Smoking

[Professor Dave]

And one more thing. If you're going to talk about the cost of healthcare related to smoking, let's talk about the number of tax dollars that smokers voluntarily pay everyday so they can indulge in smoking.

Alan

Alan,

You are right about cigarette taxes and the cost of health care. The Rand Corp., a very reputable research organization, did a study that showed the revenues raised from cigarette taxes covered the health care costs resulting from smoking. The are two caveats about this study. First it was done before a lot of states jacked up tobacco taxes, which would result in taxes exceeding the health care costs. On the other hand, it didn't include any possible health care costs related to second-hand smoke (these are harder to figure out, as you might expect), which would result in taxes being less than health care costs. But by no means are smokers imposing huge health care costs on the rest of us, once you take into account the taxes they pay.

Now for the bad news. The same research group found that when you compare the revenues collected from taxes on alcohol to the health care costs of consuming alcohol, the tax on it is way too low. But here's a problem. Drinking in moderation appears to have some real health benefits, it is only drinking in excess that is bad in terms of health care costs. So the ideal thing would be to subsidize moderate drinking from heavy taxes imposed on heavy drinking. But to do that the government would have to know way too much about a person's behavior in terms of what is tolerable in a free society. (The current administration and its likely successor are already trying to find out too much about our personal behavior. Do you know what the differences between a democrat, a republican, and a libertarian are? The democrat wants the government out of your bedroom and into your pocketbook, the republican wants the government out of your pocketbook and into your bedroom, and the libertarian says the constitution says the government ought to stay the hell away from your house.)

And glad to hear you quit smoking Alan-we don't want it to sound like Rod Stewart is announcing NHRA races in a couple of years.

 

[Ted]

Alan,

Do you know what the differences between a democrat, a republican, and a libertarian are? The democrat wants the government out of your bedroom and into your pocketbook, the republican wants the government out of your pocketbook and into your bedroom, and the libertarian says the constitution says the government ought to stay the hell away from your house.)

And glad to hear you quit smoking Alan-we don't want it to sound like Rod Stewart is announcing NHRA races in a couple of years.

Funny and true!
Congrats on quitting! That stuff is the devil.

 

[Nitrohaulic]

So, if everyone quit smoking, our healthcare and insurance costs would go down, but the government would be looking to raise other taxes to make up for their "losses"? Would this mean that I should consider taking up smoking as a patriotic duty?

Click on numbers ten and two.

Chris Bliss - Smart Comedy for the Information Age

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

I recently quit smoking

Way to go Alan! Congratulations buddy! That's monumental!

 

[none]

I recently quit smoking

Alan..Good job.I smoked for 27 years & quit.Hardest thing I have ever done & also the smartest.GOOD LUCK!!!!!

 

[yoda]

...If I want to allow smoking in my bar and you don't like it, why wouldn't you just go to the non-smoking bar acress the street?

And as for the bartenders, if smoking bothers you don't apply at the somking bar.

After all, if nudity offends you you wouldn't apply at the strip club would you?

(et al..)
Alan

That seems to be the big issue here, isn't it? Too many people want the government to be their big protector so that they don't have to make decisions for themselves. Like NOT being a patron in a bar that has chosen to allow smoking. The fact that crap like this even has to have the government involved befuddles me. On the other hand, somewhere along the line, electing politicians that actually LISTENED to the interests of the people they represent has gone straight down the toilet.

OR not enough people got off their lazy asses to go vote for the person that most represents their interests. You get what you pay for...

Hey Alan- you in town? We should go grab a beer soon..

 

[none]

Thanks to all for the Kudo's I quit on Christmas, it was my present to me. And haven't had a single one since. I'm certainly not saying that anyone should start, but it is unbelievable to me, that if one of my buddies comes over to machine something on my mill, that they would be breaking the law to have a smoke while they work.

Martin,

If I have a smoking bar and wanted you to do a show, you have every right to tell me "We don't play smoking clubs".

And I'm in town until the 11th call me and we'll have that beer.

