GA Vs Glidden (1 Viewer)

[Terry]

I realize it probably reads like I'm a big GA fan. I'm "ok" with Greg, but I wouldn't call myself a fan. That said, I certainly recognize what he has accomplished. He's had the entire class covered for the last five years...a period in Pro Stock where the parity is higher than ever. When you consider the rule revisions and efforts by the rest of the field to match his performance, I find it impressive how the Summit cars have maintained a performance advantage over all comers. Amazing...

Gotta agree, John. Although you know my GM leanings, I am not a huge GA fan, but I also am in awe of what the KB team has accomplished and maintained. Yes, they have lots of money, but there's gotta be more to it than that, and I salute them for their efforts. Also, props to you for being so open minded and forthright about the "dark days" of the mopar pro stock history, and for the positive things about the GA effort. We all have our favorite brands and drivers, but we need to be able to acknowledge great efforts regardless of the marques. Although not a dyed in the wool mopar fan, I think many accolades go to the Allen/Roy Johnson effort, since they have always done it "their way" even when shunned by corporate Chrysler. Great driver and a great team. I think Pro Stock is more interesting now than in many years. Oh, yeah, go Connolly!

 

[BlueStangGT]

No matter how you slice it, ol' Bob set the bar pretty damn high.

 

[scotty]

In the mid to late 80's I remember always expecting Bob to qualify #1 and run the table. He didn't always do it, but I definitely wasn't surprised when he did (which always killed me being a Reher-Morrison fan). I can't think of anyone else to come along like that except GA and the KB team last couple years. (Maybe Wayne County but that's all I'll say.) Even when WJ was on top, I don't ever remember "expecting" him to always win like I did Bob then or GA now. I did always expect WJ to get top mph which does say something.

But WJ has found longevity that no other pro stock racer has. He came out of the box competitive and has remained competitive (and btw, middle of the pack IS competitive in my book) for longer than anyone else out there in pro stock today. I can't name another p/s racer that has remained actually driving for as long as WJ. No matter how the landscape of p/s has changed, WJ is always there. We can speculate about the others all we want, but WJ has actually done it and has found a way to continue. That goes a long, long way.

Bob was the most dominant, GA is pretty close now, and WJ has the most wins.

PJ & Terry, Ronnie Sox and Butch Leal would get my votes as well for best pure drivers in p/s.

 

[Rocketman 207]

WJ has found longevity that no other pro stock racer has. He came out of the box competitive and has remained competitive (and btw, middle of the pack IS competitive in my book) for longer than anyone else out there in pro stock today. I can't name another p/s racer that has remained actually driving for as long as WJ. No matter how the landscape of p/s has changed, WJ is always there. We can speculate about the others all we want, but WJ has actually done it and has found a way to continue. That goes a long, long way.

Couldn't have said it better, Scott....

 

[Terry]

In the mid to late 80's I remember always expecting Bob to qualify #1 and run the table. He didn't always do it, but I definitely wasn't surprised when he did (which always killed me being a Reher-Morrison fan). I can't think of anyone else to come along like that except GA and the KB team last couple years. (Maybe Wayne County but that's all I'll say.) Even when WJ was on top, I don't ever remember "expecting" him to always win like I did Bob then or GA now. I did always expect WJ to get top mph which does say something.

But WJ has found longevity that no other pro stock racer has. He came out of the box competitive and has remained competitive (and btw, middle of the pack IS competitive in my book) for longer than anyone else out there in pro stock today. I can't name another p/s racer that has remained actually driving for as long as WJ. No matter how the landscape of p/s has changed, WJ is always there. We can speculate about the others all we want, but WJ has actually done it and has found a way to continue. That goes a long, long way.

Bob was the most dominant, GA is pretty close now, and WJ has the most wins.

PJ & Terry, Ronnie Sox and Butch Leal would get my votes as well for best pure drivers in p/s.

Great post Scott. Very well put, and thanks for the nod to the ol California Flash!

 

[-]

Pure driver......not too sure about that one. Jeg is great, and I am taking nothing away from him.


Since we are comparing different generations, I would say [and maybe I am partial ] that the early pro stock guys may have had better "drivers" .


