team summit and the pit "curtains" (1 Viewer)

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Those pics are why I buy from JEGS. "Team Summit" have taken this too far in my opinion.

Just makes you wonder what they are hiding. :rolleyes:

Steve, I called my brother who is a die hard drag racing fan, and a recent graduate of an automotive vocational school (WYOTECH) and he said the same thing. I'll have to admit, I wondered the same thing too.
 
Just makes you wonder what they are hiding. :rolleyes:


Why wonder? It's obvious to me.

They have invented something that is helping their performance. Just a couple of looks by a competitor would give away the idea. They choose not to share their advance with the rest of the class, nor should they.

If you're hinting that they are doing something illegal, that's really hilarious. If you've been in the pits very long, you would know that:

1. The car gets teched at the start of every race, and sometimes at random times within the race. Cars with the dominating performances of the Summit racers get looked at a LOT more than others in the class.

2. Tech can and will enter their pits at any time and enter any area whether roped off, curtained, or otherwise hidden from view.

It's no different from the rear quarter panel covers that have been used for quite a while. Obviously, there is some development in the rear suspension that the teams intend to keep to themselves. I've yet to hear any bitching about those.

Jon Asher and I agree on most things, but this is not one of them. NO ONE in racing allows their competitors unlimited access to their R&D area in their shops just due to the secrets that could be divulged simply by the naked eye. This is the same thing. I once toured the Petty shops and my guide emphatically told me, "Glance at anything you want, but if you stare at anything we're leaving."

I can't speak for the team, but would bet anything I have that a view into the pits will never be totally obstructed. It would serve no purpose since you're going to have to have the ready-to-race car exposed when in staging and on the track.

On the other hand, I would expect them to hide their secrets when the cars are disassembled.

This is really nothing new. I can remember years ago when new clutches were being developed that various clutch workers were working inside a car while it was totally masked by a car cover.
 
My guess is...

Instead of using 2 four barrel Holleys they've either switched to Quadrajets or they are using 8 one barrel carbs to better tune each cylinder
:p:);):D
 
I agree with Jon Asher. I took a buddy of mine who had never been to an NHRA race. He saw the curtains and then made a call to his dad who always buys from Summit -- and told him right then and there standing in front of their pits..."Don't buy from Summit anymore, these guys are a bunch of jerks. You need to buy from JEGS." If he thinks that way, I wonder how many other people do too.

I will say this. Greg and Jason NEVER had as many people next to their pits as Jeg Coughlin and Dave Connolly did.
 
those 'jerks' on the summit team sure are attracting a lot of attention lately....... for themselves, for their sponsor and for the class.
surely this team has adequate funding, but money alone does not win
races, nor does it advance the class.
Here's a group of guys who are leading, not following
what do you think mr. force has been doing for the last 15 years in FC!?
what do you think takes more money....innovate or imitate!?
 
I don't see any problem with the way the curtains are.

As a fan..I'm not going to stand there and yell.."HEY..I CAN'T SEE WHAT YOU'RE DOING!!"

I figure the curtains aren't for denying my access..
 
I don't see any problem with the way the curtains are.

As a fan..I'm not going to stand there and yell.."HEY..I CAN'T SEE WHAT YOU'RE DOING!!"

I figure the curtains aren't for denying my access..

I agree.... but..... wanna bet there will be some 'folks' who WILL stand there and yell that now that such a big issue has been made of it all! Geezaloo!
 
I wasn't there, but judging from the pics, the curtains only hide the engine bay. Crews don't thrash on PS cars like nitro cars, so there isn't as much to see anyway. But the pit is still open at at the ropes, so fans can still hang and wait for Greg or Jason or whoever to become available like any other driver. Just my 2 cents, but it doesn't look like they're being jerks. If they were rude or refused to sign cards or anything like that, it would be a different story, but it seems like a big deal being made out of nothing.
 
If you are talking about the hundreds of weekly races across the country, ummm, then yes. Both as a paying spectator, and as an Entrant. Just about every Racetrack has a NASCAR sanction, so the tracks can hold Street Stock, Modifieds, and Late Model races. Spec Trucks are not a NASCAR class, but you still need a Pit Pass for access. BTW, the "Back Gate" money is mainly where the Purse comes from. . .

Hey Foam... Don't you have some gears to make or something..... :p
Point is, is the NASCAR pit access the same as NHRA/IHRA?
 
Why wonder? It's obvious to me.

They have invented something that is helping their performance.

