The coutdown is BS (1 Viewer)

[mw6789]

Who else think the countdown is a bad idea? Nascar or NHRA, I think the talking heads of both are trying to appeal to the masses. But it does not work, IMHO. As a racer myself, if you make the points races, finish well to only have the points reset, would only piss me off. Before you know it NASCAR well stop the race 3/4 way thru and reverse the running order in order for the cars in the back to have a chance for the win.

Hey Dan--Thanks for the great idea.
Regards,
Brian France

 

[clwill]

Before you know it NASCAR well stop the race 3/4 way thru and reverse the running order in order for the cars in the back to have a chance for the win.

NHRA already did that -- with the "top 12" qualifying thing this year.

 

[.]

Exactly, this is what I have said all along. People are p*ssing into the wind on this subject when they continuously state how the Countdown is hurting the sport. The way the petition fell flat on its face shows not many people care about saving the old system.

I bet a few people weren't fans of christmas tree starts either, way back when.

 

[67 Cuda]

I bet a few people weren't fans of christmas tree starts either, way back when.

I bet you are right!

 

[d'kid]

I bet a few people weren't fans of christmas tree starts either, way back when.

Greg, I'm still not...

I'd love to see Rick out there with a flag...
Chopping Down The Tree Really Meant Something the First couple of seasons

d'kid

 

[Terry]

Ok, time for two cents worth from the cornfield--as far as Nascar goes, they had two stellar, down to the last lap points battles in the Truck and Busch (Nationwide, whatever the hell it is now) series. Interestingly enough, these two down to the wire championship battles were in Nascar divisions that do not use a "playoff" system. Although Jimmie Johnson had not "locked up" the championship before Homestead, it was pretty much all over but the shoutin'. I know this is not the case all the time, but I thought it was pretty cool to watch the two "non playoff" series battle down to the wire with real excitement and drama, and then watch all the sports shows and the telecast itself of the last Cup race try to cast doubt on whether JJ had it locked or not....all in an effort to build excitement and suspense that just weren't there.

 

[vegasnitro]

I have said all along if that the Chase in NASCAR is so great for the sport, why don't they have it in Busch/Nationwide and Trucks?

NASCAR's numbers are down for myriad reasons. The new car, the schedule realignment and moving away from traditional tracks on traditional dates, the almost complete alienation of the traditional fan base in the deep south, cookie cutter 1.5 mile tri-ovals dominating the schedule, and the astronomical rise in ticket prices in the last few years. NASCAR has sold it's soul chasing the new/big markets and big TV numbers, and the bill will be coming due very shortly.

My point to both NHRA and NASCAR is that no matter how hard they try, auto racing is not a stick and ball sport. It's not as if some yokel was sitting on a bar stool in NYC/Boston/Miami/Any other big city watching the NFL saying to himself "I never watched auto racing before, but now that they have playoff systems, I must tune in".

 

[The Swegian]

Ok, time for two cents worth from the cornfield--as far as Nascar goes, they had two stellar, down to the last lap points battles in the Truck and Busch (Nationwide, whatever the hell it is now) series. Interestingly enough, these two down to the wire championship battles were in Nascar divisions that do not use a "playoff" system. Although Jimmie Johnson had not "locked up" the championship before Homestead, it was pretty much all over but the shoutin'. I know this is not the case all the time, but I thought it was pretty cool to watch the two "non playoff" series battle down to the wire with real excitement and drama, and then watch all the sports shows and the telecast itself of the last Cup race try to cast doubt on whether JJ had it locked or not....all in an effort to build excitement and suspense that just weren't there.

Good points Terry. NASCAR's had its chase now for 5 years and hasn't the champ been pretty much decided heading into the last race in all of those years except the first when Kurt Busch won by a very narrow margin?

 

[mick]

bring back the flag starter - tim mite have won then

keep the 'C' - just add a 'most points' bonus cash award at
the banquet; so racers like tim can walk away with a little 'extra'.
if you win the points and the 'C', you get both.

 

[Bobby]

Not Really on either side as far as the countdown goes.
I am not trying to compare our sport to the NFL, but last year didn't the New England Patriots have the best regular season ever, and they ended up losing to a team that had I think like the 13th best record in the regular season.

True, but at least they got beat by that team heads up..

We don't have playoffs in racing. We pretend to.

A true playoff would be taking the top 8 cars and having a final race.
Three rounds and done.

I still wouldn't like it. Our sport depends on machines to run properly. With football, the human beings get it done or they don't.

With drag racing, a two dollar part can break and ruin a whole season.

It's just not right. It will never be right.

 

[SAS]

The team with the most Wallys should be the Champion.
The team with the most total points should be the Champion.

 

[clwill]

The team with the most Wallys should be the Champion.
The team with the most total points should be the Champion.

Pick one.

They aren't necessarily the same. A team could be in the finals all year and never win one, with the wallys all scattered among the other teams, and they would still have the most points.

 

[SAS]

Pick one.