Alan

 

[The Counterfeiter]

The "20 foot" smoking law for all businesses takes effect in Arizona May 1st. No one can smoke within 20 feet of the entrance to a business or the intake of the business' ventilation system. Also, no smoking signs have to be posted - somewhere. With three weeks to go, I am not aware of any business that has received guidelines from the state on what to do to comply, what agency will enfore these guidelines or what the penalties are for non-compliance.
AZ Rebublic reports that a penalty could be the loss of the business' state license. It's interesting that businesses other than those with a liquor license do not have a state license! We do have a permanent "Transaction Permit" that assures that the state will be able to collect sales taxes.
It's going to be an interesting test case when someone complains to the unspecfied state agency that is supposed to enforce this without providing guidelines to businesses. Just another reason to enjoy owning a business in Arizona!

 

[yoda]

Come on, Jim... You know that those government types that do so well in our state will have those things "in the mail" on April 30th...

 

[downtime]

Your requested analysis has already been done. Health Care numbers are staggering. Smokers and their related illnesses cost non smokers billions of dollar$ every year in hospitalization & health insurance not to mention the actual illness that are directly attributed to second-hand smoke which, for over a century you couldn't escape anywhere. Your argument is also flawed because dying of smoking related illness' costs the same if not more at an early age where the body has more capacity to fight the effects of the illness.

I simply asked if there were any pros to smoking? I'm older than dirt and I have never seen nor heard one valid argument in favor of it. Not being a smoker, I also will admit not being able to comprehend the grip of it's addiction.

The problem with that analysis is it fails to take into account the added cost to taxpayers via longer social security payments, plus the added costs of services attributed to the elderly...

I'm not saying smoking is good, because it isn't... However if we are talking numbers then ALL taxpayer costs should be entered into the equation.

I support a person's right to choose. Obesity is or already has become the number one killer of adults and many studies are showing that children born today will be the first people to have a shorter life expectatncy than their parents, based on diet...

We should not give up the argument about smoking but I believe we have hit the point of dimishing return and we should refocus on good parenting, good diet, good exercise, and allowing people to take some responsibility for their own lives for a change.

 

[Kelly Raquipiso]

Well, I've never been a smoker.
Nicotine residue has now been linked to SIDS, so we are emphatic about not having ANYONE (including family) in our home who smokes. We will also be limiting where we take the baby.
I have been interviewing pediatrician groups and can't find one who bans their employees from smoking during the hours of work when they will be coming into contact with my infant. I think that is DISGRACEFUL!! I can't even find a group that bans smoking at it's public entrances.

I think if you want to smoke you should be allowed to. I don't think you should be allowed to inflict the hazards of your your hobby/choice/addiction on those of us who don't.

 

[downtime]

Well, I've never been a smoker.
Nicotine residue has now been linked to SIDS, so we are emphatic about not having ANYONE (including family) in our home who smokes. We will also be limiting where we take the baby.
I have been interviewing pediatrician groups and can't find one who bans their employees from smoking during the hours of work when they will be coming into contact with my infant. I think that is DISGRACEFUL!! I can't even find a group that bans smoking at it's public entrances.

I think if you want to smoke you should be allowed to. I don't think you should be allowed to inflict the hazards of your your hobby/choice/addiction on those of us who don't.

I do not allow smoking in my home but people can light up on the back deck if they choose. The BBQ gives of as many carcinogens or more than a cigarette so outside is the place for smoke.

I can't believe burning rubber and nitro fumes are healthy either but we all choose to do what we do and all I want is to preserve the freedom of choice.

It would seem a simple matter to me when you are interviewing doctors to instead of asking about a "policy" simply asking if any of the staff smokes. If they do, then move on to the next candidate, if they don't then continue interviewing your potential doctor of choice.

As far as people smoking outside entrances... If inside air purification systems had been approved so that businesses could have a "smoke room" then it would be a simple matter to ban smoking outside. However, the anti-smoking movement wanted a total ban on smoking inside business etsablishments so they got what they asked for...

