Beckman's New Idea For The Countdown....

[Rat]

When you did those outcomes... how did you tally the points? Did you include the "little" points for being top 3 times of each session too in recent years? That may make a big difference too.

I included everything.

 

[Rat]

I thought when Capps got hosed you had to go back to 2005 - pre countdown at Reading.

Left Lane: Ron Capps No Time, Now #17; Best prior run: 5.081/251.86, Was #17 That
Right Lane: John Force Runs 4.804/322.11, Now #2; Best prior run: 4.910/310.13, Was #10

Both cars did their burnouts. When they were getting ready to stage, starter Rick Stewart told Capps to shut his car down. Force had a nice run to move into the number two spot. After Force finished his run, Capps and his crew got into a starting line argument with Stewart.

They shut him off for an oil leak on the starting line that wasn't from his car. He lost a qualifying run in the "good" conditions and was a DNQ going into saturday. He eventually ended up in 9th, and Scelzi was #1. That made for a 6 point spread. Maybe he would have gotten the run and went #1 instead of Scelzi making it a 7 point swing? In the end, Scelzi won the championship by 8 points.

I remember that now, you are correct, but it all comes down to this, would Ace of taken # 1, even if he did Scelzi still would of been #2. Now read this carefully cause it sounds very contradicting:

He did not lose it in qualifying because the 8 point spread he lost by would of been 7, but technically they lost it by running a 4.824 qualifying 9th when if he only ran a 4.812 or better he would of been the 7th spot or better he needed. Any other car that round he would of beat expect for his opponent robert hight. I say he did get screwed because chances are he would of run a 70 that night and just going out in round 2 would won the championship by 18 points in pomona.

 

[Bullard Anderson]

Beckman's New Idea for the Countdown.....

Beckman winning the Countdown would be a NEW idea!

 

[Rat]

Beckman's New Idea for the Countdown.....

Beckman winning the Countdown would be a NEW idea!

Beckman is the last racer who should complain about the format, although it has not netting him a championship yet, the countdown has been an amazing thing for his career.

 

[Rajunz]

You can do all of the math and researching that you want, I still say that what we have now with the Countdown is way more exciting to follow than what we had before without it.

Going into Pomona this week, typically all but maybe one class was sewn up. Some done as early as 2 months ago, not very exciting to watch that stuff.

 

[Bullard Anderson]

You can do all of the math and researching that you want, I still say that what we have now with the Countdown is way more exciting to follow than what we had before without it.

Going into Pomona this week, typically all but maybe one class was sewn up. Some done as early as 2 months ago, not very exciting to watch that stuff.

Excellent post Lance! Always stood by the statement on my fanhood: "Hey NHRA, entertain me!"

This weekend looks great going in. Can't control what happens once the green bulb is lit, but it's highly anticipated from my end.

 

[Jon Asher]

I want to apologize for a misstatement I made earlier in this thread.

NASCAR is no longer paying the million dollar bonus for the driver who finishes
11th. This year that would have been 13th, but regardless, I goofed, and they're no longer paying the money.

One assumes, from seeing their often half-empty grandstands, the NASCAR decided they no longer needed to spend that money.

Jon Asher

 

[mike]

Going into Pomona this week, typically all but maybe one class was sewn up. Some done as early as 2 months ago, not very exciting to watch that stuff.

unless you are there to watch the actual RACE rather than worry about the championship

not trying to pick on anybody, but I think an individual race is worth watching regardless of what is going on with a championship

 

[none]

Patrick,

Not doubting your math at all, but what you can't take into consideration is mindset. Once locked into the countdown, the crew chief can go into test mode. He's is more concerned about getting ready for the countdown than today's race. I know and I'm sure Jon and others here would tell you the same thing.

I know for a fact that many (maybe most) of the big name CC's contending for the championship spent part of the summer testing and never would have done that under the old format. When I spoke to one particular guy on the western swing and mentioned that his car wasn't running to well, he told me "Don't worry I've got my countdown stuff set aside and will break it out when it counts" He went on to say he was trying some stuff for the future and didn't want to waste test days so he was doing it at the races. The point being that a car that enters the countdown with a 10 point lead might have really had a 200 point lead if they had raced every week the same.

Look at the Indianapolis Colts when they locked up homefield and decided to rest the stars. They didn't play the last couple of games the same as the first few. So it's tough to say what would have happened under the old rules.

I like the countdown, you now have to make the playoffs, then win them.

Were the Cardinal's the best team in Baseball or the Philliy's? And who's the champ?

Alan

 

[Rat]

Patrick,

Not doubting your math at all, but what you can't take into consideration is mindset. Once locked into the countdown, the crew chief can go into test mode. He's is more concerned about getting ready for the countdown than today's race. I know and I'm sure Jon and others here would tell you the same thing.

I know for a fact that many (maybe most) of the big name CC's contending for the championship spent part of the summer testing and never would have done that under the old format. When I spoke to one particular guy on the western swing and mentioned that his car wasn't running to well, he told me "Don't worry I've got my countdown stuff set aside and will break it out when it counts" He went on to say he was trying some stuff for the future and didn't want to waste test days so he was doing it at the races. The point being that a car that enters the countdown with a 10 point lead might have really had a 200 point lead if they had raced every week the same.

Look at the Indianapolis Colts when they locked up homefield and decided to rest the stars. They didn't play the last couple of games the same as the first few. So it's tough to say what would have happened under the old rules.

I like the countdown, you now have to make the playoffs, then win them.

