Trailer towing again (2 Viewers)

[Dragracer]

It looks like the trailer towing laws in California for the Pro racers has been resolved. As Randy said on another blog, all you have to do to follow the law. I just wanted to make a couple of comments from what I saw at Pomona.

I was walking through the sportsman pits at Pomona yesterday and here are a couple of things I found. One is not only illegal but down right dangerous, the other is just unlawfull.

First was a motorhome towing a trailer. It was a 40 ft motorhome, no tag axel in the back and it was hitch towing a trailer that was approximately 35 ft long and by looking at the weight tag on the trailer the unladen weight was 9,000 lbs and the overall length was right at 80 ft. Not only is this way over the legal length but neither that motorhome or any other is rated to tow that kind of weight and that was the unloaded weight.....a major accident waiting to happen. This was not the only motorhome towing trailers like this. Just a little dangerous and dumb.

Saw another one that was towed by a toterhome, boy would I like one for towing. This was a 38 ft toterhome. It was towing a 40ft 5th wheel. Now that certainly has the towing capacity and power but it is just a little too long, regardless what state you are towing through. It measured at a tad over 80 ft.

Racers had better start looking at how they are towing. The cops don't take nicely to things like this. If stopped the cops would not only get you a nice ticket but your would be reguired to immediately have the trailer unhitched and towed out of state by something that makes it under the total length laws.

I'am just a little sportsman racer but wanted to bring up that it isn't only the big pro trailers that can have major problem towing down the road and some of the ways people are hitch towing is down right dangerous.

 

[Nitrohelper]

......towed out of state by something that makes it under the total length laws.....

Not if the driver of the motorhome has a CDL ...

 

[Dragracer]

In California and most other states the maximum combined length for 2 vehicle combinations is 65'.

California DMV puts out a real great brochure that says a motorhome over 40 foot but no larger than 45 ft requires a non-commercial Class B. If you are towing a trailer over 10,000 lbs GVWR and any 5th wheels over 15,000 lbs requires a non-commercial Class A.

Motorhomes and toterhomes do not require a CDL per the above. The overall maximum combined length has nothing to do with what type license you may have. A CDL does not give you any special rules.
Check the California DMV website.

 

[rocketman]

I'm currently going through this right now in Oregon. I have a 44 foot trailer and a dually. I am now required to get a class A CDL and truck plates. Meanwhile, these guys in their traveling Freightliner mansions on wheels are exempt from the trucking rules but not me.

 

[Jeff]

Terry, You are correct that there is generally (yes, everyone feel free to "insert your exception here") a 65 foot combined maximum length for non commercial loads. I agree with Jerry's point to you above.

For commercial loads the maximum length rules are much different (and I don't know them by heart), but when transporting other vehicles with a kingpin attached trailer it is basically unlimited (maybe it says 112 ft or something, but its extremely long, but there is a measurement from the kingpin to the axle of 24' that must be met). So now you see the RVized Freightliner chassis going down the road with mini 5th wheels hung low off the back and kingpin equipped trailers.

The notable exception that we always hear about are California (and Indiana, maybe) that had a rule saying trailers must be limited to 53 ft long ... not the recently popular 56 ft (Torrence example). Florida was the state that seemed to push on the 2 5/16th ball verses Kingpin design on length, but then they passed a law that provides for a very cheap annual permit for motorsports folks ... and now their $1000 a foot overlength law is not nearly as scary. I converted my last trailer to a kingpin and really like how it towed. Staying with that design for my current trailer.

If you roll down the road with no visible indications you are breaking the law (Rich's trailer signage without commercial plates is his main issue) and, if non-commercial, blow by every commercial inspection station .... it's pretty rare to have an issue. When you do get pulled over, if you are not driving with a license that is necessary for your rig (Class A or CDL), then you are going to have a long day.

 

[Nitrohelper]

..... A CDL does not give you any special rules.....

We're 83' long with a motor home and trailer and have been stopped in several states to be measured,
but when they found that the driver had a CDL -- then we were on our way...

