What more can one say? Timely article

[nitrobobby]

I been going to lvms for ten years. car rental is $25 day. Buy a reserved seat by the starting line . you can exit the comp gate in 5 min .they will scan your ticket-we tailgate across the comp gate . after you have your adult beverages. you are back in your seat in 10 mins.

 

[partsman]

IMO when you consider the publication and the editor he writes for I didn't expect anything different. It's constant bi***ing and moaning.......

 

[George.]

Thanks Chris for your initial post.....took the words out of my mouth. That article is nothing but whining...... Joe Nicholson sounds like someone that should be watching the races from his lazyboy with his grandkids waiting on him.....

You guys crack me up with your total ignorance of the messege...

What you are not getting is this..
It doesn't matter if Joe is right or wrong, or if he should have expected a better experience or not, or the price paid was to high or average.....
It's about the initial reaction from someone who might represent 99% of the average first time drag race fan who may never come back again.
Get it?
No matter how crazy and off base it may seem, perception is reality, and the reality is that the NHRA grandstands are not what they used to be in any stretch of the imagination. This is one of the main reasons "why" my friends...

All of us who have been to several races know what to expect, but if you look into the stands, there are empty seats that represent people who may have had the same reaction as Joe. Personally, I haven't been to a race in 7 years, and I don't ever plan on going again because the product sucks. TV is good enough for me because I remember when it used to be great, and now it's less than good..

If you think the NHRA will survive the years ahead, you better figure out how to accommodate the casual fan, and make the experience something of value, and not a waste of time and money, or worse, un-affordable for the middle class working family.
Without making the experience a little more "middle class" friendly, nobody will be bringing the "next" generation of race fans, their kids..
You might just find the NHRA a thing of the past as it dies a slow death before our very eyes, as it is currently.

 

[Nitrohelper]

.... sounds like this guy had never been to the track ....

I believe it was because at the race track he owned it was much more fan & racer friendly...
We race there in July and the fans pack the place for a Nitro show in the cornfields -
but of course there's little downtime and reasonable prices...

 

[Nitrohelper]

....because don't they just pull their pickups up to the track and sit in the beds in Iowa? And concessions consist of boiled hot dogs and warm Pepsi....

It's a good thing you're in South Carolina with all those high end drag strips,
Based on the crowds and our souvenir sales ,the fans in Iowa come out for reasonable prices and a good four hour show...
Jok knows that 5000 people paying $20 for a Saturday night Nitro show is what works for "grass roots" drag racing...

 

[Sandman]

Say what you want, but I think the article was pretty accurate. The hard-core fan will be there come hell or high water. But how many of those are left? Seriously, go to an NHRA national and tell me how many people are there until it's over. I know at Sears Point, on race day, it's not too hard to get out once the racing is through and it's not because their traffic control is so wonderful, either. Ever take a casual fan to a national? Did they ask to go the next year? Not likely. The best race I've ever been to in my entire life was the "Pinks All Out" race at Sear Point a few years ago. It was packed, EVERYONE stayed until it was over (10:00 pm) and they didn't gouge you on food and drinks. I've been to more than my share of a variety of races at Sear Point to know that the NHRA race is typically a one-time thing for causal (read "future") fans, yet the management/promoters don't see it that way.

 

[HEMI6point1]

Sammy, you have a big mouth. I see why people are always dissin your ass.

Huh? Other people are saying basically the same thing as me yet you single me out? STFU. I refuse to be PC, deal with it.

 

[Toejam]

The bottom line is that NHRA national event drag racing is a very bad spectator experience. Has been for years. I used to live 30 minutes from Pomona and got free tickets as a sponsor, and still quit going.

I sometimes fly to Georgia on the same weekend as the finals, to an all motorcycle drag race that is still fun. Pay your way in, sit anywhere you want. Go anywhere you want. . I can afford $7.00 cheeseburgers, but some people struggle with that.

AT National events, I knew enough people to go into hospitality areas and get out of the sun and relax a while. Joe spectator can't do this.

