Del's A/FC (2 Viewers)

I understand what Del is saying about stepping up to Top Fuel back in the 1980's with most of the same parts, but it was never implied that the Top Alcohol classes were formed to do that. It's like saying ET Motorcycle is the stepping stone for Pro Stock Motorcycle. Zero of those parts interchange. Why must the TA class now conform to TF specs? It's so stupid.
 
Well IMO what Del was actually saying was........
IF you intend on going to the big show this is the combo to learn on.
Thankfully NHRA has allowed it to be run in a class so someone wanting to go to the big show can learn here before spending the big money.
Is it the right class I do not know, but apparently NHRA thinks so. We all know how that works out, NHRA trying to make a level playing field.
 
Spending $250K for a car, and maybe some parts is big money to most. Not including a truck/trailer and tools. Then the money it would eat to run it.... Kudos to NHRA and Del Worsham for trying this out. Sure, if one already has this stuff lying around it would not be out of the question to put something together and run. Interesting deal though. One would think a guy would have to lean on his equipment even moreso now in an alky car to keep up and maybe others will join in on the fray and put something similar together. Another issue would be fuel costs for the car. $1440 a drum of nitro for our N/FC here in the midwest. Compared to the cost of a drum of Methanol vs Nitro and how much fuel it takes per run on nitro would be an eye opener to the uninformed. And does this class get to bring in their own nitro fuel, or have to buy it from a supplier at the track ?
 
As Del said for some it will make sense for others not so much. Some can get TF parts used cheap but fuel costs offset that. Also as far as competitiveness ET is similar, Del compared it to running a turbo car not much down low but comes on big at the top end. Time will tell, may make it better, may kill it. Or like happens in other classes everyone gravitates to the winning combo and alcohol might become baby nitro.
 
As Del said for some it will make sense for others not so much. Some can get TF parts used cheap but fuel costs offset that. Also as far as competitiveness ET is similar, Del compared it to running a turbo car not much down low but comes on big at the top end. Time will tell, may make it better, may kill it. Or like happens in other classes everyone gravitates to the winning combo and alcohol might become baby nitro.
I like that they are running full 1/4 mile
 
I hear a lot of grumbles about "Pro Camaro"; I know some of you have been around here long enough to remember when 3/4ers of the PS class was Firebirds at one point, or covered with Oldsmobile Cutlass skin (also 3/4 of the class, if not more).
Super Gas? A bunch of 1969 Camaro doorstops...

There is obviously a reason for the copy-cat approach; its really nice to see Del and company take a different direction on a class that could use a shot in the butt (I still miss 1980s Pro Comp). I hope it doesn't get ruled out of existence like so many other cool parts of the sport
I've mentioned 'Pro Camaro' but that's not really the problem. IndyCar is doing well, F1 is doing spectacularly well and those cars are just as unilateral as Pro Stock cars. The only thing that differentiates them is the paint and a few are running Chevy engines which fans don't give a rat's patootie about.

Pro Stock is more of a victim than a perpetrator. Victim of the race Sunday/buy Monday mentality of 1970. Victim of crazy expense and the technical skill to be competitive. Victim of personal devices, namely, the almighty cell phone. TikTok rules, not NHRA. Victim of no longer being exciting enough to grab and hold the attention of the average fan. The big tire/small tire no-prep stuff does well because it's comparatively cheaper, less technical, it often offers huge purses and those competing/attending tend to be much more hardcore drag racing folks than your average IPhone champion.

Major props to Del for thinking outside the box. What's not to love about a new combination and a 10,000hp margarita mixer? LOL But I seriously doubt it will save TAFC - if for no other reason it's a lot more expensive but with no additional return on investment. And all fans are going to see is cars that look, sound and run 40mph slower than the cars they just saw run 30 minutes ago.
 
I've mentioned 'Pro Camaro' but that's not really the problem. IndyCar is doing well, F1 is doing spectacularly well and those cars are just as unilateral as Pro Stock cars. The only thing that differentiates them is the paint and a few are running Chevy engines which fans don't give a rat's patootie about.

Pro Stock is more of a victim than a perpetrator. Victim of the race Sunday/buy Monday mentality of 1970. Victim of crazy expense and the technical skill to be competitive. Victim of personal devices, namely, the almighty cell phone. TikTok rules, not NHRA. Victim of no longer being exciting enough to grab and hold the attention of the average fan. The big tire/small tire no-prep stuff does well because it's comparatively cheaper, less technical, it often offers huge purses and those competing/attending tend to be much more hardcore drag racing folks than your average IPhone champion.