No shift lights, electric shocks, air shifters, Lenco, etc....Some guys used to actually leave the starting line by releasing a clutch pedal , and not pushing/releasing a button on the steering wheel.

Hi
Dave,
It is very difficult to compare generations, was it harder to drive the old stlye cars? maybe, considering the clutch and chassis tech of the day.
But they also did not have the power levels and speeds of today.

You got some facts a bit wrong though, there are no air shifters in ProStock now, they all leave by releasing a clutch, the only button on the wheel that they release is a linelok and they definetly had them in the early days.

I remember Bob Glidden himself saying he was struggling a bit to come to terms with the cars when he had the stint driving for Steve Schmidt, which was only a few years after he retired, after Ford pulled the pin on him. There is little doubt had he continued to drive he would have been fine, but it does show how quickly things can change.
Thanks JP

 

[Joker]

Most Wins: WJ BG not to far behind
Lasted longer: WJ so far, we will see with GA
Most Championships: BG 10, WJ 6 and GA 3 (I think thats right)
Most Dominant in there time: BG
Longest Consective Races Won: BG
Who had better competition overall: GA
Most wins in a season: GA (more races a season though)

To me, there all close but 10 championships and being just behind in wins when back in his heyday they didnt have a whole lot of races like today and the fact that he did all his own work with just his family basically means I think BG is the man when it comes to Pro Stock. I dont remember what year, or the exact number but didnt he win like every race one year or like all but one or something. I dont remember. I'm not that old but I know I have read it somewhere.

Now everyone here knows I cant stand WJ, however I can respect him. 6 championships, more wins than anyone else, his competition was about an 8 I would say and he was dominate at times. Personally I have always thought if he was a better driver then he would have won alot more. I know he can get a car from A to B but I'm talking whole package, RT and everything. He's been around a while and had nice corporate backing that Glidden never really had though he did do his own stuff mostly but not as much as Glidden as for employees and such. And for that I dont think you can be the greatest ever.

GA is dominate. His competition is alot stronger than BG's or WJ's. He has a whole team behind him. He's won 3 championships and won the most races in a year, but they race more races now. Most of the pro stock rule changes have had to do with him and yet he's still at the top of his game even though the competition has gotten closer due to rules. I say give him a few more years, a few more championships and then GA can be called the greatest of all time. But as we know, every era comes to an end. We will see when.

Also, as far as being the "greatest" pure driver. Hokie Holcombe once told me that Lee Shepherd was by far the greatest driver he's ever seen and ole Hokie's seen alot of them. Lee drove for Hokie in comp before he was recommended for the job at Reher-Morrison.

 

[chop]

The difference between the old days and now is,R&D. WJ/Glidden/Reher&Morrison/Morgan,Iaconnio etc. had to do their own R&D,no where to buy it like today. Back then,heads were done with a die grinder,today a CNC machine can whip them out when they're home sleeping. That's what gets under WJ's skin I think,he did it the hard way,by himself and today the technology can be bought if you have the $$$$$. He's worked his @$$ off to get where he's @ and being 64 years old,he's still competitive. If we could prove how much each P/S team spends,I bet it would follow the points standings very closely. Sure WJ/KJ has GM sponsorship,AJ has Mopar sponsorship,but it's a set amount per year. With the KB team and the Cagnazzi team,they have a check book,nothing wrong with that because we live under the Golden Rule. Those who have the Gold,make the rules,nice analogy I think. I understand you can't just throw $$$$ @ P/S and be competitive,you still have to make it count. That's what the KB/Cagnazzi teams have done,they have tapped into NASCAR technology and have the funds to apply it.Again,nothing wrong there but you can see where it gets to the old timers and some to the point of quitting. I'm sure if GA keeps KB happy and they keep racing,he may catch WJ someday,but his road there was a hell of a lot easier than WJ's.

