Clemens on 60 minutes (1 Viewer)

[Kelly]

OK...I dvr'd it and haven't watched it yet. I'm sooooo on the fence with this dude. I have been for a very long time. I guess it's the whole 'what have you done for me lately thing'. I wasn't impressed with what he did as an Astro. I never even saw him pitch live in an Astro uni. In fact, on a personal side I just have never found him very sincere. Anyway, I know he's an outstanding pitcher with one helluva history. BUT...well, I guess I should watch the show now.

 

[Joker]

OK...I dvr'd it and haven't watched it yet. I'm sooooo on the fence with this dude. I have been for a very long time. I guess it's the whole 'what have you done for me lately thing'. I wasn't impressed with what he did as an Astro. I never even saw him pitch live in an Astro uni. In fact, on a personal side I just have never found him very sincere. Anyway, I know he's an outstanding pitcher with one helluva history. BUT...well, I guess I should watch the show now.

He's the best pitcher to ever put on an Astro's uniform Kel. How can you not be impressed when a 40 plus year old pitcher does what he did. The first year he pitched for us he won I believe 14 or so games and he lost 8 games 1-0 b/c our sorry azz offense couldnt score 2 runs.

As for the steriod thing, he probably used them. But I still dont think they help pitchers all that much other than coming back from an injury. I think tightening up there muscles and stuff could actually hurt them some. I think he's handled this Mitchell Report thing badly. If he did them he should just admit it and it will eventually go away. No one is talking about Pettite, Giambi, etc. I watched it last night and he looked a mix between nervous and pissed off.

I just dont see what McNamee has to gain by lying about it. I do feel bad for Roger either way especially if he didnt do it b/c he will be forever linked to it. He filed a lawsuit last night and supposedly McNamee told him in a supposed phone call Fri night he only named him b/c he was threatened by the Feds.

As a baseball fan, I have known for years that steriods was a big factor and so has baseball and they did nothing about it. To me Rog is still one of the greatest pitchers of all time whether or not he used steriods.

 

[Jim]

I think Clemens did it. Ever since he left the Red Sox I have not felt he has been a man of his word. (Disclaimer- I am a Red Sox fan.) He always said if he ever left the Sox he would only go to a team that was closer to home such as the Rangers or the Astros. So where does he go, first to Toronto, for the money, then then to Yankees before he went to the Astros to be closer to home. I would not have a problem if he had said I am going for the money or never said he would only go to play closer to home, just be honest.

McNamee was told that if he lied he would face jail time, so what does he gain from saying Clemens did it? I know if will be hard to prove that he lied about Rodger, but if he did lie and gets caught he will go to jail, would McNamee risk that? Andy Pettitte admitting that he used the stuff does not help Rodgers cause either. Why would McNamee tell the truth about Pettitte and lie about Rodger. It does not appear that he has anything to gain by lying, but everything to loose.

Just before Rodger left the Red Sox, Dan Duquette, the Sox GM at the time, said publicly he had doubts that Rodger was once the pitcher he had been and maybe a move to the bull pen would be in his future as he was approaching his mid 30's. Clemens at that time, had let himself go, he was heavier then normal and had seemed to loose a little off his stuff etc and had been 20-18 with an era of 3.95 over the last 2 seasons (95-96). The next 2 years in Toronto he goes 41-13 with an era of 2.35 while winning 2 Cy Young's. You have to wonder if what Duquette said got to him enough to use the juice?

 

[Kelly]

Justin.....I know. Sometimes I just don't make sense.

I watched it....and I want to watch it again before I comment. Also, he's holding a press conference today. Supposedly, he will be stating he is suing McNamee.

 

[Suzie Q]

I watched it too. Maybe his trainer put the HGH in the B12 shots and he didn't know it. Ok, I am just dreaming............wake up little Suzie, wake up!

It is one of those "known unknowns"!!!

 

[mick]

real winners don't cheat..........right?

 

[Toejam]

He's the best pitcher to ever put on an Astro's uniform Kel. How can you not be impressed when a 40 plus year old pitcher does what he did. The first year he pitched for us he won I believe 14 or so games and he lost 8 games 1-0 b/c our sorry azz offense couldnt score 2 runs.

As for the steriod thing, he probably used them. But I still dont think they help pitchers all that much other than coming back from an injury. I think tightening up there muscles and stuff could actually hurt them some. I think he's handled this Mitchell Report thing badly. If he did them he should just admit it and it will eventually go away. No one is talking about Pettite, Giambi, etc. I watched it last night and he looked a mix between nervous and pissed off.

I just dont see what McNamee has to gain by lying about it. I do feel bad for Roger either way especially if he didnt do it b/c he will be forever linked to it. He filed a lawsuit last night and supposedly McNamee told him in a supposed phone call Fri night he only named him b/c he was threatened by the Feds.

As a baseball fan, I have known for years that steriods was a big factor and so has baseball and they did nothing about it. To me Rog is still one of the greatest pitchers of all time whether or not he used steriods.

Justin, Nolan Ryan threw his last No-Hitter at age 44 in an Astro's uniform. Is Clemons the Best Pitcher of the last 50 years? Yes

 

[TJ]

You guys blow my mind here w/ your thinking and opinions...
Clemens is the same as Bonds....GUILTY of aiding/helping his physical ability...and SO what...
The only difference is one is white and one is black...Look @ Mcguire...Guilty of using juice...

 

[Joker]

Justin, Nolan Ryan threw his last No-Hitter at age 44 in an Astro's uniform. Is Clemons the Best Pitcher of the last 50 years? Yes

Nolan threw his 7th and final no hitter as a Texas Ranger.

