ProNitro Pete
Nitro Member
Nitromater
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Nitro Quality in question now??
- Thread starter ProNitro Pete
- Start date
Nitrohelper
Nitro Member
99% is cheaper and easier to supply than the 99.5 or 99.9 % that is sold by "other" vendors.
There can be more acid in the lower grades that is not good for fuel pumps, and cylinder walls.
When you buy on the open market from traders, lab results are needed before the shipment is accepted.
Sometimes the paperwork from Asia can't be trusted. (lead paint in toys)
Barrels can vary in a shipment if they all aren't certified by the manufacturer.
There can be more acid in the lower grades that is not good for fuel pumps, and cylinder walls.
When you buy on the open market from traders, lab results are needed before the shipment is accepted.
Sometimes the paperwork from Asia can't be trusted. (lead paint in toys)
Barrels can vary in a shipment if they all aren't certified by the manufacturer.
B
Buzzz Miller
I heard about this about four weeks ago and have been itching to see it in print. Unfortunately, the numbers thrown around in the article and in the teams shop are not quite the same. Nor were the responsible parties. But we have a few more lab results to come back before we can go too far.
Nice article though. Thanks for the link.
Nice article though. Thanks for the link.
Nick Name
Nitro Member
Maybe it is fertilizer grade being passed off as racing fuel.
I remember some time back we were having a nitro discussion, maybe on the early mater or the old Compuserve boards. Angus was trying to get something like $1300 a drum (53 gal?) and everyone was calling them thieves, etc and saying how you could bring it in from China for only XX amount.
At the time I asked the question; "Are you sure you want the Chinese in control of the fuel source that defines our sport?"
At the time no one responded because they were all consumed with how bad Angus was ripping us off.
I guess those were "the good old days".
Jay
I remember some time back we were having a nitro discussion, maybe on the early mater or the old Compuserve boards. Angus was trying to get something like $1300 a drum (53 gal?) and everyone was calling them thieves, etc and saying how you could bring it in from China for only XX amount.
At the time I asked the question; "Are you sure you want the Chinese in control of the fuel source that defines our sport?"
At the time no one responded because they were all consumed with how bad Angus was ripping us off.
I guess those were "the good old days".
Jay
Nitrohaulic
Nitro Member
From what I've read, it's most commonly produced by heating propane, then injecting nitric acid, which causes a reaction. What that produces is distilled into many products, nitromethane being one of them. I'm sure there's a lot of room for variation. At what point of your process are you getting nitromethane and at what point are you distilling something else? How much difference is there in the chemical at high and low ends of the process in which it can all still be technically called nitromethane?
Chemical and Process Design Handbook - Google Book Search
Scroll up through those diagrams and tell me there's not a lot of room for variation in products before they get through the final distillation stage. I pulled chemical tankers for eight years and often watched companies change from one brand of this to another brand of the same thing due to quality and consistency, not price. Like a plant worker in South Carolina once told me where were hauling a LOT of stuff out "Once they get a taste of our so and so, they can't get enough."
Chemical and Process Design Handbook - Google Book Search
Scroll up through those diagrams and tell me there's not a lot of room for variation in products before they get through the final distillation stage. I pulled chemical tankers for eight years and often watched companies change from one brand of this to another brand of the same thing due to quality and consistency, not price. Like a plant worker in South Carolina once told me where were hauling a LOT of stuff out "Once they get a taste of our so and so, they can't get enough."
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Uh-oh Ron,
Bill Dee warned us on the Funny Car board that you were studying up on this. Glad I don't live in eastern TN. LOL!
Nitrohaulic
Nitro Member
Uh-oh Ron,
Bill Dee warned us on the Funny Car board that you were studying up on this. Glad I don't live in eastern TN. LOL!
Just looking with an open mind, LOL. My neighbors are used to hearing black powder target shooting, anyways. They'll just think I used a few extra grains.
Toby
Nitro Member
I remember when Fuzzy and Eddie were just blowing their stuff up on a regular basis. They found that the fuel lines were deteriorating and plugging nozzles. Now this is an extreme case, and every team strains their fuel. But with the safety committee looking at the cause of these explosions that we have been having lately I would think that everyone would be greatly concerned about this issue and it sounds like it has progressed from an economic and personality issue to a safety issue. This should not be tolerated by the sanctioning body. Time to man up and do what needs to be done. Allow the teams to purchase Nitro that meets their specs from wherever they can get it from.
i would think that if there is an engine failure and the cause can be traced to inferior Nitro it would place the Sanctioning body and the "official fuel supplier" in an untenable situation. They are knowingly placing people in harm's way.
i would think that if there is an engine failure and the cause can be traced to inferior Nitro it would place the Sanctioning body and the "official fuel supplier" in an untenable situation. They are knowingly placing people in harm's way.
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FABMAN
Nitro Member
I have never messed with nitro but could the inconsistence have anything to do with the more frequent engine explosions.
When you receive your next drum look on the side of the drum and it should tell you what the percentage is on the drum. If not ask for the paper work.
You should be able to see what the water content, acid content, color is for the batch number. Do keep in mind that straining the nitro is helping alot of teams. A new chamois will do the deal for you make sure it is of high quality
and not a dyed Chamois. You will see the differance. Filtering is the ticket
to helping with clogged nozzle so on and so forth. Alot of people have also had problem with nitro turning black and rusty looking do to the acid content
it is pulling some of the dye out of returns in some cases and dying whats left in the tank.
34500.00 January 08
102000.00 July 1, 08
This price dosen't include transportation and brokerage or insurance
You should be able to see what the water content, acid content, color is for the batch number. Do keep in mind that straining the nitro is helping alot of teams. A new chamois will do the deal for you make sure it is of high quality
and not a dyed Chamois. You will see the differance. Filtering is the ticket
to helping with clogged nozzle so on and so forth. Alot of people have also had problem with nitro turning black and rusty looking do to the acid content
it is pulling some of the dye out of returns in some cases and dying whats left in the tank.
34500.00 January 08
102000.00 July 1, 08
This price dosen't include transportation and brokerage or insurance
Nitrohelper
Nitro Member
In the big picture I would say no, the rev-limiter is the big killer in the last few hundred feet.
Before the R/L when the engine was hurt the driver could feel it "nose over" and then lift, with 1320' they had to drive on because it could be on the limiter.
Parts failure in the valve train,or ignition system can give you the big fire anywhere in the run.
If the slide valve doesn't close, the pistons are hurt by half track ,and will throw the rods out.
Pistons can also be scuffed on the burnout. Many times when you burn a piston, the aluminum gets under the intake valve ,and then the backfire occurs.
The Nitro contamination makes your tune-up lazy,so you have to chase it by changing things.
Then when you get pure Nitro again (different drum) you are too hopped up,and will probability smoke the tires or burn a piston.
headporter
Nitro Member
Perhaps this could be the reason for the color difference in the flames when they run. If you look at them when we get a good side by side race, it's been happening for a while now. I can't imagine a percent or 2 change of nitro is going to effect color as much. Perhaps ESPN or alan Johnson could borrow the thermo imaging gun and see who's burning at what temp. I know cam and timing changes can increase Exhuast temps. who has the answers
Maybe we can point it at graham cracker lites head, when you say how about 400 cu fuel motors to slow them down. since it would cost next to nothing. since they cycle out cranks rods and pistons like water. I wonder if it would register any heat change to see a thought process. I doubt it.
Maybe we can point it at graham cracker lites head, when you say how about 400 cu fuel motors to slow them down. since it would cost next to nothing. since they cycle out cranks rods and pistons like water. I wonder if it would register any heat change to see a thought process. I doubt it.
