Top Fuel and Funny Car: A modest proposal inspired by Alan R. (1 Viewer)

[BaldyLochs]

Let’s talk about the people who sit inside these vehicles. My only concern is that nobody ever gets hurt again driving on of these vehicles. Whether that means a tire popping at speed, sending the vehicle into the wall; the rear wing coming off through the traps at speed; or the motor backfiring and exploding, sending shrapnel into the driver compartment or setting the thing on fire...... and if the consensus is that staying at 1000 will save someone’s life; or maybe prevent a hospital trip..... by God we have to accept that. I love this sport so much. But sometimes I hate it more that anything else in the world, when I see people getting hurt. We have to keep these men and women safe.
Not sure of my point here; but there ya go. Thanks for reading.

 

[John Capps Sr.]

Once again, why make the teams replace their combo's and the tire Mfgr spend a ton of $ to redesign tires when all you have to do is TAKE WING (downforce) AWAY...??? The funny cars could have the rear spoiler plates and wicker-bills reduced. A fuel car is built to meet the stresses of today's work..., just reduce the amount of stresses and make the parts last a lot longer. The cost of parts attrition could be reduced to allow people to return to the race track. NHRA could pay a Fuel Car Team to detune a car, stick an Alcohol wing on it for a few passes and watch the results.

 

[Cliff]

Agree Chris. No one wants to see a driver hurt. But.... when a driver is in a car that goes zero to 340 in 3 seconds, sometimes there is a parts failure, sometimes driver error, sometimes something else. I think the cars are a lot safer now than years ago, but stuff still happens. I will say that if I had the choice of crashing my little Honda on the freeway at 75 VS crashing at 200 in a drag car, I'd pick the drag car.

 

[Cliff]

Once again, why make the teams replace their combo's and the tire Mfgr spend a ton of $ to redesign tires when all you have to do is TAKE WING (downforce) AWAY...??? The funny cars could have the rear spoiler plates and wicker-bills reduced. A fuel car is built to meet the stresses of today's work..., just reduce the amount of stresses and make the parts last a lot longer. The cost of parts attrition could be reduced to allow people to return to the race track. NHRA could pay a Fuel Car Team to detune a car, stick an Alcohol wing on it for a few passes and watch the results.

John, if you're thinking of a blown alky dragster wing on a T/F car, that would be pretty scary. I don't think the car would get more than 200-300' before it got loose.

 

[Dan]

What I wonder is why you guys think changing the combos (to what you think will slow the cars down) will have an equal affect on bringing our costs down?

 

[mikebcurve]

If there is a rule change let the part time guys legally purchase and use the remaining inventories until they are gone. It may give them a reason to show up at a few more races. Seems like the big dogs are always helping out the lower funded teams anyway. Reduce the blower size or fuel pump and let Haddock run the old ones for the season. Also there are fuel teams in Europe and Australia that could use some of these parts assuming they wouldn’t change the rules immediately after the NHRA.

 

[TopFuel@Lions]

What Chase, Ken, and Capps said. Drag racers are so anti-change. From one who has seen it from the golden age, the situation now needs attention. Stuff is blowing up more violently, crashing more often.

Let me bring some dirt track issues from years ago that were addressed before things got way out of hand.

Sprint cars, of the outlaw type had insane big-blocks on alky and nitro that got out of hand, the powers that be changed the game so that the big inchers went the way of the now standard 410 cu. in. engine on only alky, out of hand costs and the time nixed.

Late Models (my 2nd love in racing) got way out of hand with insane wedge bodies and sideboards, the bodys got out of hand. Rule's were changed to a standard type body, now look at the division.

This cost problem and other gremlins will plague the fuel classes until some one has a sack and modify the rules for all involved.

There is nothing close to the intense cackle, sound and power of a nitro ride, I hope someone will be brave.

Wait to hear the howling, crying, sniveling, and belly-aching when NHRA goes to 8-car ladders. I love this sport and I always will.



