George Bryce speaks his mind on the Pro Stock Bike Situation

[twostep]

While 99.9% of HD's line up is the ancient v twin pushrod 2 valve (same as the Buell) the V Rod in real life IS a v twin 4 valve ohc.

A 2012 Mustang GT is a DOHC 4-valver, too, but the last time I checked NHRA won't allow a 500-inch version of this engine to compete in Pro Stock Car. Even if Ford waved $800K in NHRA's face, I believe they'd still say no. As they should.

If it were all left up to me, first I'd temporarily bandaid the issue with 20 pounds added to the two Harleys. The next thing I'd do is sit down with the HD suits and convince them that if PSM is to continue, they're going to have to allow other competitors to run their brand and have equal access to whatever it is they're now supplying Vance and Hines. Nobody's saying V&H should be forced to share their own technology. What we are saying is that everyone should at least have an opportunity to compete on a Harley VRod. Whether or not it's competitive is still up to the team developing it, just as it should be.

 

[Rat]

Although several teams do lease pro stock engines..Vance and Hines- Harley won't let anyone else race a v-rod motor. You can't buy one, you can't lease one. Unless you're name is Andrew Hines or Eddie Kraewic, you ain't riding one.

That's not even the point. I care less who gets to run what, who gets to buy what, what's released and what's not cause none of the matters. If there is proper parity in place it would make no difference what you run, what you have in it, and if others can buy it. No team is "EVIL" and should be forced to sell/show anything. The NHRA takes the cake on this one for not bringing parity into the class. 1 race is the margin of error that should be allowed before a parity update. It works in pro-mod perfectly. NHRA just never runs this class with the same model of rules as PM, again it does not matter who has what or how improved the availability of parts are in that class. PM is not ran crooked like PSM and that's why the most you ever see in PM is 1 out of hand race before a parity update and PSM needs to be run like this. Unless the NHRA gets ethics, your never gonna see it happen.

 

[theraceman]

A lot of us don't give a flip about the PSB situation. In fact many would never miss it if PSB just faded away. In a year or two we might realize we hadn't seen it them a while...lean back in our recliner and smile all the while thinking life is good. Not critizing or complaining just expressing an opinion.

Are you a racer?

 

[sdwarf36]

A 2012 Mustang GT is a DOHC 4-valver, too, but the last time I checked NHRA won't allow a 500-inch version of this engine to compete in Pro Stock Car. Even if Ford waved $800K in NHRA's face, I believe they'd still say no. As they should.

If it were all left up to me, first I'd temporarily bandaid the issue with 20 pounds added to the two Harleys. The next thing I'd do is sit down with the HD suits and convince them that if PSM is to continue, they're going to have to allow other competitors to run their brand and have equal access to whatever it is they're now supplying Vance and Hines. Nobody's saying V&H should be forced to share their own technology. What we are saying is that everyone should at least have an opportunity to compete on a Harley VRod. Whether or not it's competitive is still up to the team developing it, just as it should be.

It was more in response to the post above mine "" Simply put, engines such as Buell's, which are in essence the same platform as HDs, should be allowed the same mods. IMO ""--I was in no way justifying it.

 

[silverback]

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Waters
A lot of us don't give a flip about the PSB situation. In fact many would never miss it if PSB just faded away. In a year or two we might realize we hadn't seen it them a while...lean back in our recliner and smile all the while thinking life is good. Not critizing or complaining just expressing an opinion.

Originally posted by Donnie Durenburger
Are you a racer?

Doubt it.

 

[TooTall999]

That's not even the point. I care less who gets to run what, who gets to buy what, what's released and what's not cause none of the matters. If there is proper parity in place it would make no difference what you run, what you have in it, and if others can buy it. No team is "EVIL" and should be forced to sell/show anything. The NHRA takes the cake on this one for not bringing parity into the class. 1 race is the margin of error that should be allowed before a parity update. It works in pro-mod perfectly. NHRA just never runs this class with the same model of rules as PM, again it does not matter who has what or how improved the availability of parts are in that class. PM is not ran crooked like PSM and that's why the most you ever see in PM is 1 out of hand race before a parity update and PSM needs to be run like this. Unless the NHRA gets ethics, your never gonna see it happen.

It is the point..nobody else can buy the parts to race a v-rod Harley..Vance and Hines have an exclusive. What if one team in either Top Fuel or Funny Car had exclusive rights to race an engine based on a Mopar hemi? This is the bottom line..no one team should have exclusive rights to a particular engine combination.

 

[theraceman]

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Waters
A lot of us don't give a flip about the PSB situation. In fact many would never miss it if PSB just faded away. In a year or two we might realize we hadn't seen it them a while...lean back in our recliner and smile all the while thinking life is good. Not critizing or complaining just expressing an opinion.

Originally posted by Donnie Durenburger
Are you a racer?

Doubt it.

I dont care for Indy Car racing... but I can't imagine going on a Indy Car site / thread and telling them I hope they go away. Retarded.

Some of you need to get out of the house.

 

[Muddy]

I dont care for Indy Car racing... but I can't imagine going on a Indy Car site / thread and telling them I hope they go away. Retarded.

Some of you need to get out of the house.

Last ttime I looked this was called NITROmater not PSBmater. Seems you need to go to a PSB site.

I've never been a MC racer and never wanted to be. The answer to your question is yes. Everything from very slow door cars to fuel dragsters.