All of the hard core fans on here will defend the status quo., but the fact is this sport is dying. NHRA knows this, but seem uninterested. No one there has any long range vision. As the crowds dwindle, they will have to continue to raise prices for the hard core few that still attend.

I am old enough to remember when it was fun. Young people today will never have that experience and get the bug that makes them fans.

I have heard good things about IHRA Nitro whatever they call it, and ADRL, but haven't had the opportunity to check them out.

Jay, I wonder how many tracks in the "Golden Era" had facilities that come close to anything today? I think too many race fans have come to expect everything for next to nothing! Why do people act like NHRA holds a gun to their heads to go if it's that bad?

 

[Toejam]

You guys crack me up with your total ignorance of the messege...

What you are not getting is this..
It doesn't matter if Joe is right or wrong, or if he should have expected a better experience or not, or the price paid was to high or average.....
It's about the initial reaction from someone who might represent 99% of the average first time drag race fan who may never come back again.
Get it?
No matter how crazy and off base it may seem, perception is reality, and the reality is that the NHRA grandstands are not what they used to be in any stretch of the imagination. This is one of the main reasons "why" my friends...

All of us who have been to several races know what to expect, but if you look into the stands, there are empty seats that represent people who may have had the same reaction as Joe. Personally, I haven't been to a race in 7 years, and I don't ever plan on going again because the product sucks. TV is good enough for me because I remember when it used to be great, and now it's less than good..

If you think the NHRA will survive the years ahead, you better figure out how to accommodate the casual fan, and make the experience something of value, and not a waste of time and money, or worse, un-affordable for the middle class working family.
Without making the experience a little more "middle class" friendly, nobody will be bringing the "next" generation of race fans, their kids..
You might just find the NHRA a thing of the past as it dies a slow death before our very eyes, as it is currently.

George, your posts make me think you could have written that article! I'm beginning to think the average Racefan expects to be waited on hand and foot, did this guy expect a suite in the Tower? Free food and beverages? Hey George, ever been to a Professional SPorting event? Let me know how much that cost?

 

[Rat]

You guys crack me up with your total ignorance of the messege...

What you are not getting is this..
It doesn't matter if Joe is right or wrong, or if he should have expected a better experience or not, or the price paid was to high or average.....
It's about the initial reaction from someone who might represent 99% of the average first time drag race fan who may never come back again.
Get it?
No matter how crazy and off base it may seem, perception is reality, and the reality is that the NHRA grandstands are not what they used to be in any stretch of the imagination. This is one of the main reasons "why" my friends...

All of us who have been to several races know what to expect, but if you look into the stands, there are empty seats that represent people who may have had the same reaction as Joe. Personally, I haven't been to a race in 7 years, and I don't ever plan on going again because the product sucks. TV is good enough for me because I remember when it used to be great, and now it's less than good..

If you think the NHRA will survive the years ahead, you better figure out how to accommodate the casual fan, and make the experience something of value, and not a waste of time and money, or worse, un-affordable for the middle class working family.
Without making the experience a little more "middle class" friendly, nobody will be bringing the "next" generation of race fans, their kids..
You might just find the NHRA a thing of the past as it dies a slow death before our very eyes, as it is currently.

Yea I understand what it's getting at, but all this article is, is echoing the complaints everyone already knew exist. I constantly been someone who is against NHRA in reguard to there ignorance, but unfortunately I gave up. As I said before and will say again, unless NHRA can relax on the prices attendance will keep going down. I have no sympathy for his story because most of everybody going to an NHRA has been inconvienence the same or more of spent the same or more amount of money. Tracks need to make money yes, but NHRA has not done much to offer discounts that effect the majority. (ie. Kids, miltary discount) I would like to know how much NHRA charges a track for an event or if the lack of a discount can be blamed on the track or the NHRA.

 

[Toejam]

Telling the customer to buy your product because the competition is just as bad is a fireable offense at every company I worked for. If drag racing cannot make it on its own merits, we have a problem.

