Diving lessons?

[JB3]

You're focusing on the wrong round. Ron was in the "dreaded right lane" because Hagan had lane choice and put him there, in round 1 Ron had a 4.028 and Hagan had a 4.015. For the record none of the DSR cars ran in the right lane in round 1and TJ won in the right lane in the pair before Capps and Hagan. Napa would be foolish to leave either Capps or DSR over the Round 2 loss. For DSR the Semi played out perfectly, who's TJ's "sponsor"?

Last year Napa left because NASCAR dropped the hammer on MWR when Truex and Napa were removed from the Chase. Had NASCAR done nothing Truex would still be driving the Napa Toyota. MWR didn't say or do anything because they got caught manipulating a race with Bowyer spinning, Brian Vickers making multiple pit stops and very slow laps to protect and ensure the 56, and they orchestrated it over the team radios for all to hear. There was no denying what took place.

EXACTLY Keith !! Thank you. As usual, this has turned into another Mater saga where rabid fans let facts get in the way of the truth. This has just gotten silly, in no way does this challenge anyone's integrity. And if any Mater had $500k riding on it, they would make the same decision. Don't say you wouldn't. Unless you own a team right now that is facing the same scenario, it is just words and has no meaning.

Love when people say "I would Never" ... makes me laugh. As others here have stated, $500k changes a lot of thought pattern.

 

[JB3]

Doubt that the don will chime in to set the record straight cause the record is on tape for all to see.
If he and alan dont think its worth posting here thats fine. Personaly i think the discussion that is taking place here on diving in pomona is one of the best we have had in a long time. I hope that NHRA, don schumacher, john force, graham light, ron capps, tommy johnson, and alan rhinehart are reading our comments. AND if they have something to say and they dont want to say it here let them use another venue to tell us their side of the story. Cause this subject is too important for them to ignore!!

What?? Why?? The few regular posters that are "involved" in this discussion are not NHRA's target audience. The Mater is a tiny fraction of the NHRA fan base and the fact that a few "angry" rabid fans posting on an internet message board think there opinion should somehow be turned into rules or policy is absurd. The vast majority of the paying spectators wouldn't have an opinion on this either way. Just as in NASCAR, they want their driver to WIN ... PERIOD !!

These are the people buying the T-Shirts and souveniers, etc. That is the target audience. It is for their ENTERTAINMENT.

 

[PJ]

Rumor has it the NHRA Championship trophy given out at the awards banquet last night now has a diving board on it.....haven't seen pictures yet to verify though.



(sorry couldn't resist)

 

[PJ]

What?? Why?? The few regular posters that are "involved" in this discussion are not NHRA's target audience. The Mater is a tiny fraction of the NHRA fan base and the fact that a few "angry" rabid fans posting on an internet message board think there opinion should somehow be turned into rules or policy is absurd. The vast majority of the paying spectators wouldn't have an opinion on this either way. Just as in NASCAR, they want their driver to WIN ... PERIOD !!

These are the people buying the T-Shirts and souveniers, etc. That is the target audience. It is for their ENTERTAINMENT.

based on the reports of the rather loud boo's that happened during both "races" it seems even the general fan was not happy with what went on either.

 

[Huge]

based on the reports of the rather loud boo's that happened during both "races" it seems even the general fan was not happy with what went on either.

I was standing to the left of the starting line when the T.J/Hagan race went down and yes there were some boo's, but there were a lot more excitied fans, then booing fans. I'm sure some fans were booing because they figured a fix was in and some were John Force fans booing because his championship run just came to an end.

 

[vern]

The team he paid for got the short end of the stick once as well. See any cars out there now with Oakley splashed all over the side of it? Me neither.

First of all, Jim doesn't run Oakley anymore the company was sold to Luxottica in 2007. If you look at any of the crew members at DSR they are wearing Oakley glasses and clothing. And didn't the driver for Michael Waltrip crash his car on purpose? How this is the same as what Ron is accused of isn't even close.

 

[PJ]

I was standing to the left of the starting line when the T.J/Hagan race went down and yes there were some boo's, but there were a lot more excitied fans, then booing fans. I'm sure some fans were booing because they figured a fix was in and some were John Force fans booing because his championship run just came to an end.

I wasn't there so I'm only going on reports I've heard about boo's after both runs. You are right, some could have been Force fans booing over the championship being done but having sat in the stands and witnessing a dive before, the fans around me were booing about the con job, not that their guy lost.

 

[FABMAN]

NHRA and Sponsors are the only ones that can fix the problem and since there hasn't been input from them it's likely to continue for sometime. NHRA has no concern about the integrity of this sport and that's a shame.

 

[JB3]

NHRA and Sponsors are the only ones that can fix the problem and since there hasn't been input from them it's likely to continue for sometime. NHRA has no concern about the integrity of this sport and that's a shame.

What's broken that needs fixing? Again, if you faced the same situation you would likely make the same decision these teams "allegedly" made. Don't say you wouldn't because you don't know unless you faced it head on. Therefore, I know it is your opinion, but where are your qualifications to question any of these teams or owners integrity?

 

[I was NITRO BREATH]

What's broken that needs fixing? Again, if you faced the same situation you would likely make the same decision these teams "allegedly" made. Don't say you wouldn't because you don't know unless you faced it head on. Therefore, I know it is your opinion, but where are your qualifications to question any of these teams or owners integrity?

Not to belabor the point jim but you dont need "qualifications" to question someones integrity.

 

[JB3]

I wasn't there so I'm only going on reports I've heard about boo's after both runs. You are right, some could have been Force fans booing over the championship being done but having sat in the stands and witnessing a dive before, the fans around me were booing about the con job, not that their guy lost.

