Bullard Anderson
Nitro Member
At 1000ft, I guess the ladder would look different on that day.
Nitromater
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you can't tell the difference between 1000' and 1320' - watch this
- Thread starter Bobby
- Start date
At 1000ft, I guess the ladder would look different on that day.
Huge
Nitro Member
Some are deploying the chutes and then staying on the throttle just a fraction longer trying to keep from chunking the tires. Some times it works and some times it doesn't depending on the track temp. We chunked a new set of tires on every pass at the World Finals. But if they deploy the chutes late then you can expect a visit from an Nhra official.
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Everything has been done to increase speed, and aid stability at those speeds, while nothing has been done to control them until the NHRA arrived at the "break the glass" emergency knee jerk scenerio at Englishtown when the NHRA was re-introduced to Murphy's Law.
Years have passed with zero action. Top Fuel cars stretched to 300" to aid the transfer of torque, Funny Cars that don't look like cars at all, but simply an aerodynamic downforce shell wrapped to look like a car to increase downforce and power application while these speeds filled the grandstand. All of us are guilty, and we all were feeding the speed demon until the ride abruptly ended with the tragic death of Scott Kalitta..
Where do we go to get rid of this 1,000' farce?
There are so many effective ways to cut speed and engine power.
I would look at the clutch can technology, and go from there. Clutch weight application, electronics and pneumatic restrictions, maybe downright removal of anything automated to bring back the driver as a variable. Downforce can be reduced from many variables, weight limits adjusted, fuel pump volume adjusted, blower boost, CID size, etc. The pool to pick from is huge, and here comes the "but"...
But, I guarantee you that every crew chief and owner would put up a temper tantrum because they would actually have to deal with a brand new hand of cards, uncomfortable cards that brings everybody right back to zero. They will now have no baseline, and will have to start like everyone else. THEN, we'll see who is a great crew chief, and who isn't. Every crew chief will tell you that it won't work, and you'll hear can't, can't can't can't...more reason to let them show what they got instead of cuddling with their bankie and pacifier, better known as their computer filled with track and tune up data..
It'll be ugly racing at the start, just like restrictor plate racing was, but the NHRA will come out better at the other end.
They will be alive, and I see cars that look like cars, and a legitimate chance for racers who aren't part of the "club" to compete and win.
Years have passed with zero action. Top Fuel cars stretched to 300" to aid the transfer of torque, Funny Cars that don't look like cars at all, but simply an aerodynamic downforce shell wrapped to look like a car to increase downforce and power application while these speeds filled the grandstand. All of us are guilty, and we all were feeding the speed demon until the ride abruptly ended with the tragic death of Scott Kalitta..
Where do we go to get rid of this 1,000' farce?
There are so many effective ways to cut speed and engine power.
I would look at the clutch can technology, and go from there. Clutch weight application, electronics and pneumatic restrictions, maybe downright removal of anything automated to bring back the driver as a variable. Downforce can be reduced from many variables, weight limits adjusted, fuel pump volume adjusted, blower boost, CID size, etc. The pool to pick from is huge, and here comes the "but"...
But, I guarantee you that every crew chief and owner would put up a temper tantrum because they would actually have to deal with a brand new hand of cards, uncomfortable cards that brings everybody right back to zero. They will now have no baseline, and will have to start like everyone else. THEN, we'll see who is a great crew chief, and who isn't. Every crew chief will tell you that it won't work, and you'll hear can't, can't can't can't...more reason to let them show what they got instead of cuddling with their bankie and pacifier, better known as their computer filled with track and tune up data..
It'll be ugly racing at the start, just like restrictor plate racing was, but the NHRA will come out better at the other end.
They will be alive, and I see cars that look like cars, and a legitimate chance for racers who aren't part of the "club" to compete and win.
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You saying lifting off the Throttle is what chunks Tires??? So what is easier on the Tires, a 90 degree track or a 125 degree track?
.
Nitro Member
Joe, that's been a known issue for a while now. The Safety Safari preps the track all the way to 1320 for the Pro Stock guys, but it causes chunking for the fuel cars when they lift. If they only prep to 1000' to keep the fuel guys happy, then the Pro Stock guys get loose in the last 320 feet.
Huge
Nitro Member
Brian is spot on. Joe when the track is real hot then it gets greasy or loose and you dont have a chunking problem, but when it is cool and there is a lot of spray then it gets tight and then you have a chunking problem. Downforce plays a role in it also.
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my friends call me Zappy
Nitro Member
Registered member said:
I totally disagree.
Somehow, you think a crew chiefs are capable of walking on water.
A+B always equal A+B.
Newton's Law can be applied in so many terminally speed killing ways that you could do a number of things that the teams as well as the NHRA have never implimented because it wasn't "good for business" until now..
Also, if you think 1,000' racing was bad, just turn the fuel cars into another "super class" with a top speed breakout, and you may as well file for Chapter 7 right now. Ever watch the stands unload when a Super Class fires the first pair?
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Good points George. While the Crew Chiefs are very good at finding ways to go faster, there is no reason a new package can't be designed to create a slower, safer, less expensive fuel car that can make header flames for 1320 ft. (My god I feel I've posted these thoughts a 1000 times now) Does anyone think the guys tuning the Nostalgia FCs out there will figure out how to go 330 MPH in the next 5 or even 10 years given the rules that they race under?