 

[John D.]

The rules governing towing with a motorhome/toterhome/trailer/etc. are as clear as mud. The best thing you can do is to attempt to be as legal as can be. This includes having a CDL, log book, fire extinguisher, chains, etc. If you get pulled over, your best defense is to be as pleasant as possible (something I have a hard time with). In most cases I'm sure we all have something wrong with our trucks/trailers to cause a citation. Is there a cure? Probably not. At least until someone comes up with a solution that would involve instruction and/or licensing for racers and our rigs.

 

[rocketman]

It comes down to selling your trailer and going with an RV or jumping through the hoops as a commercial vehicle. You can't be both an RV and use it for business. The cop told me even without the stickers on the trailer it's still a commercial vehicle because prize money is involved. I told a friend yesterday you can do what ever you want but you can throw it all out the window when you get stopped.

 

[Jeff]

Rich,

You seem to be harping on this in a couple of threads. Several people have tried to be helpful with the rules, and you seem to have a handle on the ones you should be following, but still the griping. Now I'll share my opinion of your opinion.

The rule book that applies to my class of drag racing gives me a lot of parameters to stay within, numerous exceptions, and more than a couple gotchas. BUT it tells me nothing about making a clean 6.50 pass, avoiding tire shake, or tuning a nitrous engine. Somehow I greatly enjoy the challenge and navigate my way through all of this AS A HOBBY.

For my profession, there is infinitely more stress, confusion, uncertainty, and monetary exposure.

I think you are blowing this out of proportion, sure the system is a little complex but it sounds like you know exactly what you need to do to steer clear. Sure the application of the rules is as random as the knowledge of those who enforce them on the street and those who are supposed to follow them. You just don't like it because, mysteriously, everyone else is not feeling your pain. And you consider this a business? Business is tough, suck it up and fight your way through. That said, my guess is that the monetary reward (actual or potential) isn't adequate to really consider this a business. You need to find a hobby to get rid of all of this stress. Mine works wonders for me.

Good luck with this. Go get a CDL and be happy every time you cruise into a CVI station. Unfortunately, you live in a tough part of the country for laws and law enforcement. Maybe the Texas weather helps me out, somebody is gonna have to be doing some bad stuff for that officer to get out of that dry cool cruiser. I spend a lot of time driving outside of Texas, but my longest trip is Vegas ... and when I'm halfway there, I'm still in Texas!

Jeff

 

[rocketman]

I am getting this resolved doing what I have to do to get compliant and at least this way if I get stopped in the future for whatever infraction (and please note that was the first time of getting stopped in 15 years of racing) I won't have to worry about not being able to continue on the trip because I didn't have a CDL so I'm glad to be getting it.

The rules are made so that the RV industry can continue on since people with recreational vehicles don't want to be burdened with CDL, weigh station stops, ETC. and I understand that. Just note that according to the federal regulations if you want to get down to the letter of the law, if any commerce is being conducted including accepting prize money you are considered commercial by the Feds unless it's an RV and NO business is taking place.

Most of my posts on this subject have not meant to be rants but education so others in my position can be aware of the rules and then they can decide how to approach it or simply ignore it. When I first heard guys with pickups were getting pulled over in other states for not having a CDL, I contacted my local DOT office and was told as long as I was under 26K I was fine and not to worry. What I didn't realize was that meant the MFG's rating and not the physical weight, so I had no idea I was not in compliance.

 

[Ma Green]

Rich, I'm surprised you're having so much trouble with your rig. I'm on the crew of a dirt modified, which uses a 38' trailer and Chevy crew-cab. There are decals, on the back door, for the owners company and his car number. We've towed all over, Oregon, Washington and Arizona, and never been stopped by anyone. His racing is not a business, just a hobby, but he does get prize money (sometimes). I've not heard of any of the other circle track rigs having trouble either.