 

[theraceman]

The answer to your question is yes. Everything from very slow door cars to fuel dragsters.

I think those classes are stupid and a waste of time, and no one will even notice when they go away.

 

[Rat]

It is the point..nobody else can buy the parts to race a v-rod Harley..Vance and Hines have an exclusive. What if one team in either Top Fuel or Funny Car had exclusive rights to race an engine based on a Mopar hemi? This is the bottom line..no one team should have exclusive rights to a particular engine combination.

Again...It's not the point because teams should not have to show what they perfected. You talk about your points about top fuel, funny car, think about pro-stock; you possibly can buy those parts, but in no way will it run right out of the box like the teams that have them. If you have a TF team and run an AJ500, are you going to run like Alan Johnson tuned you? So what it can't be bought, a small chunk is that it's "exclusive" as the bigger chunk is the talent running it.

Is this class on the end of a rope because of one team with 2 bikes and what they have? No. It means nothing what bikes they have, what motors they have, and if you can buy them or not, this is not why the class is going to hell right now. Parity is the 1 thing that the class lacks that needs to be brought back and monitored correctly. If parity is back in the class and ran with an iron fist, it would not matter one damn but what your competitor had than was not for sale. I personally dont see why the hell that matters when 1 word, parity, could settle it all.

 

[Rat]

I don't care for the S/C and S/G but they are classes filled with racers who pour their heart and paychecks into their program. If your drag racing, I may not care for the class, but I admire and respect the passion and no class should just be left to die. I don't stay awake at night if I miss a PSM round, but I'm a fan of all drag racing and it's kinda not right if you don't support a change for the betterment of this class. With no support they may be downgraded to racing to 330 feet on trikes with no motors.

 

[Muddy]

I think those classes are stupid and a waste of time, and no one will even notice when they go away.

I would imagine you do!!!

 

[TooTall999]

Again...It's not the point because teams should not have to show what they perfected. You talk about your points about top fuel, funny car, think about pro-stock; you possibly can buy those parts, but in no way will it run right out of the box like the teams that have them. If you have a TF team and run an AJ500, are you going to run like Alan Johnson tuned you? So what it can't be bought, a small chunk is that it's "exclusive" as the bigger chunk is the talent running it.

Is this class on the end of a rope because of one team with 2 bikes and what they have? No. It means nothing what bikes they have, what motors they have, and if you can buy them or not, this is not why the class is going to hell right now. Parity is the 1 thing that the class lacks that needs to be brought back and monitored correctly. If parity is back in the class and ran with an iron fist, it would not matter one damn but what your competitor had than was not for sale. I personally dont see why the hell that matters when 1 word, parity, could settle it all.

But the point George Bryce is making is that nobody can buy the parts to build an overhead cam, 4 valve per cylinder ,V-rod Pro Stock motorcycle. If somebody wanted to race in any other Pro class, they would have access to the same raw parts as any other team. Not the case with PSM, where only Vance and Hines have access to the parts(engines, heads, bodies,etc.) that NOBODY else can buy. He's not asking for a Vance and Hines motor, or their heads, he wants to have the ability to build and develop a Harley V-rod, 4 valve per cylinder, overhead cam, Pro Stock motorcycle.

 

[Tony]

Tony,

Do you think the DRCE2, DRCE3 and the HEMI have the same block and heads?

Alan

Alan, what I meant, and I thought would be assumed, is that Pro Stock engines are the same basic block configuration, number of valves, same induction systems, cubic inch limits and the cars have the same minimum vehicle weight. The Pro Stock motorcycle class has various available block configurations (v-twin vs. in-line), number of valves, carbs vs injection, cubic inch differences and different weights based on engine configurations. In my opinion, this isn't a very effecient way to run a PROFESSIONAL class. The NHRA does a great job, in my opinion, with the blown vs alcohol issue in the alcohol dragster class, but there will never be true parity.

 

[Nick Name]

Tony,

Do you think the DRCE2, DRCE3 and the HEMI have the same block and heads?

Alan

No, but they are the same configuration. Alan, you always seem like you don't really understand what these threads are about. Do you do that on purpose just to pull everyones chain?

 

[daveo]

Bring in Burt Munro, on his Indian Motorcycle. No one could hold a candle to that Man!

 

[elvis]

No, but they are the same configuration. Alan, you always seem like you don't really understand what these threads are about. Do you do that on purpose just to pull everyones chain?

He does that to make NHRA look right and everybody else stoopid.

 

[sdwarf36]

He does that to make NHRA look right and everybody else stoopid.

Now now-Alan is entitled to his opinion + has the same right to share it here as anyone else that paid the buck.
Now that I said nice things about you , can you give a couple honest answers about PS (car) ?
How much HP difference do you think there is between the top ten cars?
Can you think of any time that a top team had a 10% hp advantage over the field?

 

[elvis]

How much HP difference do you think there is between the top ten cars?
Can you think of any time that a top team had a 10% hp advantage over the field?

1) 50h.p.
2) Yes. Wayne County Speed Shop had an advantage....

And yes, Alan is entitled to his opinion, but he most certainly paints NHRA in a perfect light every time. But hey, when they supply the butter for your bread....

 

[Sean D, shondoo]

2) Yes. Wayne County Speed Shop had an advantage....

LMAO!!!

Well played, Mr. Goss!

Sean D