue. The idea of making them "self limiting" is great. No new parts, no advantage to the hi $$ teams, no parts made obsolete.

It's worked well in the jet world for decades.
One MPH for FC, another for TF.
Anything else is just a temporary fix.