Clay's "Disqualified" video

[mick]

well, there it is in black and white. sure wish i would have seen this 'plain as day' rule a few days ago when this first came out.
how could it take nhra 6 days to interpret this rule? much less more than one or less?
one wrong move in the pits cost that team so much. sucks.

 

[Randy]

I'm not going to name names but loose ballast in shot bags found in race cars over the years is nothing new. Rules about loose ballast have been in the rulebook for decades, and the rule is there for a reason (safety) and there have always been ramifications. Since this happened to a high profile team this time everyone knows about it. Knowing the penalty is clearly stated in the rule book should make any team think twice about doing it. If it were 10 pounds of lead in a shot bag, it's no small bag. And it certainly wouldn't fit in a standard frame tube.

 

[Scoe]

Clay is wrong, there is NO contradiction in the rules. Go back to 2:00 - The NHRA rule states that LOOSE shot bags are not allowed, all ballast must be PERMANENTLY ATTACHED. Go to 3:10 - shot bags are allowed if they are contained INSIDE AN APPROPRATELY ATTACHED weight box. He admitted that the shot bag fell from the car as the front wheels came off the ground and a plug fell out, indicating the shot bag WAS NOT properly secured. The team violated a SAFETY rule. As far as stating that ANY other motorsport sanctioning body would be quicker to announce a penalty, that is ridiculous assumption made by Clay. If RWR doesn't agree with the NHRA rules, they don't have to participate.

It's not ridiculous to assume. Nascar has a window to announce penalties from post race to Tuesday after the race, Wednesday at the latest. 6 days is a joke. And nobody is talking about not participating. RWR isn't the first team to have issues with rules, and they won't be the last.

 

[Ramjet]

I'm not going to name names but loose ballast in shot bags found in race cars over the years is nothing new. Rules about loose ballast have been in the rulebook for decades, and the rule is there for a reason (safety) and there have always been ramifications. Since this happened to a high profile team this time everyone knows about it. Knowing the penalty is clearly stated in the rule book should make any team think twice about doing it. If it were 10 pounds of lead in a shot bag, it's no small bag. And it certainly wouldn't fit in a standard frame tube.

You are absolutly right. In 1968/69 in my Front Motor dragster we were smoking the tires so in all my wisdom (Stupidity) I put a 25 lb. bag of shot under the seat upholstry for the next run. The upholstry had snaps and I was sitting on it also so "What could possibly go wrong", it was securly fastened. Well - it worked and everything was great until I pulled the 'Chute. That #7 Shot was still in the canvas bag it comes in until the chute opened and it "SHOT" out and hit the back of the Clutch Can. Has anyone ever wondered how many lead balls are released into the cockpit of a dragster (and onto the track) when it slows down at about 4 / 5 G's and nobody told the bag of shot that it had more inertia than a 165 lb. guy and a couple of Snaps could hold back. The real problem was that in those days there was no "Crotch" strap to do any thing and the harness got real loose - real quick. I was not the most popular guy when they had to sweep it up. There is a reason for the way "Ballast" must be secured.

 

[none]

Gotham City Racing Car Disqualified In Norwalk

GOTHAM CITY RACING CAR DISQUALIFIED IN NORWALK NORWALK, Ohio (June 28, 2008) - The ProCare Rx Dodge Charger R/T nitro Funny Car driven by Melanie Troxel was disqualified following the first round of qualifying in the Summit Racing Equipment NHRA Nationals in Norwalk, Ohio because NHRA...

www.nitromater.com

 

[sutton]

Ballast issues have been a problem for YEARS. shot bags in header tubes after a run, lead liners of helmets on and on, I even know of a team that had 2 body poles one for the starting line an one for the scales filled with shot. I agree with Clay he didn't think there would ever be a issue the way he read the rules but the penalty they were given in my opinion was BS. NHRA says the dollars will go to the safety safari. the safety safari gets free trucks, free fire suits, free tires for the drag tractors, free tractors. on an on. and the HEROS that are there to save your ASS, many are volunteers or get less that min. wage. I know my comments here are not politically correct but TS. so with all of the fines lately being levied where is the money going ?.
Larry Sutton---Lions Starter an racer (RET.)

 

[turbo ken]

Wonder if DSR's chassis shop revised the way they cap the rear of that tube so that doesn't happen again (lots of their chassis out there with the same setup).

 

[Mike]

The ballast system on a DSR TF chassis is integrated into the tow hook that attaches to the front of the tube. There are individual pucks that thread into the tow hook plug and each other. They can be stacked to add additional weight. The rear of the tube is not capped... The tube was also designed to serve as the fuel tank ventilation point.

 

[turbo ken]

The ballast system on a DSR TF chassis is integrated into the tow hook that attaches to the front of the tube. There are individual pucks that thread into the tow hook plug and each other. They can be stacked to add additional weight. The rear of the tube is not capped... The tube was also designed to serve as the fuel tank ventilation point.
View attachment 14081View attachment 14082

In the video Clay showed the "tube" on his car, but there wasn't any fuel tank vent leading to it.

 

[LoPony]

In the video Clay showed the "tube" on his car, but there wasn't any fuel tank vent leading to it.

