Interesting stuff on track safety (1 Viewer)

[JF]

I asked Al Kenny (current SC World Champion) one time why he wears his Hans in Super Comp it’s not required?

His answer was:
Imagine a Movie production company bought your car and then asked you to drive it in an action scene.
But they told you at the finish line around 175-80 MPH they are going to blow out the tire and to give it some spectacular effect they are going to set it on fire as they flip the car upside down at 175-80MPH.

So what would you wear he asked?

I said, I would have on the best safety equipment available, Hans, 15 suit, Gloves, Nomex underwear, Everything!

He said so why aren’t you? The same thing can happen on any run you make down that track.

Something to think about!

 

[Gordon]

So The answer is YES you should wear a Hans at any speed.

Although I will admit. I owned one and never wore it. MY Choice! But to answer the question YOU SHOULD WEAR ONE AT ANY SPEED IN ANY CAR STREET OR STRIP. IT'S JUST NOT PRACTICAL TO DO SO.

All of the information in your post was excellent, but I deleted it from the quote to save space. The point I saved is the one that matters. It shouldn't be the governing bodies responsibility to teach you all of that, nor force you to protect yourself by mandating a HANS device for ALL drivers. One could argue that for anyone under the age of 18 they should be mandatory, but even then I would put the onus on the parent.

I asked Al Kenny (current SC World Champion) one time why he wears his Hans in Super Comp it’s not required?

Al took necessary precautions to protect himself without relying on someone else to do it for him. This is what I'm saying should be the standard.

 

[sdwarf36]

I'd be fine with everyone making their own choices--if we lived in a society where some lawyer can't come in + sue someone (car owner-track-sanctioning body-sponsors on the side of the car-etc.) for a persons wrong choice. "You mean there was equipment availible that might have saved his life-you knew this and you didnt require them to wear it? You make them wear a helmet-correct?--and firesuit correct? And you think that making them buy a $600 piece to drive a $75k race would be too much of a financial burden on the driver?" I know I'd hate to be up against a lawyer asking these questions.

 

[TooTall999]

Nope Gordon- I am in complete agreement. There are basic rules to keep everyone that straps in safe, and then there are high priced items that are available as options. I'd say that if you can make a decision, its your ass on the line.
Give me a truly affordable HANS and I'll be the first person to vote for its widespread use, on everyone that has to put on a brain bucket to go down the track.

Affordable Hans? If you ask me a $600 Hans is pretty affordable compared to an irreplaceable neck...just sayin'

 

[vegasnitro]

What of the drag racing fatalities where the driver was wearing a HANS? The article mentions the feasability of SAFER barriers, but they would not have changed the outcomes for Medlen or Kalitta either, and both of those men were wearing a HANS.

I think this study is not very particular about the types of accidents that cause fatalities in Drag Racing, only that they want to sell more HANS devices to drag racers.

I agree with MM ... no solution to the problem, then there is no value to the study.

 

[sdwarf36]

I'd be fine with everyone making their own choices--if we lived in a society where some lawyer can't come in + sue someone (car owner-track-sanctioning body-sponsors on the side of the car-etc.) for a persons wrong choice. "You mean there was equipment availible that might have saved his life-you knew this and you didnt require them to wear it? You make them wear a helmet-correct?--and firesuit correct? And you think that making them buy a $600 piece to drive a $75k race would be too much of a financial burden on the driver?" I know I'd hate to be up against a lawyer asking these questions.

 

[Gordon]

I'd be fine with everyone making their own choices--if we lived in a society where some lawyer can't come in + sue someone (car owner-track-sanctioning body-sponsors on the side of the car-etc.) for a persons wrong choice. "You mean there was equipment availible that might have saved his life-you knew this and you didnt require them to wear it? You make them wear a helmet-correct?--and firesuit correct? And you think that making them buy a $600 piece to drive a $75k race would be too much of a financial burden on the driver?" I know I'd hate to be up against a lawyer asking these questions.

I can't say I necessarily disagree with you, but if I write what I'm really thinking this thread will either be deleted altogether, or at a minimum moved to the politics room. In summary, however, I will say this - "We the people" allowed government (governing bodies in this case) to start legislating common sense & morality, and now "we the people" are suffereing the consequences.

 

[Dave]

I'd be fine with everyone making their own choices--if we lived in a society where some lawyer can't come in + sue someone (car owner-track-sanctioning body-sponsors on the side of the car-etc.) for a persons wrong choice. "You mean there was equipment availible that might have saved his life-you knew this and you didnt require them to wear it? You make them wear a helmet-correct?--and firesuit correct? And you think that making them buy a $600 piece to drive a $75k race would be too much of a financial burden on the driver?" I know I'd hate to be up against a lawyer asking these questions.

I think you have it backwards. It's more "They had a choice to protect themselves better and did not, therefore the sanctioning body washes its hands of it." The reason being, if they were required, and a driver died wearing all required things.. Then here comes the lawsuit. Well he was required to wear this per your safety rules and still died.. then the bloodthirsty lawyers look for negligence.

 

[yoda]

Question to the posters in this thread:

How much have you spent on your race car this year?
(stopped counting after $9K this year)

Have you ever balled one up?
(yeah- still sorry about that Gary)

Lots of folks spend other people's money here pretty freely...