 

[Bullard Anderson]

MLB and the Media (especially ESPN Radio) need to say, "Hey, whether you cheated or not, we don't care. Take your money and go. We don't care. It's time to start new and forget you."

We need to get back to the game.

All those MLB rookie cards I have from the 80's? Tarnished? No good!

 

[Joker]

You guys blow my mind here w/ your thinking and opinions...
Clemens is the same as Bonds....GUILTY of aiding/helping his physical ability...and SO what...
The only difference is one is white and one is black...Look @ Mcguire...Guilty of using juice...

Its not a white/black thing Terry. I cant stand Bonds, it has nothing to do with race. I have always been a Clemens fan and I always will be. MLB is who I blame for this whole debacle. Sure McGwire and Sosa were doing it also. The home run chase back then is what brought people back to the stadiums thats why the MLB didnt care. They were finally recovering from the strike. The problem is that they had no testing, so there's no way of knowing whether they used it or not so I dont think they should face any kind of hall of fame penalty.

At first I wanted to crucify Bonds b/c its obvious that they guy used and with the Balco thing you know for sure he did. As with some others. Barroid can hit another 100 homers for all I care b/c to me, he cant even hold a jockstrap to the Babe. However with Clemens and all the others in the Mitchell report there is no proof other than McNamee saying they did it. I'm not saying I dont think Clemens did it, b/c I do but they have to prove it to not let them into the Hall. And I feel for Clemens and those guys b/c they is no way they can prove there innocence if they are innocent.

If they can prove it then I dont have a problem not letting any of htem into the HOF. Its not a black/white issue, its a different situation issue. And like I said, and I know plenty of people disagree but I dont think steriods helps a pitcher all that much. A batter yes it can, but I dont think it helps a pitcher all that much. But regardless if he used them, then he shouldnt be in the HOF. Either way, he's still the best pitcher in the last 50 years like Joe said and I will always be able to say I saw Roger Clemens pitch. Juiced or not.

Him and Bonds are going to be the scape goat for everyone on this and I can bet there are tons of more high profile players who are breathing a sigh of relief that there names havent been mentioned b/c they are alot more than just 86 players using the juice or another alternative.

 

[none]

Barroid can hit another 100 homers for all I care b/c to me, he cant even hold a jockstrap to the Babe.

Are you serious Justin!? Ruth never played against any blacks or latinos and he didn`t play against middle relievers, setup guys and closers who all throw 95 mph heat. Being a Yankees fan I appreciate Ruth and everything he accomplished, but to say he`s better than Bonds is a stretch. Yeah Barry juiced, but he`s still more talented than the Babe.

 

[Kelly]

And where does Roger Maris fit in there?

 

[Joker]

Are you serious Justin!? Ruth never played against any blacks or latinos and he didn`t play against middle relievers, setup guys and closers who all throw 95 mph heat. Being a Yankees fan I appreciate Ruth and everything he accomplished, but to say he`s better than Bonds is a stretch. Yeah Barry juiced, but he`s still more talented than the Babe.

When someone mentions the greatest player to ever play the game, if the Babe isint mentioned its a shame. Sure the game is different today. Tougher? Maybe. Just think if Babe actually tried. He could have put some records so far outta touch no one would ever reach them. The only thing Babe was on was women, beer, and hotdogs and had no workout regime or anything like that at all really. If he applied himself, he would be untouchable. And to me, when someone thinks of baseball, they think of Babe Ruth. Just like Dale Sr when thinking of Nascar, Jordan for the NBA, etc.

It might not matter though b/c alot of people think if Alex Rodriquez stays healthy he will break all the records. We will see. I'm surprised his name hasnt been mentioned in all this steriod talk. I'm not saying I think he's doing it, I am just surprised I havent heard his name from all the witch hunters.

 

[Joker]

And where does Roger Maris fit in there?

Kel, I dont know his career numbers but I dont believe he is on the same planet as the Babe, Bonds, etc. I could be wrong but I think he only had a few good seasons. If I'm not mistaken, he isint even in the HOF.

 

[none]

And where does Roger Maris fit in there?

Not even in the same breath as Bonds or Ruth...or Mantle. Loved Rogers magical 61 home run season in `61, but he never hit as many as 40 in any other season. He was career .260 hitter with a little over 1,300 hits and 275 career homers.

 

[Kelly]

Now.....see how little I know about those damn Yankees??!!

(btw LOVED THE MOVIE *61! May just be my favorite sports movie ever!)

 

[paoldtimer]

explain to me why you have to shoot lidocaine in your butt...unless you have a pain in your ***...and why you dont just take your vitamin B12 orally???

Man up, Roger...and all will be forgiven, by many.

I don't care - I lost my love for baseball after the 2nd player's strike...

 

[TJ]

Roger is in a very HOT seat right now and his legacy will not be what he had visioned...
And to defend Bonds....doping up does not make you put the bat on the ball any better...Bonds has major league talent just like Clemens...

 

[Toejam]

Are you serious Justin!? Ruth never played against any blacks or latinos and he didn`t play against middle relievers, setup guys and closers who all throw 95 mph heat. Being a Yankees fan I appreciate Ruth and everything he accomplished, but to say he`s better than Bonds is a stretch. Yeah Barry juiced, but he`s still more talented than the Babe.

How Babe Ruth would do in Today's game is anyone's guess. But lets remember he was a Full-time Pitcher and a Damn good one at that for 3-4 years before they discovered his slugging ability! That means he could've had another 100 dingers had he'd hit full time!