Nitromater
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Romine says
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Rajunz
Nitro Member
Because he was still trying to put the same amount of power to the ground. I agree with what Romine is proposing. Take away the some of the downforce and the rest will eventually take care of itself. However, there is a point where they can take too much away and the cars become out of control, and also, a point where the engines don't load, so they drop cylinders.
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Brian
Nitro Member
I posted this before years ago and received zero response. It's not even my idea. Steve Gibbs, then competition director at NHRA, gave this solution when asked what should be done to slow the cars down and control costs. Smaller tires! If the tires are smaller you don't need 8000 hp. If you don't need 8000 hp you don't need as much Downforce. Sure the times and speeds would fall off dramatically. Maybe that would allow for some more innovation. Maybe fields could be expanded because costs would decrease. Maybe we could do away with some of the timers and let the drivers control some more things. Look, I've been a fan all my life and I like low et's and big mph but I don't want the drivers to get killed every week.
Silly Savage
Nitro Member
Less or smaller wings.....go back to single mag.....
IMO do not change anything.....People are not dying every week in these cars...It's nitro racing, simple as that....
We will never know what 'exactly' happened and if the internet was not up and running these discussions would not exist in a wide open forum of speculation...
Force' crash was bad.....Call it occupational hazard...but there have been worse w/ less public attention to the matter....
It seems like the some of you want these cars to be 100% safe for their favorite driver...wrong....stuff happens and will happen again...
I say go back to 100% nitro and let fuel drivers do what they love....
We will never know what 'exactly' happened and if the internet was not up and running these discussions would not exist in a wide open forum of speculation...
Force' crash was bad.....Call it occupational hazard...but there have been worse w/ less public attention to the matter....
It seems like the some of you want these cars to be 100% safe for their favorite driver...wrong....stuff happens and will happen again...
I say go back to 100% nitro and let fuel drivers do what they love....
mike
Nitro Member
It's amazing how racers who longer compete have all the opinions on what's best for TF/FC racing! I didn't hear Paul complain about To much downforce when he was racing in TF, didn't keep him out of the driver's seat.
Exactly!!! And do we hear any TF drivers complaining now? Nooo! I'm not going to get involved in this discussion, my head will end up exploding, and frankly I don't want that to happen.
rosco
Nitro Member
They have removed just about all driver ability from many race cars the past 15/20 years
The Indy cars are just Stab it and Steer it now, Nascar has just made every car in the cup series identical, What do these 2 series share in common with their cars, DOWNFORCE, TIRES that grip the track, plus a whole bunch of safety features
The fuel cars today, the driver is just along for the ride, they engage the clutch at the line before they light the lights, years ago the driver had to engage the clutch when the green light went green, they had to drive the car from start to finish, today during the eliminations you see as many as 50%of the drivers lifting when they break the tires loose, usually in the first 1/5 of the track
The Indy car fans and NASCAR fans would See much better race if the series would just change the tire rule to maybe 2/3 the width they use today, same for NHRA, this would put the driving back in the hands of the driver, or should I say back in the seat of their pants where the drivers actually feel the cars
RIP Wally, You did good
The Indy cars are just Stab it and Steer it now, Nascar has just made every car in the cup series identical, What do these 2 series share in common with their cars, DOWNFORCE, TIRES that grip the track, plus a whole bunch of safety features
The fuel cars today, the driver is just along for the ride, they engage the clutch at the line before they light the lights, years ago the driver had to engage the clutch when the green light went green, they had to drive the car from start to finish, today during the eliminations you see as many as 50%of the drivers lifting when they break the tires loose, usually in the first 1/5 of the track
The Indy car fans and NASCAR fans would See much better race if the series would just change the tire rule to maybe 2/3 the width they use today, same for NHRA, this would put the driving back in the hands of the driver, or should I say back in the seat of their pants where the drivers actually feel the cars
RIP Wally, You did good
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I don't have a dog in the fight other than not wanting to see fuel racing kill a bunch of people, but I have to agree with Romine regardless.
Downforce creates drag, which creates additional friction between the tire and the racing surface. That friction creates heat.
When Romine was driving, the cars had a similar amount of downforce, but not the same output at the rear tires. Fewer tire failures. Throw in the extra power we have today, and you have tires letting go. Much more stress on the tire.
As far as Goodyear is concerned, who's to say that the current fuel tire is not already at the limit of todays technology in its compound and construction? It may very well be, and until such time as something newer is available, reducing downforce might be the way to keep tires in one piece.
Downforce creates drag, which creates additional friction between the tire and the racing surface. That friction creates heat.
When Romine was driving, the cars had a similar amount of downforce, but not the same output at the rear tires. Fewer tire failures. Throw in the extra power we have today, and you have tires letting go. Much more stress on the tire.
As far as Goodyear is concerned, who's to say that the current fuel tire is not already at the limit of todays technology in its compound and construction? It may very well be, and until such time as something newer is available, reducing downforce might be the way to keep tires in one piece.
.
Nitro Member
Yes, I'm sure the Goodyear engineers just sat around with their thumbs in their butts watching the money roll in.
I can't believe people are dumb enough to think that Goodyear isn't doing everything humanly possible to build the best tire they can.
turbo ken
Nitro Member
Yes, I'm sure the Goodyear engineers just sat around with their thumbs in their butts watching the money roll in.
The tires should be an ever evolving process just like every other part of the car is, not put out a tire and continue to keep the same ones out there till to many driver's/owner's/crewchief's start moaning about how the tires are coming apart. How long have they been running the same tires they have been currently running, 2 or 3 years. Goodyear has probably never made money on fuel tires, but they havent done anything to improve them over the last couple of years or so, the tires are one of the few parts of a fuel car that doesn't get constantly outdated like engine blocks, cylinder heads, clutch disks, bodies, chassis design, I could go on and on, so yes goodyear's enginners have been just collecting paychecks. open your eyes dude.
