With the NJ State Police handling the investigation, it will be crystal clear what happened and I assume E-Town and the NHRA will take corrective action if necessary.
Improving NHRA Safety... (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter RJM323
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With the NJ State Police handling the investigation, it will be crystal clear what happened and I assume E-Town and the NHRA will take corrective action if necessary.
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
Please post the results from the investigation. Until then, you can only lose with your theories. Hi Rex.
The 'sand trap' should SAVE you.
NOT KILL you?
That is the point here. I cannot understand why it cannot be conveyed.
BTW, he did hit his chutes, a fellow 'mater here recorded it from the stands, they did not fully deploy.
I also know that TAFC's DO NOT slow down, they are are about the slipperiest things on the planet, that is from personal experience.
We have "lost" nothing except two great lives.
We both know you will defend E-town to the grave.
there is PROOF otherwise.
Hi Bob
REX
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
I haven't seen any TF or FC's hit the sand trap since. Rob Geiger was on Wind Tunnel last night and he hinted the NHRA was looking to go 1,000ft racing in TA categories and PM.
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
IMO, there are plenty of tracks that can handle 1320' with the alky cars, and even TF & FC.
This has all been foisted upon us by disasters that have happened at one archaic, dinosaur of a track.
And E-Town USED to be my favorite of all.
Those days are looooooong gone.
Last years double TAFC 'incidents', surely should have been the handwriting on the wall............
Because of 'that place', everyone else, EVERYWHERE else, has to pay.......
REX
Bob
Nitro Member
The 'sand trap' should SAVE you.
NOT KILL you?
That is the point here. I cannot understand why it cannot be conveyed.
BTW, he did hit his chutes, a fellow 'mater here recorded it from the stands, they did not fully deploy.
I also know that TAFC's DO NOT slow down, they are are about the slipperiest things on the planet, that is from personal experience.
We have "lost" nothing except two great lives.
We both know you will defend E-town to the grave.
there is PROOF otherwise.
Hi Bob
REX
Show us that he pulled the chutes.
Several months ago at PBIR a young guy in his stock Vette never hit the brakes. No one knows why he didn't. He crossed the finish line at around 108MPH. He went through the traps and is now in a vegetative state.
Am I now defending PBIR or attacking them? Nope. Accidents happen and you don't have a clue what happened Fri.
Corvette crashed at PBIR 1/6/10
Bob
Nitro Member
Larry Dixon said that E-Town is a safe track. Go argue with the drivers. Did you miss the interview? Two AFC drivers walked away last year. Proof that E-Town is safe. Give it up Rex, you can only lose.
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
Larry Dixon said that E-Town is a safe track. Go argue with the drivers. Did you miss the interview? Two AFC drivers walked away last year. Proof that E-Town is safe. Give it up Rex, you can only lose.
No, actually, he did not, he said to paraphrase, "when i get strapped in that car I feel like i can take on the world".
He did not specify E-Town was safe, nor was he asked that specific question.
And I KNOW alky drivers that DON'T like the place.
they race there because of the schedule, the venue, and points.
What is this "lose" crap.
you would defend E-town if they were losing a driver a week.
And last year?
those were two very nasty miracles that happened back to back.
Never should have happened at all, at least not with the violence and magnitude that they did.............
REX
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
They get tangled in the wheelie bars.
The pilot pulls them down out of the air.
The air behind the car is 'dirty'
Plus a million other reasons.
you will NEVER avoid a chute failure.......I had one at Hawley's at speed.
Went to the end of Gainsville
before I stopped, 100' short of the sand,.....BTW.REX
They get tangled in the wheelie bars.
The pilot pulls them down out of the air.
The air behind the car is 'dirty'
Plus a million other reasons.
you will NEVER avoid a chute failure.......I had one at Hawley's at speed.
Went to the end of Gainsville
REX
POssibly, but I can't remember the last time I saw a Team Force car's or a DSR car's chute fail. They are doing something right!
Nemo
Nitro Member
That is one nice think about Stroud chutes, the d-bag helps keep all the lines and canopy out of stuff till it's ready for air to hit it. I think the Deist with the rubber bands may do some good too. As far as I now most the other manufactures fold the lines into the canopy to keep them out of things till they get away from the car. When you watch it on TV they work 99% of the time but every once in a while they just (especially on the funny cars) get sucked under the body and there is no overcoming it. Wonder if the launcher system like PS uses would get them up in the air better. Maybe shoot them out the back window area (or off the side such as the Force cars do) would keep them in clean air.
Meeks
Nitro Member
If chute failure is something that can't be avoided then the next point of concern and/or contact needs to be addressed: the shutdown. That IS something that can be fixed and not something that is relied on by each driver/crew to ensure they do it correctly.
Accidents are going to happen- it's unfortunate but they are going to happen every now and then. That doesn't mean they need to result in death. I still don't think that is an acceptable reason to not improve the shutdown area at ALLtracks.
They've continually improved safety equipment in the car and on the driver..they should continue to improve safety outside of the car as well. From some of the answers received here and elsewhere, the next fatality that happens people are just going to say "accidents happen". In my opinion, this could have been avoided.
For longer tracks there doesn't need to be quite as extensive shutdown equipment (not sure if that's the right word or not) because they have the additional track surface to use. The shorter tracks that can't expand their surface need to have a better shutdown to help the cars that occasionally can't stop.