I'm wondering how many of the deaths/ disabling injuries occuring in modern drag racing would have been prevented by the application of a HANS? Particularly over the support offered by a responsible safety manufacturer for a functional piece of equipment. I absolutely am placing an order for the REASONABLY PRICED piece of safety equipment, whereas before I needed to absolutely budget it into the operating cost because it was absolutely prohibitive (probably because of the lawyers...). Its one more $$ add over the 45.1 padding, the 3" belts, the proper application helmet over one offered for protection when your riding your quad or dirt bike... Hope to never put any of that into use, but I imagine that if something was to happen, just short of never actually being in a race car, the odds are already greatly reduced for catastrophic incident based on the equipment that is already REQUIRED by the sanctioning bodies...

I've said it before, and I'll say it again- its as safe as it can be, but it wont be entirely safe until the human element (drivers, crews and spectators) are entirely eliminated from the equasion.

 

[yoda]

What of the drag racing fatalities where the driver was wearing a HANS? The article mentions the feasability of SAFER barriers, but they would not have changed the outcomes for Medlen or Kalitta either, and both of those men were wearing a HANS.

I think this study is not very particular about the types of accidents that cause fatalities in Drag Racing, only that they want to sell more HANS devices to drag racers.

I agree with MM ... no solution to the problem, then there is no value to the study.

**Like**

 

[stitcherbob]

Maybe the price of a top of the line model HANS device would come down if it was mandated in all classes of racing? The more they sell, the cheaper manufacturing could be.

But, I'm sure the insurance policies the safety equipment companies have to carry is at least 1/2 the reason costs are what they are.....

 

[funnycarguy]

I agree with Sherman...we have seen multiple times where fatalities occur regardless of the signed waiver, and a lawsuit occurs. I think calculated risk at slower et's should not be prohibitive to bringing new racers into the sport. We have all been to divisional races never mind National events, where finding a pit spot is difficult. Never used to be a couple decades ago. That is due to the endless stream of Toter and motorhomes worth in many cases hundred of thousands of dollars towing race vehicles with engines worth 25 to 50 thousand plus even in the super classes.....I see they are also discussing hans devices for junior dragsters. Considering that some of them would beat a stock 427 chevelle to half track it may be time to look at this too.

Individual choice would be just fine if everyone else didn't have to deal with the tragedies we are talking about. Even with the highest rated firesuit we knocked the rods out of the motor on a long shift at 10,000 plus in a funny car and the heat thru the firewall was very uncomfortable and even discolored the suit. Well wrecked it actually. So a $600 Hans looks pretty cheap in the overall scheme of things. Not everyone sees it that way but it doesn't make sense to not spend the money on a Hans if you have a 100 to million dollar investment in a race team.

 

[Jeff]

We bought a HANS on a Monday after seeing a guy 2 cars ahead of us break and axle in a local track TNT and die from what looked like a pretty minor tag off the side wall on a Sunday. The worst accidents are the ones where you see the emergency crew slow down their movements 10 seconds after reaching the car. Must have been 5 years ago because our HANS was just re-certified earlier this year. Now it and a /15 suit are mandatory in our class.

Both of my boys have Leatt braces for motocross. Went searching a few minutes ago and they don't seem to offer a motosports version anymore, but I recall a few years back when they offered SFI certified devices at a fraction of the cost of a HANS. They looked a lot like the motocross ones, I didn't like em because you tend to lay back in a racecar and they try to limit the forward motion of your helmet ... you may not be able to look down at your dash and you definitely didn't want to drop a glove on the floor!

HANs and a 5lb fire bottle are pretty easy safety investments. Safety has its own line in our annual racing budget.

I'm sure some of the tracks tap dance around their desire to have the sanctioning body broadly mandate these. Many make their money on the Wed/Friday TNT crowd where safety equipment (and sometime safety period) oftentimes are nowhere to be found.

Unfortunately, there is not much profit in our sport, and the more you mandate, the more you tend to stifle demand.

 

[Joker]

Hey Jeff, my brother just told me yalls dragster is on racingjunk. Yall getting out or getting something new?

 

[jm]

Speaking of safety, it has been years that I have wondered why PSM
riders are not required to wear spine protection like the AMA and World
F-1, or Moto X riders wear. It just seems to me that if a PSM guy goes
off {Katie Sullivan, Doug Horne}, that you would want not only the head
protection, but the neck and spine protection that is available.
Do any of you guys have any insight on this?

John

 

[yoda]

Could this be the reason that the HANS guy was perking up about safety and the need for his product?:

Head and Neck Restraints | Systems | Equipment | NecksGen.com

(Competition is good...)

 

[Shaggy]

The study is wrong to begin with in a way because you can not group circle track racing with drag racing... Two totally different animals...

Safer barriers dont work for the needed impact in drag racing so they are no good...

And a Hans only works in certain impact situations as well... This alone is why there is no need to mandate it for all racers...

 

[JF]

The study is wrong to begin with in a way because you can not group circle track racing with drag racing... Two totally different animals...

Safer barriers dont work for the needed impact in drag racing so they are no good...

And a Hans only works in certain impact situations as well... This alone is why there is no need to mandate it for all racers...

And you got your medical degree where?

 

[MM]

And a Hans only works in certain impact situations as well... This alone is why there is no need to mandate it for all racers...

A firesuit only works when you're on fire......

 

[yoda]

A firesuit only works when you're on fire......

I don't know... They work pretty good on Ash , Britt and Court in the pits... ;-)