Any weight that falls off a car could be classified as “ballast”. “Weight” falls off cars all the time in ”incidents”. Funny cars blow up, shred the body = Ballast on the track. Fire extinguisher bottles, which I KNOW you all have seen skittering on the racetrack in an incident. That is BALLAST. It adds weight to the car. Blower parts? Ballast. They should be very clear about this rule, otherwise the only sensible thing is that every team gets penalized for each incident.

It’s unfortunate that Clay was penalized for event points AND financially for this incident. The punishment does not fit the infraction in this case.

I bet they will check that plug behind the front tow hook in the future to make sure it can’t fall out!

 

[LoPony]

Seems to me they were within the rules until the failure occurred that allowed the bag to come out.
How’s that any different than any other incident that puts debris on the track that was otherwise within the rules until something failed?

Totally agree. The rule as written is not clear, despite what anyone says trying to defend it. Shot bags are allowed in a box only? Is a steel pipe not like a box if it’s attached to the chassis?

 

[LoPony]

The NHRA is run by hacks!!!

They’re not hacks, they just don’t know how to write clear rules. Writing them so that they apply equally in all cases, to all classes of cars, from door slammers to TF is admittedly difficult. However, when they deal with an unclear rule in a draconian way without offering any explanation it kind of raises eyebrows, pisses off racers and a whole lot of fans.

 

[none]

Any weight that falls off a car could be classified as “ballast”. “Weight” falls off cars all the time in ”incidents”. Funny cars blow up, shred the body = Ballast on the track. Fire extinguisher bottles, which I KNOW you all have seen skittering on the racetrack in an incident. That is BALLAST. It adds weight to the car. Blower parts? Ballast. They should be very clear about this rule, otherwise the only sensible thing is that every team gets penalized for each incident.

It’s unfortunate that Clay was penalized for event points AND financially for this incident. The punishment does not fit the infraction in this case.

I bet they will check that plug behind the front tow hook in the future to make sure it can’t fall out!

Ballast: Noun
: A heavy substance placed in such a way as to improve stability and control

Bodies, fire bottles and blower parts hardly fit the definition.

Alan

 

[Randy]

Ballast: Noun
: A heavy substance placed in such a way as to improve stability and control

Bodies, fire bottles and blower parts hardly fit the definition.

Alan

You forgot to mention overweight drivers as well.

My definition of ballast: "Anything on a race car which serves no useful purpose, except to increase the weight of the car, in order to balance it or make minimum weight for the class it's participating in."

I may or may not have seen some interesting things rolled up in parachutes after a run, but that's a different story.

Another reason for the loose weight rule, ie, shot bag rule, is that after a run it may or may not have been very easy for someone to just drop a 10 pound shot bag somewhere on the floor before heading to the scales just to make sure minimum weight was reached at the scales. Larry Sutton might remember a guy I used to work with who had cement filled tires he would put on after a run before heading to the scales, claiming he changed the tires to save wear on his slicks while towing through the pits. Then there are the weighted helmets, etc. Racers can be very creative.

 

[sammi]

One has to ask why a public citation/warning couldn't have straightened this out. Killing a top ten finish and event disqualification is the kind of penalty one might expect to see when a racer/team tampers with a safety system.

 

[LoPony]

Ballast: Noun
: A heavy substance placed in such a way as to improve stability and control

Bodies, fire bottles and blower parts hardly fit the definition.

Alan

I’m aware of the definition, Alan. Could be argued that all parts on a car fit that description too, since everything adds weight.

Aside from that, and more to the point, since arguing semantics here is useless - it seems like a defect in the rear plug on the chassis front center tube is to fault in this case? I was really interested to see the ballast weights shown above in another post, and I guess those weren’t available to them that day. The accident certainly wasn’t intentional and the penalty is a dramatic over-reaction by NHRA under the circumstances.

HOWEVER, it is interesting that the ballast popped out when the front end came up, and BEFORE the front end impacted the ground. Almost like the plug in the chassis wasn’t there in the first place?

Just unfortunate and an unreasonably harsh penalty. I’m glad they appealed it, but considering exactly what happened, I can see NHRA’s point, and the team’s point. Wish there was some middle ground here.

 

[TSK]

I wonder if there will be any repercussions for Clay due to his speaking out about the penalty.
Some people get kind of cranky when they are called out for something that makes everybody scratch their head wondering about why certain decisions were made.
The infraction occurred during the race. The penalty should have been handed down immediately, and the team told, to their faces, about the punishment, not several days later and by email.
That’s a poultry feces way of doing things.

 

[LoPony]

I wonder if there will be any repercussions for Clay due to his speaking out about the penalty.
Some people get kind of cranky when they are called out for something that makes everybody scratch their head wondering about why certain decisions were made.
The infraction occurred during the race. The penalty should have been handed down immediately, and the team told, to their faces, about the punishment, not several days later and by email.
That’s a poultry feces way of doing things.

I agree. 6 days is not cool.

I doubt that will result in repercussions for Clay, which would fit within the definition of ‘retribution’ and could be a mess for the sport. He’s free to give his point of view.

 

[BOO BOO]

I think the main question should be why it took the NHRA 6 days to notify the team and why there has been no reason giving by the NHRA why ............ Alan any Insite ?

 

[LoPony]

well, there it is in black and white. sure wish i would have seen this 'plain as day' rule a few days ago when this first came out.
how could it take nhra 6 days to interpret this rule? much less more than one or less?
one wrong move in the pits cost that team so much. sucks.

That rule is far from “plain as day” I agree with you. LOL