Major props to Del for thinking outside the box. What's not to love about a new combination and a 10,000hp margarita mixer? LOL But I seriously doubt it will save TAFC - if for no other reason it's a lot more expensive but with no additional return on investment. And all fans are going to see is cars that look, sound and run 40mph slower than the cars they just saw run 30 minutes ago.
It could be a plus to divisional shows having blown jr top fuel dragster and blown jr fuel funny cars to bring in more fans and with more exposer at more tracks, need a good feeder pool to develop more big show fans as well as starting points for new up and comers👀😎
 
It could be a plus to divisional shows having blown jr top fuel dragster and blown jr fuel funny cars to bring in more fans and with more exposer at more tracks, need a good feeder pool to develop more big show fans as well as starting points for new up and comers👀😎
I like your idea ! But as their own class, not part of Top Alcohol class.
 
being involved in drag racing for over 60 years I did try the outlaw light not bad!!! What amazes me is golfers watching people put balls and holes and being paid a lot of money
The reality of your golf analogy is tens of millions of people play golf on a regular basis and totally relate to the game. Those numbers don't transfer over to the great sport of drag racing unfortunately
 
being involved in drag racing for over 60 years I did try the outlaw light not bad!!! What amazes me is golfers watching people put balls and holes and being paid a lot of money

IMO it is because those people for a few hundred bucks can pretend to be like the pro's and actually play golf. These days you need 20k to run brackets never mind anything else.
Then golf lasts the whole day no matter how much you suck. Drag racing 10 seconds, you lose and you get to go home. And if you do win you get to sit around for 3 hours to race for 10 more seconds.
Does not fit with todays instant gratification life style.
Besides most have zero interest in drag racing and who actually builds a performance car anymore ??.
 
IMO it is because those people for a few hundred bucks can pretend to be like the pro's and actually play golf. These days you need 20k to run brackets never mind anything else.
Then golf lasts the whole day no matter how much you suck. Drag racing 10 seconds, you lose and you get to go home. And if you do win you get to sit around for 3 hours to race for 10 more seconds.
Does not fit with todays instant gratification life style.
Besides most have zero interest in drag racing and who actually builds a performance car anymore ??.
There's still fans and hardcore racers out there including some youth but not like it was 30-40 years ago. I blame a lot of that on the advent of the internet and the cell phone. Unfortunately, with the political climate being the way it is we're finding the interest in RuPaul's idea of drag racing is more captivating than NHRA's idea of drag racing. Pretty damn sad.

I'd love to watch the new TAFC combination run at regional events as something besides Top Alcohol cars but I just don't see it. You're still talking a ton of money (and experience with supercharged nitro) for almost zero in return even if you win. Doin' it for the love only goes so far. And I have a question - what does TAFC's competitors who actually run blown alcohol think of this new combination? Are they glad to see something that might stimulate more interest in the class from competitors and fans alike or do they look at that 291mph pass and say "oh, hell no..." ?
 
Are they glad to see something that might stimulate more interest in the class from competitors and fans alike or do they look at that 291mph pass and say "oh, hell no..." ?

as Del explained this combo is like a turbo car it has no oomph down low and comes alive up top, the ET's are comparable. In theory it will be a competitive combo and teach someone who wants to go to the big show to tune the car. Is it cheaper ? no Is it for everyone ? no Does it belong in TAFC ? IDK
 
as Del explained this combo is like a turbo car it has no oomph down low and comes alive up top, the ET's are comparable. In theory it will be a competitive combo and teach someone who wants to go to the big show to tune the car. Is it cheaper ? no Is it for everyone ? no Does it belong in TAFC ? IDK
I'd be the last person to question Del Worsham. Still, despite the clutch restrictions - namely, no electronic management and less primary levers, that 291mph car is slower than a Pro Stock car to the 60 and barely quicker than a Pro Stock motorcycle with engines likely developing as much or more horsepower than those 'big show' cars in, say, 1992. Those cars were also direct drive and routinely logged .880-.900 60-foots.

A bit crude by today's standards but there was a degree of clutch management in 1992; this new combination has none. Is that in itself enough to make the difference between a comparative rocketship out of the gate and a dog?
 
