Mike dunn is right (3 Viewers)

[my friends call me Zappy]

nhra needs to stop the practice of pushing the fuel cars. It's dangerous. Also against the rules. A driver is supposed to stage the car under it's own power.

While they are at it they need to stop adjusting wheelie bars on the line also. Befor we drag some crewman down the track.

 

[mastertone]

nhra needs to stop the practice of pushing the fuel cars. It's dangerous. Also against the rules. A driver is supposed to stage the car under it's own power.

While they are at it they need to stop adjusting wheelie bars on the line also. Befor we drag some crewman down the track.

So right you are and so is Mike. I 've been waiting for someone to get hurt real bad. I pray that does not happen but the odds are it will.

 

[yoda]

nhra needs to stop the practice of pushing the fuel cars. It's dangerous. Also against the rules. A driver is supposed to stage the car under it's own power.

While they are at it they need to stop adjusting wheelie bars on the line also. Befor we drag some crewman down the track.

??????

Pretty positive the driver is putting the car into the beams Paul... getting the car to the beams via crew has been going on for 50 years- depends on the popular way of crewchief thinking at the time.

And the wheelie bar guy isn't some newbie that is putting themself into a situation anymore hazardous than anyone that does "pre-flight" check under the body- it's a tape measurer and a few turns of a nut...

 

[Nunz]

Nah Martin, Dunn was talking about the latest practice of crewmembers pushing the cars as a way to affect the clutch differently, someone here can probably explain it better, but I remember him saying "let the driver do it and it is what it is" in so many words. Dunn is old-school, and he is not a fan of anything that takes jobs away from the driver, e.g., the use of throttle stops on burnouts by the fuel cars. I remember when Dunn won Indy in Pisano's car, he was shifting a two-speed, and pushing buttons to lock-up the clutch. Dunn is one of the best ever, IMO.

 

[yoda]

I know what Mike was talking about, Nunzio- you're right about him thinking it should all be about driver squeezing it just right to put it in.. Paul S's post was what I was commenting about re: "A driver is supposed to stage the car under it's own power."... They do, and always have since the rule about that was in place. Some crewchiefs know that saving the clutch during the roll-up process may make a difference...

 

[BaldyLochs]

Didn't they used to have a magic yellow line up there, that only the crew chief could cross after the car backs up and they wipe the slicks?

 

[You!]

It was a blue line Chris and it appears that it is not used anymore, or at least not enforced.

 

[big guy]

It was a blue line Chris and it appears that it is not used anymore, or at least not enforced.

Only 4 crew members can cross the yelllow line, at this track.

 

[Tim5636sc]

Zappy-
i dont think Dunn's comment was 'safety' related, (as the car is in forward gear) but more of a sarcastic 'oh come on guys' type remark.
I gotta believe this is another 'FAD' which i believe started with Alan Johnson when the would roll Tony through the water box, then grew to helping back up the car.
I am sure the idea helps, as long as the car has made a forward movement on its own, (showing the crew it is not in reverse) i dont think this procedure is all that unsafe.
Now...the Door car 'OLE' bull fighting dance during the burnout and the NHRÀ official standing in the center of the track during the burnout in the nitro classes...that is another discussion all together.

 

[PJ]

Oh I fully agree that they should end the bull fighter burn out as Tim called it. That is just beggin for something to go wrong. Car bites to quick, slides more than expected, fluid leak or anything else makes this very bad.


I'm not big on the last second adjustment either but as I've watched this it does appear that most teams do place a spotter there as well. The crew chief doesn't give the all clear to the driver until the spotter acknowldges that the wheelie bar person is out of the way.

 

[T.Smith]

I saw that last night and my thought too was "ok this is getting to be real stupid".

As far as the wheelie bar thing is concerned, make your damn final adjustment before the prestage light is lit...good grief. I hope our guy isn't waiting that long.

 

[vegasnitro]

So right you are and so is Mike. I 've been waiting for someone to get hurt real bad. I pray that does not happen but the odds are it will.

Actually, the odds are the same and will remain the same. However, the probability of an accident increases (infinitesimally) with each safe run.

Leave it to the guy from Vegas to go down the odds vs probability road ...

In any event, I don't like the teams pushing the cars to stage them. I think the car/driver should stage itself. It is one more mechanical variable the teams SHOULD account for. If your clutch is always too hot after the burnout ... then figure out why and fix it.

 

[Al smith]

Section 17 Race procedures
pages 237-238

Staging

Once a car reaches the front of the staging lanes for a run, it must be prepared to fire and race. Vehicles in Top Fuel, Funny Car, Top alcohol Dragster, Top Alcohol Funny Car classes, once moved into the burnout area, may not restart engines. To be a legitimate race winner, a contestants car must self start and self stage. This rule also applies to single runs. Push-starting or push-staging any vehicle is prohibited. Staging must be done under the vehicles own engine power.

 

[yoda]

Somewhere along this thread, folks have started to associate "staging" the car with everything that happens after the car stops from backing up from the burnout.

The cars can have hands on them until either a pre-determined paint stripe or until the driver hits the pre-stage bulb- at that point, the car, AND DRIVER, are "Staging". All the roll up, whether done by the crew or under driver power, to the lights is pretty much open to interpretation and is totally legal, but it is not "staging". That is done when the car breaks the first beam- hence the "Pre" designation.

 

[Just Paul]

The car is not pushed into stage. They push the car 'till Coil want's it stopped before pre-stage beam, where the car would normally stop before going in. I am not defending them, I'm just saying.

The first time I noticed it, was in Joliet after the Tasca deal, on Johns make up pass.

 

[Tim5636sc]

Somewhere along this thread, folks have started to associate "staging" the car with everything that happens after the car stops from backing up from the burnout.

The cars can have hands on them until either a pre-determined paint stripe or until the driver hits the pre-stage bulb- at that point, the car, AND DRIVER, are "Staging". All the roll up, whether done by the crew or under driver power, to the lights is pretty much open to interpretation and is totally legal, but it is not "staging". That is done when the car breaks the first beam- hence the "Pre" designation.

BINGO! The issue is not helping them 'STAGE'. They are being pushed up to the line. The car and driver still control the act of 'STAGING'.

A wise man once said in regards to the way some people 'read the track': 'THERE IS A SUCH THING AS OVER THINKING SOMETHING'. A big tall 'wise' guy.

 

[my friends call me Zappy]

Section 17 Race procedures
pages 237-238

Staging

]Push-starting or push-staging any vehicle is prohibited.[/B][/SIZE] Staging must be done under the vehicles own engine power.

Thanks Al.

To me this reads after the driver stops backing up from the burnout, the car should no longer be touched. His first forward movement is IN FACT the beggining of staging the car, and therefor should be done un-assisted.

 

[Tim5636sc]

Thanks Al.

To me this reads after the driver stops backing up from the burnout, the car should no longer be touched. His first forward movement is IN FACT the beggining of staging the car, and therefor should be done un-assisted.

If this was the case Zappy dont ya think NHRA would have put the kybosh on the procedure when they started it?

 

[PJ]

If this was the case Zappy dont ya think NHRA would have put the kybosh on the procedure when they started it?

Maybe not, aren't you always supposed to stop at the scales......unless of course you are waved by. Now maybe you can push the car until you are told not to

 

[my friends call me Zappy]

If this was the case Zappy dont ya think NHRA would have put the kybosh on the procedure when they started it?

Not really Tim. It wouldn't be the first time they stuck their head in the sand when it comes to safty issues.