So all of your posts are based on "hear say" and "reports". So, it must be true even when Eugene posts a first hand account that refutes much of the perceived Mater assessment of the situation.

Enough of this thread ... it is getting tired.

 

[JB3]

Not to belabor the point jim but you dont need "qualifications" to question someones integrity.

Barry - You do if you have never been in that situation. Always easier to second guess and arm chair quarterack. Unless you have been in that spt and been required to make that call, don't question how others handled it becuase you DEFINITELY do not have all of the facts.

 

[I was NITRO BREATH]

Barry - You do if you have never been in that situation. Always easier to second guess and arm chair quarterack. Unless you have been in that spt and been required to make that call, don't question how others handled it becuase you DEFINITELY do not have all of the facts.

Jim. We agree on this. And maybe im splitting hairs. Im not examining why the decision was made ( if in fact it was). My wife and i run a business and i understand financial pressures. So the question in my mind is not why a dive is necessary in the mind of an owner, but is this an ehtical decision and bad for the sport and the fans?? I love drag racing and the pomona race was fantastic.erica and jason put on a fantastic show. Heads up racimg and i loved it and the fans loved it But did hqgan win the championship fair and square is what im wondering

 

[BigDaddyB]

While the countdown does not automatically equal dives, it does allow for more instances for it to happen. Be it at Indy to get in the top ten (Hight/Force) or as the finals near since races are tighter with the points reset.
Pre countdown there were dives but we talk 03 Seattle, KJ and his sign, Minor/Beck in the 80's toss in some Force/T Predregon and we have a handful over a couple decades that were obvious. Since the countdown, it is almost a yearly event. Hell, didn't Anderson basically admit that he would have done it if he and Line matched up yesterday??? Even when it doesn't happen it is still suspected and wondered by many. It seems to be, what I can only assume, is an unintended, consequence of the countdown

s
Wasn't the Summit Crew plotting on getting to Enders by sandbagging in qualifying. Look at the teams in PS, Oh its not going to end anytime soon. Too much money on the line.

 

[Rajunz]

s
Wasn't the Summit Crew plotting on getting to Enders by sandbagging in qualifying. Look at the teams in PS, Oh its not going to end anytime soon. Too much money on the line.

There is a HUGE difference in plotting to take out your opponent over giving your teammate a free ride. They would have had to actually beat her, which none of them would have pulled off anyways.

I would also say how quick it was exposed what Summit team were attempting to do in Pro Stock caught wind to the Summit Leaders and they said don't do that, just look what happened in Q4, what a rebound. Of coarse thats JMO.

That's not at all how it went down. In Q4 Greg said in his interview that when he rolled up there, he saw that if he didn't improve, he would have to race Jason Line in round 1 and wanted no part of that. Can't blame him one bit, that would be a no win situation. Those guys always race heads up, but if he loses to Jason, he gets a thread like this. If he wins against Jason, he ends his team's chance at another Championship.

Did anyone here truly think Hagan wasn't going rounds?

I hope everyone here realizes that the odds of Hagan coming up against a teammate on his side of the ladder was pretty high. You know- the teammates that WERENT going to help the team pocket a half million dollars.

I truly love how many armchair millionaires are on this board... Like anyone would think that they wouldn't have a strategy for being in the best possible place to put that check in their pocket...

We all knew that Hagan was going rounds, but like I said earlier, TJ taking the right lane was just a slap in the face to all NHRA fans. TJ's team could have at least made it look like an effort, take the left lane and set it up to drop a bunch of cylinders, blow it up and smack the guard wall. Give us something besides just insulting our intelligence, especially after all the times they've been adamant about running them heads up.

 

[vegasnitro]

I was sitting in Section 20 or 21, right on the 660 cone all day Sunday. We were surrounded by savvy fans and a lot of racers/crews. Nobody booed when Capps smoked them or when TJjr smoked them. Everyone just kind of shrugged their shoulders and went on with their day. Nobody was surprised by it, nor was anybody too upset about it. It is understood that this is the way the game is played now.

 

[PJ]

So all of your posts are based on "hear say" and "reports". So, it must be true even when Eugene posts a first hand account that refutes much of the perceived Mater assessment of the situation.

Enough of this thread ... it is getting tired.

Ok go back and read Eugene's account. Did ya see it this time? Even he said there was some booing. Of course we can debate the intention of or who the boos were directed at, maybe it was anti-divers, maybe pro force people, maybe people just mad that the season was over, who knows maybe the vendor in the stands ran out of beer and the people were angry; regardless between Eugene as well as others who posted that were there, it appears most parties agree that there was booing.


Also as the people not being allowed to question unless the meet some qualification is about the biggest bunch of BS ever. By that logic, we can never judge anyone's integrity unless we have been in the same situation. That would make jury pools a really interesting mix.

 

[PJ]

Actually I want to Thank DSR for this. Things die down here in the off season, now we all have something to get all riled up about for a few weeks. It will make the 80 days between the Finals and Pomona a little shorter

See they were only thinking of us

 

[BigDaddyB]

To add a solution to this discussion let's just make the crew chiefs put up 5k for 26 races. This gives them skin the game.

 

[BigDaddyB]

Let's just face the that their is no single car team in Pro categories ever going contend for a championship. There is no David beating Goliah. The hey day of individuals being better than theses teams mute. What we have is what we get in the Pro categories. Mr. Robinson I thought it was run what you brung and let the chips fall where the may, and this is the nature of competition, the cream will rise to the top. This team thing is demoralizing. Call me old school but I drag my stuff to the track win or lose I gave it by best shot. You got that right PJ.