I sympathize with your plight, however I think there are adequate and realistic work arounds for your situation.

 

[Bob]

Well, I've never been a smoker.
Nicotine residue has now been linked to SIDS, so we are emphatic about not having ANYONE (including family) in our home who smokes. We will also be limiting where we take the baby.
I have been interviewing pediatrician groups and can't find one who bans their employees from smoking during the hours of work when they will be coming into contact with my infant. I think that is DISGRACEFUL!! I can't even find a group that bans smoking at it's public entrances.

I think if you want to smoke you should be allowed to. I don't think you should be allowed to inflict the hazards of your your hobby/choice/addiction on those of us who don't.

What exactly is "Nicotine residue"? And how has it been linked to SIDS? Nicotine is what makes tobacco products addictive, but it isn't what does damage to people predisposed to have negative health effects due to tobacco smoke. "Nicotine residue" would have to be in the systems of anyone using products other than cigarettes that contain nicotine, i.e., smokeless tobacco, nicotine chewing gum and nicotine patches.

There are companies that are now not hiring smokers, even if the only places they smoke are away from the workplace. You may be able to find one of those companies that is a pediatrician in your area, but I sincerely believe your fears are unfounded, fueled by misinformation put forth by groups that are so anti-smoking, they'll say anything to demonize(sp?) the use of tobacco to the point of lying about any and all secondary effects. If you want to keep your baby way from anyone who smokes under any circumstances (and that appears to be the case), put the child in a bubble.

Please understand, I'm not trying to be mean. I'm reacting to the hysteria sometimes falsely propagated by anti-tobacco groups, and bought into by concerned and caring people. My baby brother died of SIDS on Christmas morning when I was 7 years old. Anyone claiming that that could have happened due to casual contact with smokers within the general public is walking very far out on an invisible limb.

 

[Nitrohaulic]

The problem with smoking is that it's a genetic crap shoot. If everyone who did it got cancer, it would have been outlawed a long time ago. Common sense tells all of us that there are a lot of people who have had diseases because of their smoking, but since it doesn't always cause everyone to get those same diseases?

I believe all the diseases you're at a higher risk of getting from smoking, you can also acquire without smoking. Otherwise, I'd be for smokers having to understand and agree that the rest of society shouldn't be required to bear their medical burdens. Like Bruce Williams ( Bruce Williams Official Website ) has said many times, "You wanna ride a motorcycle without a helmet? Put up a one million dollar bond and agree that when that's exhausted, you get no more medical help."

 

[Kelly Raquipiso]

What exactly is "Nicotine residue"? And how has it been linked to SIDS? Nicotine is what makes tobacco products addictive, but it isn't what does damage to people predisposed to have negative health effects due to tobacco smoke. "Nicotine residue" would have to be in the systems of anyone using products other than cigarettes that contain nicotine, i.e., smokeless tobacco, nicotine chewing gum and nicotine patches.

There are companies that are now not hiring smokers, even if the only places they smoke are away from the workplace. You may be able to find one of those companies that is a pediatrician in your area, but I sincerely believe your fears are unfounded, fueled by misinformation put forth by groups that are so anti-smoking, they'll say anything to demonize(sp?) the use of tobacco to the point of lying about any and all secondary effects. If you want to keep your baby way from anyone who smokes under any circumstances (and that appears to be the case), put the child in a bubble.

Please understand, I'm not trying to be mean. I'm reacting to the hysteria sometimes falsely propagated by anti-tobacco groups, and bought into by concerned and caring people. My baby brother died of SIDS on Christmas morning when I was 7 years old. Anyone claiming that that could have happened due to casual contact with smokers within the general public is walking very far out on an invisible limb.

I'm sorry to hear about your brother. And I don't think you're being mean.
I received my information from several classes taught by Sentara Health Systems and the American Academy of Peditricians.

Looks like we all just get to disagree on this one. BTW, I'm not hysterical, just annoyed and trying to do my due diligence as a mother.