I'd be the last person to question Del Worsham. Still, despite the clutch restrictions - namely, no electronic management and less primary levers, that 291mph car is slower than a Pro Stock car to the 60 and barely quicker than a Pro Stock motorcycle with engines likely developing as much or more horsepower than those 'big show' cars in, say, 1992. Those cars were also direct drive and routinely logged .880-.900 60-foots.

A bit crude by today's standards but there was a degree of clutch management in 1992; this new combination has none. Is that in itself enough to make the difference between a comparative rocketship out of the gate and a dog?

IIRC he said it was a combo of that and the limited 16.7% blower overdrive.
 
IIRC he said it was a combo of that and the limited 16.7% blower overdrive.
I understood that the switch to injected nitro was less maintenance expensive because of the lower rpm, can anyone tell me what the rpm difference there is when running dels combo on nitro compared to straight alcohol cars and if Dels combo runs less rpm will the savings from lower rpm’s apply with with blown nitro👍😎
 
I understood that the switch to injected nitro was less maintenance expensive because of the lower rpm, can anyone tell me what the rpm difference there is when running dels combo on nitro compared to straight alcohol cars and if Dels combo runs less rpm will the savings from lower rpm’s apply with with blown nitro👍😎
Del’s combo runs less RPM (somewhere around 8k) than blown alcohol (10k+) but more than injected nitro (around 6500).
 
Still scratching my head a bit over why a car that runs 291mph ETs with others that run 265. Nostalgia FC's have run 5.50s with teeny weeny fuel pumps, 6-71 wind with 18%OD. They do run 2 speed transmissions.

Doesn't matter so I'll hush. If Worsham says that's how it works, then that's how it works. ;)
 
I'd be the last person to question Del Worsham. Still, despite the clutch restrictions - namely, no electronic management and less primary levers, that 291mph car is slower than a Pro Stock car to the 60 and barely quicker than a Pro Stock motorcycle with engines likely developing as much or more horsepower than those 'big show' cars in, say, 1992. Those cars were also direct drive and routinely logged .880-.900 60-foots.

A bit crude by today's standards but there was a degree of clutch management in 1992; this new combination has none. Is that in itself enough to make the difference between a comparative rocketship out of the gate and a dog?

In 1992 the fuel funny car minumumn weight rule was at least 300 pounds lighter than it is today. Maybe even more.
 
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Still scratching my head a bit over why a car that runs 291mph ETs with others that run 265. Nostalgia FC's have run 5.50s with teeny weeny fuel pumps, 6-71 wind with 18%OD. They do run 2 speed transmissions.

Doesn't matter so I'll hush. If Worsham says that's how it works, then that's how it works. ;)
There’s a lot more differences that come into play if you try to compare a NFC to this combo. I really don’t think it’s a fair comparison, but I understand why people do it because they are both nitro funny cars, and they run similar ET’s.

NFC
2300 lbs.
Min 3.90 rear gear.
3 disc clutch.
34.5” rear tire
Minimal downforce.
High coefficient of drag.

Little Big Show
2650 lbs
3.20 rear gear required
4 disc clutch
36” rear tire
All the downforce
Low coefficient of drag

Less gearing, more clutch, bigger tire, and more downforce all load the engine harder; which we all know the more you load it, the more power it makes. That’s why the speed is there out the back. It doesn’t move as well off the starting line because of the weight difference.
 
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There’s a lot more differences that come into play if you try to compare a NFC to this combo. I really don’t think it’s a fair comparison, but I understand why people do it because they are both nitro funny cars, and they run similar ET’s.

NFC
2300 lbs.
Min 3.90 rear gear.
3 disc clutch.
34.5” rear tire
Minimal downforce.
High coefficient of drag.

Little Big Show
2650 lbs
3.20 rear gear required
4 disc clutch
36” rear tire
All the downforce
Low coefficient of drag

Less gearing, more clutch, bigger tire, and more downforce all load the engine harder; which we all know the more you load it, the more power it makes. That’s why the speed is there out the back. It doesn’t move as well off the starting line because of the weight difference.
Sounds like the difference revolves around weight and gearing and not necessarily available power. In my mind I'm thinking"would 350 extra pounds and taller overall gearing really make that much difference? With 5000 (or whatever) horsepower?" Obviously it does; you're the expert on why and I'm not. I appreciate the lesson, Josh.:)

I'll be in Ennis in 6 weeks so hopefully I'll get to watch the car and any others like it that might come out to play. And I'd still like to know what the true blown alcohol folks think. Good for the class? Bad for the class?
 

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