Sure, at first read I thought Joks article was a bit on the whining side but think that George, Jim and and Jay make very valid points in this thread.

Regards
PiPPi
http://HarleyDrags.com

Well then Par, why do SOO Many Europeans throw down Thousands attending an American Drag race? You guys seem to be bigger fans of this sport than Americans are!

 

[Treeshaker]

I believe it was because at the race track he owned it was much more fan & racer friendly...
We race there in July and the fans pack the place for a Nitro show in the cornfields -
but of course there's little downtime and reasonable prices...

As we age sometimes reality becomes a thing of the past.

Are we really expected to compare your event in July to LVMS and an NHRA national event? But let's do, if people are willing to pay $20.00 to see four cars that are scheduled to make a total of 8 runs ($2.50 per scheduled run, which seldom happens), then they should be willing to pay $160.00 for a typical qualifying day at an NHRA national event (two 16 car fields of nitro cars x 2 runs each, not counting extra cars that might be there trying to qualifying). And this doesn't even consider the Pro Stocks, Alcohol classes, Pro Mod or Pro Stock motorcycles, or the hundreds of other sportsman cars.

I have promoted races at tracks like Ware Shoals, Greer, Savannah, Monk's Corner, Silver Dollar and Atlanta Dragway among others while here in the south, but I wouldn't expect anyone to compare those events to the Charlotte race being held this weekend or the national event at LVMS. It would be like comparing a bar band at Sue's down the street from me to a Taylor Swift concert at the Time Warner Center. There is no way anyone could expect the same atmosphere or prices.

From my experience I know what 5,000 spectators look like, and I doubt very much if any proof can be provided that your small event pulled that many spectators. You keep using the phrase "owned", but I would suspect that it would be "owns" if your statement about attendance was even close to being true, and there would be 3 - 6 of that type of race per year at the track.

Back to the article:
1. The cost to get to the track is not relevant to the event.
2. Going to the wrong gate was his mistake, along with going to the wrong ticket booth.
3. The water issue was lack of common sense.
4. The guards are necessary. His bypassing them was an error in judgement. When he gets hit, he will be the first and loudest to scream for justice.
5. Buying GA tickets was him being cheap, but he still had good seats to view the event.
6. His account of the events taking place were flawed, maybe by the beer, maybe by his envy/bias.
7. His disdain for the amount of trucks DSR and Force have, again envy/bias. He probably doesn't realize how many new fans are being exposed to the sport of drag racing for the first time through their experiences at these hospitality centers. Tasca provided a free hour meet and greet with 40 Ford owners and one guest each at their hospitality center this weekend. Each unit can handle from 100 to 300 guests per day. How many get their first exposure to professional drag racing through Force's road show?
8. The long walks, laziness.
9. Not allowed in the staging lanes? Along with being a safety obligation of the track, it is a working area for the teams for final preparation. There is enough going on without outside distractions. Go see his friends in their pits, it was a shorter walk any ways.


The old days weren't as great as everyone wants to remember them. Dirty facilities, long lines, lots of standing, unsafe tracks, both on track and in the pits. People have a tendency to remember the good and forget the bad.

 

[Nick Name]

Well then Par, why do SOO Many Europeans throw down Thousands attending an American Drag race? You guys seem to be bigger fans of this sport than Americans are!

Joe, glad you brought this up. I attended the European Finals at Santa Pod last year. I can honestly say that I have not had such a good time at an automotive drag race in at least 20 years.

It was a blast. Santa Pod is old, so maybe that is why we didn't have to walk 50 miles to get in the place. Great food courts, reasonably priced, etc. But the best part is there were no bracket type cars of any kind ( at least that I saw), and the spectator seating on the right side was right up against the track like we used to have in this country before we became over run with lawyers.

Someone posted a photo of me, on the internet, standing in a vip area that is no more than 10 feet from the fuel cars as they stage. IT has a plexiglass area between you and the cars, but it is like you are right out against the wall.

I don't believe you were around in the glory days of OCIR, Lions, etc. So I say, get on a plane and go over there at the end of this year and come back and post that experience, VS going to any NHRA big show race today.

