Mark Niver Fatally Injured (2 Viewers)

[jm]

It kind of seems that not only did the EMT/Paramedic Team not attempt to
contact Marks family, but more to the point, neither did NHRA.
Now, I fully admit I am not an attorney, Paramedic, ME, Law Enforcement
Officer, or an NHRA official{Praise Lord}, however.... given the fact this
tremendous man was either about to pass, or had already passed, how
in the world can anyone claim"Patient/Dr." confidentiality would prevent
the family from being informed untill 11pm. that evening??????????????

Are you telling me the spouse of a seriously injured man has NO say in
his treatment? Are you telling me the spouse of a seriously injured man
has "No right to be informed of his condition" due to the recently passed
medical confidentially laws???

I have seen some crazy laws passed in my time, but I doubt that even
Wash. State could get this passed.

It is a total FAIL by everyone involved in the process to save Mark Niver.
The process is a complete insult to each and every person who:

-Knew the man.
-Loves the sport
-Trusts the nhra
-Has any Humanity left in his soul.

May God let these fallen racers... race.
May God let those who put $$$ before driver safety... Not.....



cash their $$$$ in, wherever they finally "Rest"....

 

[kingcobrafan]

I wonder if anyone else thinks the first net was too close to the beginning of the sand trap? Seems having it further back and perhaps closer to the second net would have worked better. I agree that it seemed much too tight and didn't give enough.

Wondering what was on NHRA's mind? How 'bout that they did not give the family any information about what was going on until 11pm that night. Even though his body was still on the property, waiting for the M.E. until around 8pm as we were leaving the track. Nor did NHRA give them a liason or phone number to talk to about what to do next. Luckily, many racers, including team members from the pro ranks were helping with anything they could.

Unfortunetely, the entire family, including grandkids, were there, so you can imagine what a sad, sad situation it was.

I have known Mark & his family for 30 years and there wasn't a nicer man in world. Plus, he was my son's ex-father-in-law. RIP dear Mark. Guess they needed another fabricator at the Heavenly Drag Strip.

Pat, about the net, I couldn't agree more that it was way too close to the entrance of the trap and way too tight. And if things afterward took place as you say, and I believe you, it's absolutely inexcusable on NHRA's part.

 

[Jer]

It kind of seems that not only did the EMT/Paramedic Team not attempt to
contact Marks family, but more to the point, neither did NHRA.
Now, I fully admit I am not an attorney, Paramedic, ME, Law Enforcement
Officer, or an NHRA official{Praise Lord}, however.... given the fact this
tremendous man was either about to pass, or had already passed, how
in the world can anyone claim"Patient/Dr." confidentiality would prevent
the family from being informed untill 11pm. that evening??????????????

Are you telling me the spouse of a seriously injured man has NO say in
his treatment? Are you telling me the spouse of a seriously injured man
has "No right to be informed of his condition" due to the recently passed
medical confidentially laws???

I have seen some crazy laws passed in my time, but I doubt that even
Wash. State could get this passed.

It is a total FAIL by everyone involved in the process to save Mark Niver.
The process is a complete insult to each and every person who:

-Knew the man.
-Loves the sport
-Trusts the nhra
-Has any Humanity left in his soul.

May God let these fallen racers... race.
May God let those who put $$$ before driver safety... Not.....



cash their $$$$ in, wherever they finally "Rest"....

That is Bull**** the family should be 1 of the 1st to know,id get a good lawyer.

 

[Silly Savage]

I can't believe that the NHRA or even track officiasl didn't give ANY info to Tanis or the family. Not saying I don't believe Ma Green, I'm saying that someone should have had the common sense to get with the family and let them know what was happening. I had a wreck where I was unconcious when they got to me. My crew (family) were near the scene when I was cut out of the car. They were updated to what would happen....they were told where I was being taken and what they would do with my detroyed car. They didn't get to talk to or see ME until a couple hours later in the ICU, but they were at least given some info....