If the tracks don't want to put forth the time, effort, and money to improve this then NHRA and any other organization that this might pose a danger to should tell them "see ya later". If the continued safety of drivers isn't important enough for the few days that a huge risk is put up to quite possibly need that extra shutdown then the revenue they gain from the event isn't important either. This goes for all tracks that have this problem, not just Englishtown.
Accidents are going to happen- it's unfortunate but they are going to happen every now and then. That doesn't mean they need to result in death. I still don't think that is an acceptable reason to not improve the shutdown area at ALLtracks.
They've continually improved safety equipment in the car and on the driver..they should continue to improve safety outside of the car as well. From some of the answers received here and elsewhere, the next fatality that happens people are just going to say "accidents happen". In my opinion, this could have been avoided.
For longer tracks there doesn't need to be quite as extensive shutdown equipment (not sure if that's the right word or not) because they have the additional track surface to use. The shorter tracks that can't expand their surface need to have a better shutdown to help the cars that occasionally can't stop.
If the tracks don't want to put forth the time, effort, and money to improve this then NHRA and any other organization that this might pose a danger to should tell them "see ya later". If the continued safety of drivers isn't important enough for the few days that a huge risk is put up to quite possibly need that extra shutdown then the revenue they gain from the event isn't important either. This goes for all tracks that have this problem, not just Englishtown.
Rexfiles
Nitro Member
Silly Savage
Nitro Member
This is why I mounted my parachute on the back on the roll cage and tilted up slightly on my altered; not on the deck of the bantam body. Only 2 rear disc brakes and doing 170-180mph and no parachute problems yet...knock on wood. I believe the air behind the funny car spoiler is bad....the air is coming off the spoiler and going up....chute deploys and goes out and down into dirty air and the chute bounces off the wheelie bars. One simplistic thought....bigger parachutes....remember those parachute back in the day that looked like the size of a circus tent???? Mount the 'chutes aimed up towards the air above the body instead of the air coming from under the car???? I have no great answers, just ideas.....
Silly Savage
Nitro Member
Exactly....I use this chute and it works perfect and is very smooth.
I saw the chute deployment system that I believe Dennis Taylor sales...popular on some of the aly F/C's....maybe another idea to look at.
On a side note, I witnessed John Shoemaker's last pass at Bakersfield and I am not sure what improvements would have helped there. It is believed he was out during the run, car was at full throttle well pass the finish line. Motor blew, but was still at speed when he hit the sand trap...all the sand did was to grab the nose of the car and make it vault over the ramaining trap area and the car flew into the orchards at the end of the track. No chutes, no brakes. That front engine dragster would have cut through just about any kind of net at that speed......just an onservation.
FC138fan
Nitro Member
Couple of comments I thought of, now that some time has passed and theres a thread for comments about the safety concerns as a result of Friday's incident.
With unfortunate proof that a car going 250 at the 1/4 can still result in a fatality - even with the safety improvements at all tracks, and conclusive evidence that nitro cars are still having catastrophic explosions on a regular basis at 1000'... what is the reason the Nitro classes are running 1000 feet over the full quarter?
If the problem of a Kalitta incident would happen at 1000' today (catastrophic failure resulting in driver loss of consciousness), it was shown Friday that the result could be fatal. If the problem of Friday's incident would happen (not sure what happened there, but it didnt result from catastrophic failure), the results could be fatal. Both incidents had one thing in common (although perhaps under different circumstances), no way of slowing the car down after a run... in both incidents I don't think an extra 320' would have made the result different.
What Im saying is, we now know that the argument that 1000' reducing catastrophic failures isn't valid due to the number of explosions as of late.
Also, that extra 320' of shutdown wouldn't do any good in the event of a chute/brake failure (Friday's speed at the quarter was 250, and a fuel car on a good run shutting down at 1000' I would think would be going at least that at the 1420') making that argument invalid.
So why are they still running 1000 feet over 1320'? I don't know the answer (I do have some thoughts), but I don't believe the problem lies with the car, it lies with the track. It is therefore it is a fallacy to be running at 1000' giving racers and fans a false sence of security.
With unfortunate proof that a car going 250 at the 1/4 can still result in a fatality - even with the safety improvements at all tracks, and conclusive evidence that nitro cars are still having catastrophic explosions on a regular basis at 1000'... what is the reason the Nitro classes are running 1000 feet over the full quarter?
If the problem of a Kalitta incident would happen at 1000' today (catastrophic failure resulting in driver loss of consciousness), it was shown Friday that the result could be fatal. If the problem of Friday's incident would happen (not sure what happened there, but it didnt result from catastrophic failure), the results could be fatal. Both incidents had one thing in common (although perhaps under different circumstances), no way of slowing the car down after a run... in both incidents I don't think an extra 320' would have made the result different.
What Im saying is, we now know that the argument that 1000' reducing catastrophic failures isn't valid due to the number of explosions as of late.
Also, that extra 320' of shutdown wouldn't do any good in the event of a chute/brake failure (Friday's speed at the quarter was 250, and a fuel car on a good run shutting down at 1000' I would think would be going at least that at the 1420') making that argument invalid.
So why are they still running 1000 feet over 1320'? I don't know the answer (I do have some thoughts), but I don't believe the problem lies with the car, it lies with the track. It is therefore it is a fallacy to be running at 1000' giving racers and fans a false sence of security.
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