Were the Cardinal's the best team in Baseball or the Philliy's? And who's the champ?

Alan

Oh Alan I believe you completely and always thought that the psyche has changed in ways like never before. For instance take 2009, Cruz Pedregon feels no need to preseason test, the season was only about 6 races to him, he figured he can use 75% of the races to get the team into forum. It bit him. Would Cruz of never tested if there was not a countdown? Doubt it.

 

[Dave]

Patrick,

Not doubting your math at all, but what you can't take into consideration is mindset. Once locked into the countdown, the crew chief can go into test mode. He's is more concerned about getting ready for the countdown than today's race. I know and I'm sure Jon and others here would tell you the same thing.

I know for a fact that many (maybe most) of the big name CC's contending for the championship spent part of the summer testing and never would have done that under the old format. When I spoke to one particular guy on the western swing and mentioned that his car wasn't running to well, he told me "Don't worry I've got my countdown stuff set aside and will break it out when it counts" He went on to say he was trying some stuff for the future and didn't want to waste test days so he was doing it at the races. The point being that a car that enters the countdown with a 10 point lead might have really had a 200 point lead if they had raced every week the same.

Look at the Indianapolis Colts when they locked up homefield and decided to rest the stars. They didn't play the last couple of games the same as the first few. So it's tough to say what would have happened under the old rules.

I like the countdown, you now have to make the playoffs, then win them.

Were the Cardinal's the best team in Baseball or the Philliy's? And who's the champ?

Alan

This is certainly the one tangible that NOBODY can account for. However the only team I ever remember publicly admitting to testing was John Force in the early 90's... He even put it on his racecar - "Official Safety Safari Test Vehicle!"

 

[daveo]

And "Thank God" Kyle Busch isn't racing there!!!

 

[Huge]

You can do all of the math and researching that you want, I still say that what we have now with the Countdown is way more exciting to follow than what we had before without it.

Going into Pomona this week, typically all but maybe one class was sewn up. Some done as early as 2 months ago, not very exciting to watch that stuff.

I'm with you on this one Lance.

 

[mike]

I wonder if part of it is the media/journalist guys just have a different mindset than some of us "regular fans" do and find different things important than some of us do?

(I KNOW whoever is producing the ESPN broadcast certainly doesn't seem to know what a lot of fans as interested in...as witnessed by the complaints here and elsewhere...but that's a different thread)

 

[TooTall999]

Patrick,

Not doubting your math at all, but what you can't take into consideration is mindset. Once locked into the countdown, the crew chief can go into test mode. He's is more concerned about getting ready for the countdown than today's race. I know and I'm sure Jon and others here would tell you the same thing.

I know for a fact that many (maybe most) of the big name CC's contending for the championship spent part of the summer testing and never would have done that under the old format. When I spoke to one particular guy on the western swing and mentioned that his car wasn't running to well, he told me "Don't worry I've got my countdown stuff set aside and will break it out when it counts" He went on to say he was trying some stuff for the future and didn't want to waste test days so he was doing it at the races. The point being that a car that enters the countdown with a 10 point lead might have really had a 200 point lead if they had raced every week the same.

Look at the Indianapolis Colts when they locked up homefield and decided to rest the stars. They didn't play the last couple of games the same as the first few. So it's tough to say what would have happened under the old rules.

I like the countdown, you now have to make the playoffs, then win them.

Were the Cardinal's the best team in Baseball or the Philliy's? And who's the champ?

Alan

I see this as a major flaw in the countdown scenario. I attend Brainerd every year, and I don't like paying full price to watch the top countdown contenders, ie the ones that are or will be locked in at Indy, testing. I think every race should be run as if it actually matters, not be used as a glorified test session. The same way I'd feel that as a ticket holder to one game a year, I'd have to sit and watch second string players play because the team was already locked into the playoffs so the coach decided to rest the starters.

 

[n/a]

I agree with you David but between the Countdown and Testing limitations that is what the game has become. So you attend the first few races or the last few to see hard all out racing.

 

[mick]

if it means bob bode gets a win then i hope they're all testing on raceday

 

[Rat]

if it means bob bode gets a win then i hope they're all testing on raceday

1000% I wish Chris Karamesines (I think I got the right) could win.

 

[Rat]

Well I am very satisfied 3 of the 4 guys who should of won without the countdown did. They truly earned it.

Del Worsham. Jason Line, Eddie Kraweic. Now I am taking nothing away from Hagen, but Neff missed out, yet it was his to lose, he knew the ballgame was coming.

 

[n/a]

They still allow non playoff cars in the same bracket as playoff teams, which is a mess. Watching a driver win a title while only being able to beat one playoff car along the way is disgusting. My Lions will win the Super Bowl if they get to play the Dolphins, Rams and Colts in the playoffs this year. Of course that is crazy, but we have had that happen with the countdown.

After thinking about this a bit I came up with a different ladder that might make for some discussion. Make the Countdown to only include the top 8 cars (half the 16 car field). Qualify the Countdown cars separately from the non Countdown cars. The Countdown cars line up against each other for the first round. The top 8 other qualifiers line up against each other for the first round. 4 Countdown cars and 4 non Countdown cars are on each side of the round 1 ladder. Round two goes as it does now depending on the winners of round 1. This way you at least have the contenders in the Countdown racing each other in the first round. And 4 of the Countdown cars will be out after round one which will really squeue the points up. Plus you'll have non Countdown cars playing the spoiler more often and getting sponsor exposure.