 

[George.]

George, your posts make me think you could have written that article! I'm beginning to think the average Racefan expects to be waited on hand and foot, did this guy expect a suite in the Tower? Free food and beverages? Hey George, ever been to a Professional SPorting event? Let me know how much that cost?

You are missing my point Joe...

This is the NHRA, not the NFL.
Re-read my post a little slower, and put yourself in the position of a newbie attendee who gets their first taste of the current NHRA experience.
How many become returning fans, especially if you can't bring in a bottle of water?
An embarrassing low for a family sport...
I might sound negative and I may be way off base, but for me, the draw has totally jumped the shark.
Nothing new except less track and more John Force.

 

[None]

I've bit my tongue for nearly 3 years so I'll share this here so the NHRA pundits can slam on me for awhile.

My last NHRA race experience was at the final race they ran in Memphis. I followed a friend out to the track where we were told that the tower parking area was full. Our tower parking passes were instantly worthless. We paid five bucks each and left 150K of sheet metal parked in a bean field next to some drunk tailgaters.

Fun way to start off a race weekend. It would only get worse...

I was a guest in a nice suite in what was the original timing tower. I had bought 14 Nitro section seats (two rows) to give away to acquaintances and co-workers. On Friday afternoon I left the suite to visit with my friends sitting in the Nitro section. One entire row was occupied by people I didn't know. They kept insisting (loudly) that they were in the correct seats. I had bought these exact same two rows for the previous 5 years, so I had a pretty good idea of who should and shouldn't be sitting there. After 3 minutes of not convincing them that they were in the wrong seats I had to contact security to have them removed. It was ugly.

On Saturday I saw some good folks I attend church with standing at the fence in front of our suite. I had given them some of my Nitro tickets, but they stood there at the fence through the entire first round of nitro qualifying. It was their first ever drag race and I was happy to see that they were down there up close and huffing the fumes. I walked down to visit with them as ProStock qualifying began. They were really enjoying the noise and nitro fumes. Well, turns out they were turned away by the ticket checker at the Nitro section and told to walk around to the other side of the track and sit in the spectator bleachers. Long story short, pretty much everyone I had given tickets to had been denied entry into the Nitro section. Most of them were first time NHRA attendees. How would you feel to get great tickets to a big time sporting event - and then be told to literally "take a hike" when you got there?

Sunday was a complete rain out. (Thankfully?)

I returned to the track Monday morning for the start of the race. They were already half way through funny car. I tapped on my watch to see if it was still working. Hmmm. Not good. They were obviously in a hurry to get this fiasco over with. Meanwhile in the suite none of our catered food had been delivered. Upon entering the pits I discovered that about 98% of the mobile food venders had also packed up and left on Sunday.

It only got worse.

Hungry and on my way back to my suite I was stopped and told by the ticket checker that my suite pass wasn't good for walking across the front of the Nitro section. I would have to use the walkover above the staging lanes, walk around the track, enter from the spectator side, and then use the crossover above the bleachboxes to return to my suite on the pit side. Unbelievable.

Our suite passes and wristbands had been good enough in the years past to access the suites - all day long all weekend long. Keep in mind there was all of maybe 20 people in the entire Nitro section. Fortunately I had EIGHT unused Nitro section tickets in my shirt pocket. I showed him one of those and passed through the same hallowed ground denied to those whom I had gifted tickets with on Saturday.

I went straight up to my empty foodless drinkless suite, collected my personal belongs, and left the last NHRA sanctioned event I ever plan to attend.

The track in St. Louis wore out my cell phone wanting me to buy tickets to attend their NHRA event. Not in a million years.

I don't have to worry about them calling me anymore. One less sponser market for the brain trust in Glendora.

BTW, Memphis wasn't my first rodeo. I've also attended several NHRA national events each in Atlanta, Columbus, Dallas, Houston, Gainesville, and Topeka. All as a hospitality guest of a NHRA world championship winning Top Fuel race team. (Doesn't matter who it was.)