TopFuel@Lions..... 156 tracks and counting, 34 states and 1 in Canada.

 

[Pete]

Who said that? Don or Tony?

If memory serves me right, it was Tony in an interview a few years back. I’m sure that included the entire operation (shop, personnel, etc.)

 

[twostep]

They sound like that right now.

Not quite, at least not to me. The current cars sound and feel like they have a lot more power behind the pulses as the engine idles (which they do) compared to the one idling in Hillary's car and they still have that nitro cackle, but it's more of a steady maching-gun pounding, if you will. Hillary's car (and others from that era) seemed to have that wildly erratic snap, crackle and pop to them that to these old ears was simply intoxicating to stand and listen to.

Now when it comes to throttle whacks - God bless 'em - I remember Force cutting loose with one about 4 or 5 years ago that felt like I'd just been hit by a freight train. I mean, he really winged it. No comparison to engines of old. I guess Palmer is the only one out there now that still continues this most desirable tradition.

Even a 40 year old car of about 2500hp has that snap and crackle I mentioned - you can really tell as the Blue Max backs up to do a couple of hops through the juice at about 1:35 into the video:

 

[I was NITRO BREATH]

Personally I have not missed a race/qualifying day at Phoenix in 12 years. I have driven over 12 hours to go to a race. For several years I would skip the NASCAR race less than 30 minutes from home to drive 5+ hours for the World FInals in Pomona that often happens the same weekend. In fact I am getting off of work on Friday and making the drive to Vegas for two days and turning around and driving back Sunday night for work on Monday morning. The reason I do all of that is because I love the sport and there is nothing out there that will compare watching two 11,000+ hp fuel cars blast off side by side. The sensory overload from fuel cars are why I show up to races.

Yes I love other classes like stock/super stock, top sportsman, alcohol, etc and look forward to them when I go but in all honesty the fuel cars are why I show up. Fuel cars are why I would work extra shifts and save every extra buck I made so I could drive and sleep in my crappy car for four days when I was 17, 18, 19 just so I could get my nitro fix. If you neuter a fuel car to me you lessen that sensory overload that it unleashes, and for what? an extra 320' of racing. We have all said that probably 85% of people in the stands come for just fuel cars well if you neuter them to the point of not being awe-inspiring anymore well then you will really see empty stands.


So say you do slow the cars down to run 300 mph in 1/4 mile. What happens when you have a chute failure like Densham did at Pomona a couple years ago or Capps had at Indy. That extra 320' feet of stopping distance may have prevented a bad situation from being a catastrophic/tragic incident for both. Alan also mentioned the cost of essentially re-working every piece and part of a fuel engine/management systems just to slow down and go 320' farther. That alone would probably bankrupt a majority of teams. Yes in a perfect world where every track had two miles of shutdown and tires could handle the forces of 350+ mph speeds I would love to see 1/4 mile racing, but to neuter the cars just to fit 1/4 mile racing I believe would cause more irreversible damage to the sport we all love.

As a true drag racing fan your argument touched me. I sincerely hope things can remain the same. There is nothing like the feeling of standing at the wall when the first two top fuelers start up. The essence of drag racing...

 

[robinjackson]

If we are agreed that it's the full-fat, 11,000bhp, 330mph, sensory-overload show that brings in the crowds, why would a reduced-fat, TAD/TAFC-level version attract more?

 

[cknight]

Now for the cynical side. You want flames, noise, unearthly performance, parts attrition? How many folks whined when they banned hydrazine? Regards, Chase

 

[none]

A big part of the idle sound you are comparing is as simple as engine speed. Today's cars idle at close to 3,000 RPM.

Alan

 

[Nunz]

To me, today's TF/FC motors sound as ferocious as ever, and why wouldn't they, with the volume of air/nitro being ignited. I also have to say, for those that enjoy the cackle sound at idle, the A/F cars are pretty stout!

