Buying a S/C Car? (1 Viewer)

[mltdwn12]

Been lurking here for quite a while, but just got off the dollar to post I just finished Frank Hawley's School and earned my S/C license. So I'm kicking around the idea of buying a car for next year. I see a LOT of used cars out there, and have looked on line at new cars, but I still have a bunch of questions maybe someone can help with.
*If you looked at a used car what's the most important thing to ask short of why are you selling it and has it been bent?
*Do you need a suspended car to run some local brackets and maybe some Div. 7 stuff? The school car was a hard mount and ran fine. Of course I wouldn't know the difference
*Is a 24" drivers hoop the standard big boy car? I'm 6'1" about 24" at the shoulders. The cars at the school were tight, but not uncomfortable.

Thanks for any input,
Craig

 

[clwill]

Been lurking here for quite a while, but just got off the dollar to post I just finished Frank Hawley's School and earned my S/C license. So I'm kicking around the idea of buying a car for next year. I see a LOT of used cars out there, and have looked on line at new cars, but I still have a bunch of questions maybe someone can help with.
*If you looked at a used car what's the most important thing to ask short of why are you selling it and has it been bent?
*Do you need a suspended car to run some local brackets and maybe some Div. 7 stuff? The school car was a hard mount and ran fine. Of course I wouldn't know the difference
*Is a 24" drivers hoop the standard big boy car? I'm 6'1" about 24" at the shoulders. The cars at the school were tight, but not uncomfortable.

Thanks for any input,
Craig

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.

One of the nice things about S/C is that you really don't need the latest/greatest stuff to be competitive. We run a hard-tail car and are doing just fine. There are lots of guys in our association (the Pacific Northwest SuperComp Association) who are very competitive with smaller engines and hard tail cars. And there are people running gorgeous cars with all the latest stuff and the most exotic of engines. From my experience, equipment doesn't buy wins, just like a great camera doesn't get you a Pulizter Prize... It's more about talent, skills, and practice, practice, practice.

Sure, there are a couple of places where we regret not having a suspended car (like the left lane at Woodburn, Oregon...). But S/C is much more about reaction time and predicting your ET than it is about losing traction or being able to get the last couple hundreds out of the car. And you can save a boatload by buying a car that someone is selling to step up to the latest fancy stuff.

There isn't really a "standard" size, but if there was, 24" is probably the current standard. I'm a big dude and was very tight in Frank's cars. I asked and he said they are 22"s, which was "huge" when he built them. He said he'd do 24" today. I know people in our association with 26" and I think one guy has a 27" car. I would buy at 26" for me. We bought an 18" -- but it's my 130lb daughter driving this car.

As Frank tells you repeatedly, comfortable is key. The last thing you want to be doing on the line is feeling anything but really relaxed and ready to rock and roll. It's impossible for anyone to say "oh, you need a 24", you're the only one who can tell.

So that leads me to what to ask the seller. First thing I would do is go see it, sit in it, play with the controls, make sure it feels just right. With a firesuit, helmet, and neck ring/hans on. Can you see the dash? Reach all the controls? I would no more buy a car sight unseen than I'd marry on a blind date.

Then, make sure you get a complete list of absolutely everything that's going to be included. Does it include the electronics? The shifter? The CO2 system? The throttle stop? Etc, etc. Leave nothing to chance.

The rest depends on whether it's a roller or a turnkey. If it's a roller, just make sure you know precisely what you're getting and what condition it's all in. If it's a T/K it's WAY more complicated. Any warranty on the engine/tranny (not likely)? Does it really run well? See/hear it run. Would be great to see it run on the track. Can you get them to at least warranty it for say 3-5 passes? That way, if it's really a POS, you can get them to help pay to get it running, or refund some to help fix it.

Then you need to consider trailer, tools, tow vehicle, etc. There's a lot to consider... If you want to engage in a more detailed conversation, PM me, I'm happy to help -- I made the same leap a little more than a year ago. Most fun I've ever had (with my clothes on...), but a complicated venture to get going.

Enjoy, and have fun! Hope this helps,
Chris

 

[Joker]

Craig, it really depends on 2 things: 1. What are you planning on doing with it exactly? (local brackets, divisionals, maybe running top dragster everntually, etc?) 2. How much are you willing to spend

I agree with Chris that you dont have to have all the latest and greatest to be competitive and that you dont have to spend a fortune to do it. My advice though would be to NOT buy a hardtail. We have 2 dragsters, one hardtail and one 4 link and my dad will tell you they are night and day. Beforehand he didnt think there was that much of a difference but he said he will never own another hardtail car. However, hardtails are still competitive and if you dont want to spend much you can pick up a good used hardtail cheap. If you just want to do local stuff, then I would say a hardtail is fine. But if your going to run divisionals/nationals and maybe eventually step up to top dragster without buying a new car, I'd suggest a 4 link or some kinda suspension car. Thats just my thoughts.

Chris summed up the cage deal pretty well and everything else. Just make sure your comfy in it and can reach everything.

 

[tomcat]

Good questions Craig, my son and I are looking to put together a car for next year and I'm trying to get back in the loop of what's out there. We have looked at a few 4 link cars, but I really haven't seen or had anyone explain a slip joint car to me. Can anybody explain how these work and what's the difference between a slip joint car, a triple slip joint and a swingarm car? The guys we have talked to have told us that there isn't any maintenance to worry about on the suspension on a 4 link car, is that the case with the others too? Man, these things have come a long way from the hard tail car I last drove.

 

[clwill]

Can anybody explain how these work and what's the difference between a slip joint car, a triple slip joint and a swingarm car? The guys we have talked to have told us that there isn't any maintenance to worry about on the suspension on a 4 link car, is that the case with the others too?

A slip joint car is just what it sounds like: there's a solid bottom rail and a section of overlapping pipe (one larger, one smaller) that slips in the top rail. It provides flex in the chassis to absorb bumps. A swingarm car has a joint (usually right behind the driver) that flexes the back half of the car, usually supported by one or two shock/spring setups. A four link car has a full four link suspension behind the tranny, just like a door car might.

From all I can discern, slip joint is the oldest of these technologies, and is fading in popularity because it is not adjustable in any real way. A swingarm has the benefit of being able to adjust the spring rate and preload on the shock/spring setup. In both of these cases, the tranny connects with little more than a solid few inches of connector (usually with just a slip fitting) to the rear end. The engine/tranny/etc. are all behind the flex mechanism.

A four link is obviously the most complex, because you actually have to have two u-joints, a drive shaft, etc. -- providing complexity, efficiency losses, and failure points. But it is completely adjustable, and has far less unsprung weight (just the rear end, not the whole engine/tranny) and that is a huge win for a lot of folks.

WRT maintenance, well, if you want to push 800-1200 horse through a pair of u-joints and not maintain them, that's your choice... Maybe they mean you make setting adjustments to the 4-link suspension and never adjust them. That's in fact what I hear, no one ever adjusts them. So... why have all that adjustment? Hmmm...

If I was buying a new car today, I'd be talking to Tom Yancer and getting one of his "shocksters" because: a) you get the flex without the complexity of a set of u-joints, b) you don't really need all the adjustment of a full four link, and c) his cars are just plain pretty. But of course, that's my opinion and your mileage may vary.

Hope this helps,
Chris