 

[rocketman]

Ma, everyone that I've told this to even non-racing people like Dave Wilson can't believe it. I've gone all over the place too up and down the west coast, drove through speed traps, and never have been stopped in 15 years. Since this happened I have done a lot of research, talked to people high in the chain at ODOT and that's the law. Unfortunately, there is no way to get around it unless I was to get a trailer that weighs under 8,000 lbs loaded or get an RV set up and not have any sponsorship. So I have to get a truck plate and a CDL.

 

[glofria]

The officer must have been fresh out of the academy. You know the one who always sits front and center.

We Californians have been warned about Oregon highway patrol officers. There's no going 55ish down the highway.

 

[Ma Green]

Then I guess we should be grateful not to have been stopped and keep our fingers crossed. However, perhaps our trailer is not long enough to be a problem.......with the officers though, who knows!

 

[rocketman]

Well, I count myself as lucky since I was stopped near my house. If this happened 100 miles from home, I would have been towed if the same officer or one like him had stopped me. And that's the advantage of having the CDL so if you are stopped you can at least carry on. Without the CDL the cop will tow your trailer away if you can't find someone with a CDL to drive it for you. And if you are on the road, I'd say that would ruin your trip. Gino, I have not had trouble with the state patrol it was surprisingly a city cop.

 

[Baron]

Ma, everyone that I've told this to even non-racing people like Dave Wilson can't believe it. I've gone all over the place too up and down the west coast, drove through speed traps, and never have been stopped in 15 years. Since this happened I have done a lot of research, talked to people high in the chain at ODOT and that's the law. Unfortunately, there is no way to get around it unless I was to get a trailer that weighs under 8,000 lbs loaded or get an RV set up and not have any sponsorship. So I have to get a truck plate and a CDL.

It appears to me, Rich, that your complaint is based on the capriciousness of the enforcement. With that, I can agree.
Cheers,
Ed

 

[Fast16Racer]

It appears to me, Rich, that your complaint is based on the capriciousness of the enforcement. With that, I can agree.
Cheers,
Ed

OK, no two-dollar words, Ed! We're just a bunch of racers with barely double-digit IQ's!

 

[rocketman]

I went to DMV to see about taking the test. And the guy at the counter said that since my truck and trailer weighs under 26,000 lbs I can't get the class A CDL, yet a class a CDL is required to drive it legally so I'm now waiting for clerification on who's right. I'm not ranting here but just letting everyone know if they even care. This has always been an interesting topic to me and now I'm stuck right in the middle of it.

 

[DrRocket]

You'd be surprised just how much people DON'T know about these things, even though they're charged with enforcing them.

I've discovered, for instance, when it comes to amateur radio, that most law enforcement folks don't know that it's legal for me to have my scanner in the car. Just because they're charged with enforcing the law, doesn't mean they know every nuance of those laws. That's why I carry a copy of the law that exempts me from the scanner ban in the glove box with me. (And one deputy STILL called it in to check.)

Frustrating? you bet!!

 

[.]

I went to DMV to see about taking the test. And the guy at the counter said that since my truck and trailer weighs under 26,000 lbs I can't get the class A CDL, yet a class a CDL is required to drive it legally so I'm now waiting for clerification on who's right. I'm not ranting here but just letting everyone know if they even care. This has always been an interesting topic to me and now I'm stuck right in the middle of it.

21 years ago I rolled into our local drivers license testing facility with a GMC Brigadier wrecker, towing an International dump truck. I wanted to take my "A" test and they said "Nope, that's not a semi truck" Once I explained the gross weights of the combined unit would require an "A" to legally drive that combination, they finally agreed to give me the test.

In your situation..... you need to talk to another person because the guy who told you that you couldn't take the test is wrong. Just make sure your combined unit is over 26001 pounds, with the trailer being at least 10K. These are GROSS WEIGHT RATINGS..... not what the vehicle actually weighs on a scale.

...I've discovered, for instance, when it comes to amateur radio, that most law enforcement folks don't know that it's legal for me to have my scanner in the car...

Frustrating? you bet!!

I just carry a copy of my license, and a copy of the law in my truck at all times. I've never been questioned though....