I'm finished here. Have big fun explaining to me how stupid I am for blaming the sanctioning body for the ignorant local track workers. Thanks, but I already know that's how it works here at the Mater.

Whatever...

 

[Dave]

Not exactly a slam, but did you ask any of the higher ups (NHRA, track owner, security?) about your situation? Also NHRA doesn't own the track, so no they aren't exactly at fault.

Also, to share my own "WTF is wrong with you?" story... Route 66 Raceway in Joliet, friday night qualifying about 2003/2004. I believe Carquest was sponsoring the race at the time. Whoever it was they had $8 dollar off coupons for friday tickets. Well having to work all day we didn't get there until just before the evening session. No big deal. For some reason the place was really hopping, as all the north side parking was full. They directed us to the NASCAR track across the street, where we were parked near turn 4 of the oval. That was a half hour walk from the car to the main gate. Still cost 5 bucks to park too. Then we get to the gate and as for 2 general admission (or north side) tickets. We are told - get this - general admission is sold out. I said what? How is that possible? They said sorry, have to buy a reserved seat.. and pay an extra ten bucks. I said that was ridiculous. I don't even want a seat, I just want to go to the pits, just sell me general admission and mark on the ticket no grandstand seating allowed. They finally said they'd sell me one of the reserve tickets with the 8 dollar discount so I still had to pay 20 more than I would have since I was buying 2 tickets. Nobody could still answer how general admission sells out. Apparently a lot of people brought coupons that day, and nobody really wanted to pay an extra 10 for south side seating and they needed to make the $$. If you don't want to have to give discounts, then don't print coupons from the title sponsor to try and draw in a bigger crowd and the F them at the gate. I have never had a problem since, and I don't think they've given away ticket discounts since.

 

[StockersRock]

I've bit my tongue for nearly 3 years so I'll share this here so the NHRA pundits can slam on me for awhile.

My last NHRA race experience was at the final race they ran in Memphis. I followed a friend out to the track where we were told that the tower parking area was full. Our tower parking passes were instantly worthless. We paid five bucks each and left 150K of sheet metal parked in a bean field next to some drunk tailgaters.

Fun way to start off a race weekend. It would only get worse...

I was a guest in a nice suite in what was the original timing tower. I had bought 14 Nitro section seats (two rows) to give away to acquaintances and co-workers. On Friday afternoon I left the suite to visit with my friends sitting in the Nitro section. One entire row was occupied by people I didn't know. They kept insisting (loudly) that they were in the correct seats. I had bought these exact same two rows for the previous 5 years, so I had a pretty good idea of who should and shouldn't be sitting there. After 3 minutes of not convincing them that they were in the wrong seats I had to contact security to have them removed. It was ugly.

On Saturday I saw some good folks I attend church with standing at the fence in front of our suite. I had given them some of my Nitro tickets, but they stood there at the fence through the entire first round of nitro qualifying. It was their first ever drag race and I was happy to see that they were down there up close and huffing the fumes. I walked down to visit with them as ProStock qualifying began. They were really enjoying the noise and nitro fumes. Well, turns out they were turned away by the ticket checker at the Nitro section and told to walk around to the other side of the track and sit in the spectator bleachers. Long story short, pretty much everyone I had given tickets to had been denied entry into the Nitro section. Most of them were first time NHRA attendees. How would you feel to get great tickets to a big time sporting event - and then be told to literally "take a hike" when you got there?

Sunday was a complete rain out. (Thankfully?)

I returned to the track Monday morning for the start of the race. They were already half way through funny car. I tapped on my watch to see if it was still working. Hmmm. Not good. They were obviously in a hurry to get this fiasco over with. Meanwhile in the suite none of our catered food had been delivered. Upon entering the pits I discovered that about 98% of the mobile food venders had also packed up and left on Sunday.

It only got worse.