They aren't necessarily the same. A team could be in the finals all year and never win one, with the wallys all scattered among the other teams, and they would still have the most points.

You are correct , the team with the most points , should be the Champion.
Because it shows effort over an entire year , on many different tracks rather than winning a few at the end.

But it is what it is. There are some past Champs with a very long shelf of Wallys.

 

[Lori]

The current National Dragster has on page 11 a story about past racers that have won the championship with one or less season wins. They were--

Shirl Greer--Funny Car 1974 1 win/8 races
Rob Bruins--Top Fuel 1979 0 wins/10 races
Raymond Beadle--Funny Car 1981 1 win/11 races
Tony Shumacher--Top Fuel 1999 1 win/22 races

There was also a list of drivers who won the championship with just 2 races won during the season. They were--

Richard Tharp--Top Fuel 1976 8 races
Raymond Beadle--Funny Car 1979 10 races
Raymond Beadle--Funny Car 1980 10 races
Mark Oswald--Funny Car 1984 11 races
Andrew Hines--Pro Stock MC 2005 15 races

It stated the current points system replaced the one that was implemented in 1974. Before that time, the season champions were determined by a win at the seaon's final event, The NHRA World Finals. There were many deserving titlists to get the honor, but for some it was not just their only win of the season but of their careers. Thus to remedy that situation, they started the points-based championship until 2007 countdown format.
Just thought I would add this to the discussion. Looks like back in the day you didn't have to even attend all the races, unless at that time there weren't as many on the tour as there are now. That is very likely and I am sure someone here would know more about that than I do.

 

[PJ]

The current National Dragster has on page 11 a story about past racers that have won the championship with one or less season wins. They were--

Shirl Greer--Funny Car 1974 1 win/8 races
Rob Bruins--Top Fuel 1979 0 wins/10 races
Raymond Beadle--Funny Car 1981 1 win/11 races
Tony Shumacher--Top Fuel 1999 1 win/22 races

There was also a list of drivers who won the championship with just 2 races won during the season. They were--

Richard Tharp--Top Fuel 1976 8 races
Raymond Beadle--Funny Car 1979 10 races
Raymond Beadle--Funny Car 1980 10 races
Mark Oswald--Funny Car 1984 11 races
Andrew Hines--Pro Stock MC 2005 15 races

It stated the current points system replaced the one that was implemented in 1974. Before that time, the season champions were determined by a win at the seaon's final event, The NHRA World Finals. There were many deserving titlists to get the honor, but for some it was not just their only win of the season but of their careers. Thus to remedy that situation, they started the points-based championship until 2007 countdown format.
Just thought I would add this to the discussion. Looks like back in the day you didn't have to even attend all the races, unless at that time there weren't as many on the tour as there are now. That is very likely and I am sure someone here would know more about that than I do.

Good info, some extra stuff to add to it. First you are right there were not near as many races then as their are now. Depending on the year the number will vary. I remember only about 10 races in the early 80's. Plus not as many teams made the full tour. Also a big point is that in the 70's and I believe into the 80's (someone will remember the year) the pros could race at divisional events and earn points there which is how Bruins won the title. He beat everybody up in div 6 then did ok on the national event tour. Also there were extra 1/2 point events such as the pop hot rod meet in Martin Michigan and there was a second one I think at Firebird. Of ocurse Indy was point and a half then but thats another story

Schumacher didn't get his first win until very late in the year, the difference between then and what happened this year is that he showed great consistency over the entire year, 22 races, a full season not 1/4 of it as happened now

 

[d'kid]

Try Winters, Spring, Summer Indy and the 'World Finals', you had to finish in the top three in your Division to even go to the World Finals... and the Gators weren't even thought of yet....

d'kid

 

[PJ]

Try Winters, Spring, Summer Indy and the 'World Finals', you had to finish in the top three in your Division to even go to the World Finals... and the Gators weren't even thought of yet....

d'kid

did they have engines then or was it the old Flintstones way

 

[d'kid]

whales, elephants, and even a few rats...

Bet you've even heard of some of the Flopper and Pipe-rack shoes from that Era...

d'kid

 

[my friends call me Zappy]

To answer the 1st post question...NO I hate the cd system. they changed it the second year, still hate it. There is NO fixing it. To remove points earnd and oil down credits earnd is just NOT RIGHT. Why do they penalize the #1 teams for doing well???

I agree why do the cd cars race non-cd cars??? Also not fair.

The Q 12 system is wrong too. Example: Fri. you place 13th. It doesn't count.
Sat. you don't get down the track. Another car goes far slower then yer Fri. run, but does it on Sat. So he races on Sun. with a slower Q time then you, but you don't run Sun. Try explaining THAT to a sponsor....

And they wonder why they are leaving our sport......

 

[.]

did they have engines then or was it the old Flintstones way

Larry Fullerton. 1972. World Champ.

Won 1 race.

The World Finals.

You guys would complain, especially the whiners about the countdown, about those days.

1 Race + 1 Win = World Champ.


Flinstones? I hardly think so PJ.

You, of all people would not like that one.