Nhra: If you build an unnapproved harley psm you won’t be able to race it

[TooTall999]

This is a shame...remember in the past, as in the early days of Pro Stock Car, you could actually order a body in white and build your own Pro stock car. In a sense you should be able to do this in Pro Stock motorcycle, buy a chassis,body work nad the engine parts to build a bike. You can do this if you want a "Buell" or Suzuki, but if you want a Harley V-rod you're sh*t out of luck. This exclusivity by Harley is just wrong. NHRA should wake up and either allow the "Buell" riders the same engine setup as VHR or disallow the 4 valve heads and make everyone run 2 valve heads.

 

[*******]

Why did they pour it on at Gainesville? That's what I'm wondering. Does it have something to do with the color and logo change on the bikes? I honestly don't know but it's sure not what I've become accustomed to seeing from the team.

I think they were going for the 200 mph deal. Once that was obtained I bet they would have backed it back down until the countdown.

 

[nick name]

I think they were going for the 200 mph deal. Once that was obtained I bet they would have backed it back down until the countdown.

That's a very good point. I would not bet against that scenario.

 

[Paul]

I bet they would have backed it back down until the countdown.

I will bet that is what they will do now. Work in the shop and show what they have when the the prize is awarded. Does no good to show what you have before the Countdown.

 

[Bill]

Not Exactly. H-D has a say on who gets a Harley and right now it is only V-H.

Now if you said Dodge developed a 4 valve motor and only let Allan Johnson use it that would be what is happening in PSM

H-D will not approve any one else to run a Harley.

I can't argue with what you said, but is the result any different, as to WHO demands the "exclusivity" of that engine (V and H or Harley?)

Secondly, does Harley really build those engines, or does V and H build them? And, if V and H builds them, what has Harley to do with any of it, legally?

Just askin'...

 

[tb]

I can't argue with what you said, but is the result any different, as to WHO demands the "exclusivity" of that engine (V and H or Harley?)

Secondly, does Harley really build those engines, or does V and H build them? And, if V and H builds them, what has Harley to do with any of it, legally?

Just askin'...

As per the original article, they have to approve any engine/bike that races. Like I said earlier if Bryce built a H-D and they did not approve it. It would not race.

H-D is the one that needs to let everyone have access to their designs and let any one build it.

 

[Bill]

H-D is the one that needs to let everyone have access to their designs and let any one build it.

Let me understand this (I don't, apparently.) Are you saying that Vance and Hines do NOT "build" these 4-valve cylinder heads"??? They are actually Harley-originated pieces, or are they actually constructed by Vance and Hines to fit on a Harley "short block"???

I don't think this is splitting hairs. Either Harley builds them, designed them, or had SOMETHING significant to do with their genisis, or I'd think they cound't claim to be the "manufacturer." since they came from somewhere else.

The simple fact that they FIT onto a Harley "block" doesn't make them a Harley design. (You can put ARIAS hemi heads on a big block Chevy V8, but that doesn't make it a Mopar.)

Or, does it???

Maybe the engineers at Harley actually designed these 4-valve heads; that is what I'm asking.

Because, if they DIDN'T, and the heads are a V-H exclusive (product) Harley is not the manufacturer...

Who knows whether the R & D work on those 4-valve heads and the DOHC setup was done at Harley engineering, or at Vance and Hines????

I have my opinion, but I'm probably wrong (as usual.)

 

[tb]

Let me understand this (I don't, apparently.) Are you saying that Vance and Hines do NOT "build" these 4-valve cylinder heads"??? They are actually Harley-originated pieces, or are they actually constructed by Vance and Hines to fit on a Harley "short block"???

I don't think this is splitting hairs. Either Harley builds them, designed them, or had SOMETHING significant to do with their genisis, or I'd think they cound't claim to be the "manufacturer." since they came from somewhere else.

The simple fact that they FIT onto a Harley "block" doesn't make them a Harley design. (You can put ARIAS hemi heads on a big block Chevy V8, but that doesn't make it a Mopar.)

Or, does it???

Maybe the engineers at Harley actually designed these 4-valve heads; that is what I'm asking.

Because, if they DIDN'T, and the heads are a V-H exclusive (product) Harley is not the manufacturer...

Who knows whether the R & D work on those 4-valve heads and the DOHC setup was done at Harley engineering, or at Vance and Hines????

I have my opinion, but I'm probably wrong (as usual.)

Does not matter who built it, H-D gives it a part number and OK's the design which makes it a Harley. Just like Pro Stock car.

My main point is that H-D is causing some of these problems not just NHRA.

If MOPAR gave the Arias head and Chevy motor a part number they could call it a MOPAR. We would know it is not but they could.

 

[sdwarf36]

Let me understand this (I don't, apparently.) Are you saying that Vance and Hines do NOT "build" these 4-valve cylinder heads"??? They are actually Harley-originated pieces, or are they actually constructed by Vance and Hines to fit on a Harley "short block"???

I don't think this is splitting hairs. Either Harley builds them, designed them, or had SOMETHING significant to do with their genisis, or I'd think they cound't claim to be the "manufacturer." since they came from somewhere else.

The simple fact that they FIT onto a Harley "block" doesn't make them a Harley design. (You can put ARIAS hemi heads on a big block Chevy V8, but that doesn't make it a Mopar.)

Or, does it???

Maybe the engineers at Harley actually designed these 4-valve heads; that is what I'm asking.

Because, if they DIDN'T, and the heads are a V-H exclusive (product) Harley is not the manufacturer...

Who knows whether the R & D work on those 4-valve heads and the DOHC setup was done at Harley engineering, or at Vance and Hines????

I have my opinion, but I'm probably wrong (as usual.)

Not a single part has any more than a passing resemblence to any stock V rod part. As a matter of fact, PORSCHE designed the engine for the stock bike.

 

[PiPPi]

Let me understand this (I don't, apparently.) Are you saying that Vance and Hines do NOT "build" these 4-valve cylinder heads"??? They are actually Harley-originated pieces, or are they actually constructed by Vance and Hines to fit on a Harley "short block"???

I have a friend who worked as a test engineer for Harley-Davidson back when V&H built the first H-D PSM and he claimed that H-D did not have anything whatsoever to do with either the engineering or manufacture of anything on that bike.

Regards
PiPPi

 

[JON]

It is quite common for all kinds of OEM to 'outsource' their motorsports activities but still 'brand' it as the 'factory team' or 'official team'.

Many OEMs simply do not have the racing experience or agility to be competitive.

Of course, OEMs also can also save money and effort, compared to going it alone, by letting the 'outsource partner' part fund the programme by finding additional sponsorship.

Sad to say, it is also quite common for OEMs and others to use their money to influence rule making, in various branches of motorsports. This will always be denied but it always goes on.

That doesn't make it right though, does it?

 

[Bill]

That doesn't make it right though, does it?

Nope...