 

[clwill]

NHRA continues to promise investigations and comes up with knee jerk rules changes. I think many people realize that the real problem is a lack of standards for shutdown areas and the inability or unwillingness of the sanctioning body to research a solution.

Jim, we don't often agree, but here I agree with every word. Well said.

 

[Jim]

I suppose that your confidence in NHRA is admirable.

It is not confidence in NHRA. It is knowledge about how the medical industry works. When a person is being treated by medial professionals -- whether in an ambulance, doctor's office or hospital -- it is illegal for them to discuss the patient's condition with anyone other than next-of-kin until they see a signed authorization from the patient telling them otherwise.

If you have been to a physician's office in the past four years or so, you have had to sign a privacy statement during your first visit every year. That's what you are signing.

However, Pat was there and you apparently were not. I would be willing to bet she has seen more than one bad situation at a drag strip. If she says this was badly handled, I believe her.

It really does not matter what Pat has seen or thinks. The fact is that it is against federal law for a medical professional to discuss a patient's condition with anyone other than next-of-kin. So it is entirely possible that NHRA officials may not have told anyone about Niver because they did not know.

NHRA continues to promise investigations and comes up with knee jerk rules changes. I think many people realize that the real problem is a lack of standards for shutdown areas and the inability or unwillingness of the sanctioning body to research a solution.

That has nothing to do with what I said. My comments were specifically directed at the claim that NHRA officials did not tell Niver's wife and family.

As for standards in the shut down area, the solution might also require changes in the cars. That's one of the ways NASCAR, Indy Cars, F1, etc. have improved driver safety.

Jim

Jim

 

[Jim]

While I agree with what Jim says in basis, I also agree with Pat's assessment. Too many folks seem to believe that nothing can be said to anyone about anything...no matter what! So what is the problem of giving information to immediate family? ......
HIPPA rules are meant to keep medical staff from handing out info randomly and not to keep immediate family from being informed.

You are correct about the HIPAA laws. They are intended to keep medical staff from providing information to anyone other than immediate family without authorization.

No one here claimed that medical staff did not tell the family. They said that NHRA did not tell the family. I am saying that I can see a situation in which the medical staff refused to give information to NHRA officials until the got the authorization from Mrs. Niver. If that was the case, NHRA would have had no information to give the family, and would actually have to get the information FROM the family.

It's not like it used to be. It used to be that you could call a hospital and just ask for a condition update. Now, they won't even confirm that someone is in the hospital without authorization.

Jim

 

[Jim]

Are you telling me the spouse of a seriously injured man has NO say in
his treatment? Are you telling me the spouse of a seriously injured man
has "No right to be informed of his condition" due to the recently passed
medical confidentially laws???

You totally missed the point. The HIPAA laws say that ONLY the spouse or next of kin has that right unless there is a written authorization signed by the family.

That means that the medical staff cannot discuss a patient's condition with anyone other than the spouse until they get authorization from the spouse or the patient himself. If the patient has died, they are supposed to wait for authorization from the spouse before they tell anyone else.

Keep in mind that this only applies after the patient becomes the responsibility of medical professionals. Police and a coroner are not covered by the HIPAA laws, so if a driver is pronounced dead at the track, that can be announced immediately to anyone.

Jim

 

[jm]

Thank You.

A daughter is also considered "next of kin", BTW....

 

[Ma Green]

NOBODY told the Niver family anything....not the paramedics, not NHRA, not ANYONE! And, unbeknownst to Tanis, Mark's body was actually on the grounds until 8pm (I saw the coroner, sheriff & ambulance leaving). It took her until 11pm that night to even find out where he had been taken. Sorry, but that is NOT right.

You guys can say what you want, I was there and the Niver family has been family friends for 30 years. Tanis' youngest daughter, Samantha is my ex-daughter-in-law. I know exactly what happened and how this whole thing was (in this case wasn't) handled.