How about this as a marketing blitz: NHRA re-invents the fuel classes to a level of 5.0/290-300 and creates a massive marketing campaign revolving around the return of 1/4 mile fuel racing. Remember, one goal is to bring back the fans we've lost, the bigger goal is to attract new ones. If a newbie ever saw a full pull with a 5.0/300ish perforformance, I doubt the fact that they once went 330+ would even be a factor. We need to stop losing the loyal fan base and start building a new one.
How about this as a marketing blitz: NHRA re-invents the fuel classes to a level of 5.0/290-300 and creates a massive marketing campaign revolving around the return of 1/4 mile fuel racing. Remember, one goal is to bring back the fans we've lost, the bigger goal is to attract new ones. If a newbie ever saw a full pull with a 5.0/300ish perforformance, I doubt the fact that they once went 330+ would even be a factor. We need to stop losing the loyal fan base and start building a new one.
mick
Nitro Member
the bigger goal is not losing the base that is money in the bank;
attracting new fans is additional profit.
I thought the chunking was from the First 330 when you see you tires Sidewall like they do....
Picking some mid points ... at 200 ft the "tread" part of the tire doesn't have near the traction to the track surface that it does at at 1200 ft. Downforce is the largest contributor, but the slight intended slip under acceleration factors in too. As I understand it, at 1200ft the "tread" of the tire is at times better stuck to the track than it is to the carcass of the tire ... and it sometimes stays with the track!
The sidewall is an elastic traction shock absorber between the engine torque and the tire/track friction ... sorta like a rubber band that function of the tire tends to wear out first (well at least outside of the nitro classes).
The sidewall is an elastic traction shock absorber between the engine torque and the tire/track friction ... sorta like a rubber band that function of the tire tends to wear out first (well at least outside of the nitro classes).
mick
Nitro Member
agreed they have to look to the future for their next customers, but IMO
the nitro classes are somewhat alienating their core consumer base; those
of us repeat customers who by word of mouth and referral will bring others
to this product who may potentially become customers themselves.
on the other hand - have we (older audience) fallen out of
priority? if the potential youth market is seen as
more profitable moving forward, then by trying to hold on to us (old core
customers) do they risk losing a new, potentially more profitable
youth audience?....the core consumer base could shift.
BF
Nitro Member
At 51, I guess I'm on the edge of being that older audience. By alienating me, my grown children no longer attend. They only go when I go. My children also have children of their own who will not be attending. If there are enough fans out there like myself, and judging by message boards there are quite a few, then there are a lot of potential "seat fillers" out there.
my friends call me Zappy
Nitro Member
Registered member said:
We disagree.
First, jet cars are exibition vehicles, and nothing more. Their presence has everything to do with the show, (show business). White smoke, black smoke, burner pops etc. The best part of the show is actually over before the light turns green. If they were a truly viable draw as an actual class, you would see them on the NHRA circuit.
IMO, the super class break out style of racing embodies everything possibly wrong with drag racing, and the "new" race fan will never come back. It's a great class for the everyday Joe to build a car and have a chance to compete, but it has nothing sellable about it.
Whether it be the drop on your face throttle stop launch, or the braking and game playing at the end, Super class racing is not racing in any way, shape or form. It's a class that takes racing right out of the equasion, and replaces it with driver and tuning skills in a preceived box. If you are selling Drag racing to the public, then the first thing you outta do is actually "race".
First, jet cars are exibition vehicles, and nothing more. Their presence has everything to do with the show, (show business). White smoke, black smoke, burner pops etc. The best part of the show is actually over before the light turns green. If they were a truly viable draw as an actual class, you would see them on the NHRA circuit.
IMO, the super class break out style of racing embodies everything possibly wrong with drag racing, and the "new" race fan will never come back. It's a great class for the everyday Joe to build a car and have a chance to compete, but it has nothing sellable about it.
Whether it be the drop on your face throttle stop launch, or the braking and game playing at the end, Super class racing is not racing in any way, shape or form. It's a class that takes racing right out of the equasion, and replaces it with driver and tuning skills in a preceived box. If you are selling Drag racing to the public, then the first thing you outta do is actually "race".
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Nick Name
Nitro Member
Agreed. At some point, with revenues dwindling, NHRA is going to have to stop subjecting paying customers to this at National events.
danno
Nitro Member
If the NHRA can find a way to slow the cars down a bit I don't think most people would really care. Why can't this be done? It's been said a hundred times, Clutch, Fuel,Mags, Aerodynamics,Weight. I would go watch a race in a hearbeat if the cars were running 1320ft at mid to high 4s and 280to300mph on 90% plus nitro. Why can't The NHRA get some of the crew chiefs together to come up with a way to do this. If they know it's gonna happen with or without there input I'm willing to bet some pretty good and economical ideas would hit the table. 
If the NHRA can find a way to slow the cars down a bit I don't think most people would really care. Why can't this be done? It's been said a hundred times, Clutch, Fuel,Mags, Aerodynamics,Weight. I would go watch a race in a hearbeat if the cars were running 1320ft at mid to high 4s and 280to300mph on 90% plus nitro. Why can't The NHRA get some of the crew chiefs together to come up with a way to do this. If they know it's gonna happen with or without there input I'm willing to bet some pretty good and economical ideas would hit the table.
Because the NHRA is listening to the owners and crew chiefs, instead of the paying customers. Rule number one in business, listen to what your customers want, or you will slowly lose them.
Soon enough, they will have no company on race day.
At some point, they'll realize that the fans run the show because the fans buy the product, not the owners.