 

[millertime]

Mike...I couldn't agree more with that post. I believe that Greg Anderson has the technology to show up to any pro stock event and dominate. However, he personally had very little to do with the tools that he uses. He was NOT involved in any of the designs regarding the DRCE engine or the bodies used in competition, but he stands on the shoulders of the geniuses that work for him and supply him that power and advantage. It's the wave of the future in pro stock...but for me, it's no different than someone else writing your term paper for you. Sure, you get the "A", but really....did you deserve it? All you did was package the information in a cool looking binder and turn it in to your instructor.

You have to be able to drive well to compete in a series where hundredths of a second are margin of victory, and he does that well. He is a tireless racer, who works hard at the portions of the car that he's responsible for...I will not doubt that. He is a very accomplished P/S driver, and there is no doubting that. He is always congratulating the "guys at the shop" when he wins...so I know even he understands where his advantage comes from. However, if you crown him the new professor...then you have to share that crown with everyone else who adds into his engine gene pool (not just Jason Line, but all the other paid engineers at the shop). It is my opinion that if any person here on this board today had to start a P/S team with budget for only one person as a crew chief...they'd admittedly pick a Bob Glidden, or Grumpy Jenkins, Allen Johnson, or heaven forbid...a Warren Johnson above the selection of Greg Anderson, knowing that his OVERALL knowledge of the car, and how to make the power, is substandard.

He is a great driver. However, he is not the most knowledgeable p/s "racer".

 

[Rocketman 207]

Well said, Mike & Dave, WELL SAID!!!

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

OK,
If you only had one brain to download from a Pro Stocker to compete in the class with who would you choose?

There's lots of ways to quantify who's the greatest champion/winner/legend but if I'm to choose the complete package of designer, innovator, engineer, builder, tuner, driver, owner, champion, etc. I'll take the Professor for the win!

 

[Eracer]

Don't forget GA was "schooled" by WJ.
BG schooled himself!

 

[Johnny Mopar]

OK,
If you only had one brain to download from a Pro Stocker to compete in the class with who would you choose?

There's lots of ways to quantify who's the greatest champion/winner/legend but if I'm to choose the complete package of designer, innovator, engineer, builder, tuner, driver, owner, champion, etc. I'll take the Professor for the win!

I thought ("The Professor") Kelly Chadwick drove a Funny Car?

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

I thought ("The Professor") Kelly Chadwick drove a Funny Car?

And the Professor, Dave Ring drives a comp car too.

Ask either one of them how their project designing engine combinations for General Motors is going and they will point you to that yellow truck/trailer over in the Pro Stock pits for your answer.

 

[chop]

However, he is not the most knowledgeable p/s "racer".

Yeah I know,that Autostart is a killer.

 

[Cymon Sez]

OK,
If you only had one brain to download from a Pro Stocker to compete in the class with who would you choose?

Bob without a doubt.

 

[Johnny Mopar]

And the Professor, Dave Ring drives a comp car too.

Ask either one of them how their project designing engine combinations for General Motors is going and they will point you to that yellow truck/trailer over in the Pro Stock pits for your answer.

Could be Bobby, but ask any one of the thousands of Pro Stock fans at a national event who has the combination figured out and they'll point you over to the white Summit trucks and their four straight championships.

I know you're a big WJ fan and I repsect that. I'm just so impressed with how Greg and Jason put their DRCE3 engine together over one off season and continued dominating the class.

 

[BlueStangGT]

And the Professor, Dave Ring drives a comp car too....

I thought he was "just" the owner / ringmaster.

 

[BlueStangGT]

...I'm just so impressed with how Greg and Jason put their DRCE3 engine together over one off season and continued dominating the class.

I think that may be just a touch over-simplified. I think it's safe to assume that the engine shop guys had started the DRCE3 project long before the season ended. At any rate I think your point is still valid, they've accomplished a heck of a lot and deserve all the kudos they're getting, it's obviously a great team.

 

["Dr. Dirt"]

. . . I'm just so impressed with how Greg and Jason put their DRCE3 engine together over one off season and continued dominating the class.

Since they aren't running the DRCE3 bottom end, you probably shouldn't be too impressed. It's true that they are up at the top of the field with Cagnazi & Company at this time but, for the record, they are running DRCE2 bottom ends. I only know of three Pro Stocker racers who have run the DRCE3 bottom end throughout this season and GA/JL isn't in that group.