And, if you saw the film clip of Alexis DeJorio's foray into the net last year, you saw a vast difference between the end of that track & Seattle. Mark would most likely have survived had he been at a different track. with a better run-out area.

 

[Jer]

Shame on NHRA,family sport eh.

 

[the zone]

Ma, if in fact they had no word until 11pm is so bad as far as the NHRA goes (for the family)
I am sure that DRC had a post on its site about the deal on Sunday (not there now) and it was way before 11pm.
I know that my journalists knew by around 5:30-6:00pm.
I would think the family would have known by then.
I believe it was the paramedics that contacted the Coroner. Also was there not parmedics in the Niver pit area from around 4:30 on (or even earlier than that). I would think that the paramedics that were in their pit (if there were a few in their pit) would be in contact with the ones who were handling Mark.

How can so many others know and not them?

I just hope some real good comes of this.
IE a different type of safety catchment system.

Also the Englishtown shut down area is 500 feet shorter than Seattle, so their net ystem should be built differently in my opinion. (Even though I disagree with using nets. I have for years).

Dean

 

[Wayne]

OK, I think I must be really confused.

Bob Frey & Alan Reinhart made the announcement over the track PA @ 5:20pm or a minute or two before that. @ 5:23 I called my friend who'd left the track about a half hour before to let him know.

So, are some of you saying that Mark's wife DID NOT KNOW that he'd passed when the public announcement was made @ 5:20???

Please forgive me, I hope I'm just mis-understanding what you are saying.
This is not an attack; I just need to understand.

If ya need to, feel free to PM me. Thx!!!

 

[nwspeedshots]

Can’t say just when the family was informed, but a couple of hours (or so) before the announcement was made over the P.A., the very sad and depressing news traveled (quietly) through our corner of the stands. The rest of the day sucked.

 

[Ma Green]

The family came back to their pit area about 30 min after the accident. At that time, no one would tell them anything. That's why Corey (Mark's daughter) ran to the tower. Perhaps 20 minutes later, the family was told he had passed and word spread through the staging lanes.

My point is that Mark's body was on the grounds until 8pm, unknown to Tanis. Once it left, Tanis could not find out where he had been taken...who to call....what to do next....where the car was....NOTHING until 11pm that night! It took some other racers making calls to their contacts to get the family some information.

I find it unbelievable that NHRA doesn't have someone on staff who takes care of things when this happens (which thankfully isn't all that often).

My last word on this is that NHRA handled this entire situation very badly.

 

[Jim]

My point is that Mark's body was on the grounds until 8pm, unknown to Tanis.

Do you know when the police released the body?

My understanding is that the police were investigating the crash. When that happens, it is up to them to decide when the body can be taken to the morgue.

Jim

 

[Ma Green]

They can investigate all they want....HOWEVER, the family should have been kept in the loop....even if Tanis could not see Mark, as least she would have known what was going on. How upset would you be if that was your spouse, child, father, grandfather?

NHRA should have a designated person who stays with the family and guides them through whatever needs to happen. This entire deal was handled very badly.

 

[Wayne]

You are right Pat but I myself would throw more blame to the police & medical personel on site that to NHRA.

NHRA is NOT blameless for the tragic "after crash" events but the police & medical people were the people in charge & they needed to do the right/compassionate thing by Tanis & family.
Obviously they were doing thier investigation but they needed to keep Tanis in the loop!!!
I would've thought that the Chaplain at the track(NHRA or track Chaplain) would've been involved as well as some official for NHRA or the track.

I hope that we never have to deal with a situation like this again and if so, I truely hope that the law enforcement, medical, AND NHRA people will learn by the mistakes made here.

Thank you Pat for explaining the situation & more importantly, thank you for being there for the family!!!

Please don't forget to take care of yourself too!!!
That goes for all of us fans that are being affected by this tragedy!!!
RIP Mark
Wayne