If you've been in the pits very long, you would know that:


Been in the pits for a long time and this is the farthest I have seen anyone take it. (manifolds and suspension aside)

This just screams leave us alone we work for the military and this is top secret. :D
 
In response to Gary Lum, I believe this is one of those instances where a comparison between drag racing and NASCAR may not be relevant.

I have “worked” NASCAR races as a photojournalist and also attended others as a spectator and can state that, at least in my opinion, the distinct LACK of access to the cars and drivers is one of the reasons I prefer drag racing.

I did have a conversation with the team owner regarding the curtains during which he referenced new technical developments as being the reason they were in use. I then suggested the potential negative impact of those with the fans, which he did acknowledge as a real possibility and potential problem. Some of the other posts on this thread outline what those problems can include, i.e., a loss of business for Summit.

I agree with Dan Bennett in that to suggest anything illegal going on is probably completely inaccurate. They’ve just got some stuff going on they don’t want anyone to see.

However, I disagree with Dan on there not having been complaints about the “curtains” over the back of the cars. I hear that from at least one fan at every race, and usually more than one.

I am not suggesting anyone be given unlimited access to everything, but at the same time racers do have an obligation to their sponsors and the sport to be as fan-friendly as possible, and the walling off of the cars sends the exact opposite message. It’s saying, “Stay away from here, we don’t want you standing around looking at our stuff.”

If there’s nothing to see, the fans are going to move on to where there is something for them to ogle.

I can only ask David Williams, if the curtains aren’t for denying you access, what do you think they’re for? Please, don’t tell me it’s to keep their technical secrets, because that’s the obvious answer, and my point was never that they shouldn’t try to keep some things secret, but rather that the way they’re going about it is generating negative publicity and discussion.

There are ways of being secretive AND fan-friendly at the same time. This does not appear to be one of them.

I agree with Steve Wiedner. This DOES scream “leave us alone.”

No one is even remotely suggesting that this team isn’t incredibly talented, supremely dedicated and willing to spend whatever it takes to win. But, so too, are the Bernstein, Schumacher and Force teams, and their pits are wide open.

And no one is even remotely suggesting that the other major hitters in Pro
Stock, which in my opinion includes those two blue Mopars, the two yellow Chevrolets and that father-and-son duo from Georgia (and yeah, numerous others) aren’t also incredibly talented and supremely dedicated (I’ll leave the “wiling to spend whatever it takes” part for someone else to decide), but by having their cars more or less out in plain view at all times they at least give the perception of being more fan-friendly than does the team in question.

And in today’s world, perception is often reality.

Jon Asher
 
I think it was early last year that the Army Top Fuel team started to pull the car in backend first rather then front end first. I have heard that it was so that they hide some things that AJ was developing in the clutch and a few other parts in the engine. That is just as un-fan friendly because of how far the car is away now and how you can't see that much.

KB Racing is just trying to keep some things to themselves now that their performance advantage has decreased. They also are pretty secure in their spot for the championship so they might be testing some really crazy parts that if people saw then they would have time to develop them by the time the chase comes around.

What I would like to know is if those curtains are up all the time or just while they do some normal between round maintance right when they get back. Also, are Jason and Greg still talking with the fans between rounds or are they hiding behind the curtain or in the trailer the whole time?
 
I can only ask David Williams, if the curtains aren’t for denying you access, what do you think they’re for? Please, don’t tell me it’s to keep their technical secrets, because that’s the obvious answer, and my point was never that they shouldn’t try to keep some things secret, but rather that the way they’re going about it is generating negative publicity and discussion.
Jon..the reference to denying me access is simple..I don't know diddly squint..so them hiding anything from me is pointless.

Perhaps they just want some privacy while working..but with all the stank eminating from this..I'll assume they'll approach it another way in the future..or all hell will break loose for sure. :rolleyes:
 
Jon, thank you for your insight. You are right, there is no comparison between NHRA and Nascar. Apples to oranges, etc. Thinking back to what you posted previously and reading your latest post gives me a different perspective. Yes, I'm backpeddlin'! :D We (as in drag racing in general) do need all the support and fan base that we can get, and I guess that the "curtains" could be looked upon as negative.
For what it's worth, I do enjoy reading your articles! Keep up the good work!

Gary
 
Heres a news flash,nobody can see anything anyway from behind the car.
 
They could shroud the complete car and I wouldn't give a rip. The field has caught up with them and if you don't think the "shock rule clarification" didn't have anything to do with it,think again. Sure they're still fast but that total domination has gone away for the moment and who knows,they may still win it all but it ain't as easy as it once was,stay tuned.
 
do you not think that just the curtains being there give them a psychological advantage? It makes the competition wonder what they got.
 
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