 

[mick]

i could be wrong, but IMO the idle of today's nitro motors is far from what they were 15 years ago and before. carl explained exactly what i'm referring too.
i don't want to get in a big pissing match about idle, percentage, and/or other variables. the engines used to run on a higher percentage of nitro, the cackle was more violent,
and the throttle wacks were intense (notice how long hillary's are in that video; i'd like to think ken black enjoyed those years with kalitta racing).
again, as carl stated, the warmups are still great to listen to, but 15+ years ago they WERE intoxicating. different than today. better than today. JMHO.
scott palmer is a fan favorite.....and he doesn't win. imagine that.

 

[Cliff]

The video of Raymond Beadle & the Max brought back some memories. F/C used to do a long burnout, back up & then do short hops. We used to say they were "talkin' to one another". Sometimes they used to do 3-4 short hops. One car would do it, then the other & it really got the crowds excited. Green light & off they'd go. The technology, fuel systems and all that was so different than today, but they did put on a show. Del Worsham has a nostalgia F/C that he has run at Bakersfield a few years ago, & he actually did a hop. Was so cool.

 

[TSK]

Saying today's cars are crashing more often is just wrong. Even though the cars are magnitudes faster than when the sport first started, they are safer than ever. But, when you pressurize nitromethane and use the equivalent of an arc welder to light the mixture, well, bad things can happen if something goes wrong.
Drag racers are not anti-change, per se. As long as any changes enhance safety, I don't think many people put up much of a fuss.
They just do not want to be slowed down.
It’s been said many times, and bears saying again; drag racing, in some form, will exist as long as there are two people with cars, wanting to see which is faster
That’s just human nature. Competition is good for the soul.
But, how can you tell somebody who has spent millions of dollars to run 330+ mph they can no longer run faster than 300?
NHRA may be the sanctioning body, but the mega-teams run the show.
Until those teams decide amongst themselves to do what is necessary to slow down, no amount of Internet pontificating by keyboard crew chiefs is going to do any good.
I would hate to see nitro racing price itself out of competition. But, if the big teams aren’t concerned enough to take significant steps to slow down, nothing I say is going to make a bit of difference.
But, forget about talk of returning to 1/4 mile nitro racing. It’s not going to happen.
So, I will go to races when I can and enjoy the sensory overload, and hope it never goes away.
When I can’t go, I will watch it on TV.
Now, if we could just get the announcers to shut up once the cars fire, that would be making progress.
They are just like DJs who talk all the way through the instrumental intro of a song, and shut up only when the singing starts.

 

[T.Smith]

If memory serves me right, it was Tony in an interview a few years back. I’m sure that included the entire operation (shop, personnel, etc.)

Then I would say that is fairly accurate. Especially knowing what it takes to run our car.

 

[T.Smith]

Not quite, at least not to me. The current cars sound and feel like they have a lot more power behind the pulses as the engine idles (which they do) compared to the one idling in Hillary's car and they still have that nitro cackle, but it's more of a steady maching-gun pounding, if you will. Hillary's car (and others from that era) seemed to have that wildly erratic snap, crackle and pop to them that to these old ears was simply intoxicating to stand and listen to.

Now when it comes to throttle whacks - God bless 'em - I remember Force cutting loose with one about 4 or 5 years ago that felt like I'd just been hit by a freight train. I mean, he really winged it. No comparison to engines of old. I guess Palmer is the only one out there now that still continues this most desirable tradition.

Even a 40 year old car of about 2500hp has that snap and crackle I mentioned - you can really tell as the Blue Max backs up to do a couple of hops through the juice at about 1:35 into the video:

You're all smoking dope...that video of Hillary Will is from 2007. The cars were on 85% back then and all people did back then was complain about how muted the cars sounded on 85%. Now all of a sudden it sounds better than today's car.

 

[mick]

You're all smoking dope........

want some?