Hungry and on my way back to my suite I was stopped and told by the ticket checker that my suite pass wasn't good for walking across the front of the Nitro section. I would have to use the walkover above the staging lanes, walk around the track, enter from the spectator side, and then use the crossover above the bleachboxes to return to my suite on the pit side. Unbelievable.

Our suite passes and wristbands had been good enough in the years past to access the suites - all day long all weekend long. Keep in mind there was all of maybe 20 people in the entire Nitro section. Fortunately I had EIGHT unused Nitro section tickets in my shirt pocket. I showed him one of those and passed through the same hallowed ground denied to those whom I had gifted tickets with on Saturday.

I went straight up to my empty foodless drinkless suite, collected my personal belongs, and left the last NHRA sanctioned event I ever plan to attend.

The track in St. Louis wore out my cell phone wanting me to buy tickets to attend their NHRA event. Not in a million years.

I don't have to worry about them calling me anymore. One less sponser market for the brain trust in Glendora.

BTW, Memphis wasn't my first rodeo. I've also attended several NHRA national events each in Atlanta, Columbus, Dallas, Houston, Gainesville, and Topeka. All as a hospitality guest of a NHRA world championship winning Top Fuel race team. (Doesn't matter who it was.)

I'm finished here. Have big fun explaining to me how stupid I am for blaming the sanctioning body for the ignorant local track workers. Thanks, but I already know that's how it works here at the Mater.

Whatever...

Other than the early start of Monday's racing, I'd say this was all on the venue, not NHRA. Given the investment you made, I would have been straight into the track's office rather quickly.

 

[George.]

Other than the early start of Monday's racing, I'd say this was all on the venue, not NHRA. Given the investment you made, I would have been straight into the track's office rather quickly.

For those of us in the retail side of business, you will have to help me explain this to the rest of the Maters how service and responsibility for those services works....

If something on the service end fails in my business, it's MY fault, no matter if I'm 1,000 miles away. That's how I take it, and that is why I correct it. The buck stops with me, and not my counter people.

It is the NHRA's 100% responsibility from venue to venue to make sure that the service and experience portion remains top shelf and consistent. If they have no such education system, then again, the blame falls on the sanctioning body itself because the buck in the "perceived" world stops with them.

To blame it on the venue is an easy and convenient target, but the responsibility always falls on the NHRA. When the "boss" doesn't own the problem, it never gets fixed. If correct protocol isn't in place and duly shared from venue to venue, then again, it's the NHRA who is at fault.

So go ahead, blame the venue, but ultimately, the NHRA failed the venue by not clearly educating them on how their own service protocol should be implemented.

When McDonalds opens another restaurant, isn't it exactly the same as the rest?
It's not rocket science.

 

[Nitrohelper]

.....my experience I know what 5,000 spectators look like.....

With my experience of more than 40 years as a Design & Construction executive and a designer of a 80,000 person stadium in Asia, and a Formula One track in Egypt, I believe that I have far more than an average understanding of crowd size...
I have purchased millions of dollars in grandstand seating for numerous arenas...
When I was working with NHRA in the late '70s we measured the seating available at facilities prior to the National events...

I was never comparing the Midwest grass roots racing to a National event , only pointing out to the posters that this was not Jok's first event ,but that he had far more knowledge about operating a drag racing property than them & you...

I'm sure that you have the experience to understand that a small track doesn't run run 5-6 major events a season ,but rather one that they have been building a fan base for during many seasons...
Most are "entertainment shows" like what IHRA has now copied from these grass roots tracks because of the 30 years of success by the small track operators...
I tuned Nitro cars at 16 events last season ,some with grass pits, and based on souvenir sales and autograph responses the fans enjoyed our performances...
I don't have to remember burning Nitro at small tracks as in the old days - I'm still doing it on new days...

 

[StockersRock]

So go ahead, blame the venue, but ultimately, the NHRA failed the venue by not clearly educating them on how their own service protocol should be implemented.

You're absolutely right. I was thinking a little more locally, in respect to seating problems, etc., in that I would like to know why the employee isn't aware of the situation. The failure of communication is usually unknown to the employee at "ground level".