What takes the fun out of PRO drag racing is the "underdog" which equates to under funded does not stand a ghost of a chance at the world championship. Then their is all the shanigans that go with the show. In Funny Car its a joke you have Schumachker and Force who have 7 entries in the class close to 50% of the field, Hight won a world title on bs. Ashley lost won because she could find a motor to work. In Top Fuel its Al Anabi or Schumachker. Why would you want to watch if the deck is stacked. Pro Stock is going in that direction. Summit two cars, Nitro Fish two cars, Edwards and Johnson are going to be extinct soon. PSM the same thing. Unless you have between 10 and 50 million don't think about it. Warren and Colburn where the example of what drag racers symbolize.
Nitromater
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NHRA being Investigated by the IRS
- Thread starter SundayNiagara
- Start date
I know have been spouting off on this subject. So some background, I'm 63 yrs old, live in Los Angeles, and have been a drag racing fan since I was 11. I have purchase every magazine, read thousand and thousands of articles pertaining to the sport. Own an 69 RS Camaro with an LS7 454, 465HP, ported and polished heads by Gale Banks, back in day when you a got a crate engine for $1000. Been to Lions, Orange County, Irwindale, and Pomona both Winternationals and World Finals. Was at Lions when Garlits blew up. So I do have some opinions on the subject. Just seems like the joe average is getting excluded from the overall big picture. Once upon a time ago I could afford to go to a Laker game, see the Rams in the Colseium, go to Dodger Stadium in sit in the Bleachers for $5 and seems like drag racing will be a TV sport just like the rest, too expensive to be a live participating fan or competitor.
Draw 3D
Nitro Member
Not sure what you are meaning but there is a rulebook and it's online.
The download is free for members so what is the issue? I pesonally like the PDF version 'cause I can zoom in and out and do quick searches that I cannot do on the printed version.
As far as the membership advantages go, they are worth it for me including the added insurance.
If you want to race in NHRA, you join!
If you just want to watch and not pay for the membership, then don't join!
Plain and simple as that, but then, what to complain about?
mick
Nitro Member
if a doctor (not my regular doctor, but one with a plaque on wall
and all the credentials that make him/her a legal doctor) tells me i have
lampington's disease, chances are yes, i will consult my regular doctor
before drawing any conclusions, but the diagnosis by the first doctor
tells me there is a very good probability that something is wrong
or out of the ordinary; there is no reason to prematurely discredit the original diagnosis.
and all the credentials that make him/her a legal doctor) tells me i have
lampington's disease, chances are yes, i will consult my regular doctor
before drawing any conclusions, but the diagnosis by the first doctor
tells me there is a very good probability that something is wrong
or out of the ordinary; there is no reason to prematurely discredit the original diagnosis.
Yes, Paul nothing to complain about. But just one litttle bitty point, I quite sure you put in many hours making your job or your car comnpetitive with all the others. That is a given. But when I read or been aware of a person or persons who don't put in the work to compensated big money for ten hours of work and the benefit I get as member is far less I have problem with that circumstance. I think membership should be worth more than just valued added product which someone gets a cut
I think that NACAR got it right their inspectors are trained and work for NASCAR. They have the knowledge and experience to follow the rules to the letter and catch cheaters. No rulings without foundation from Charllote to California. Can you say the same for the NHRA. The benefit of membership is a fair playing field for all competitors. What has NHRA done, when to a 1000 ft racing. But Force and Medlin took upon them selves to come up with a better chassis. NHRA should have been had an R&D Safety Lab, 60 yrs and the same format for safety is still there. The SFI standards we have to abide by them but NHRA disclaims any involvement in setting or creating the standard. When profit is the motivator, then everything else is just so much noise.
Draw 3D
Nitro Member
Bruce, every business that I know of, and is still in business, gets a "cut" of any value added product including a portion to its employees.
Don't get me wrong, I do believe that the NHRA brass have made some bad decisions lately, but they have provided a nationwide drag racing circuit and that's not easy to do.
When Mike Kosky posts that he was one of those who gave his vote to the existing Board back in the 80s he says it was “to do what they had to do to keep us racing.”
I’m not for a second suggesting that my memory of this is any better than Mike’s, and without meaning to offend him or anyone else who provided the Board with their proxy vote, I think we were all a helluva lot more naïve about the business side of drag racing than we are now.
Again admitting that this is my memory and mine alone, I’m pretty sure that the way NHRA worded the documentation that came with the proxy form left the reader with the impression that if we didn’t provide those proxies there might be dire results. Did they scare us into supporting them? Maybe, but who remembers the details at this point?
And Mel Smith is correct in suggesting the vote was voluntary. It absolutely was. But as I wrote in an earlier post on this subject – and it was even more so then – the vast majority of NHRA members (probably about 50,000 at the time) were far more concerned with lane choice, horsepower factoring, class indexes, entry fees, and avoiding being hassled by someone at a points meet than they were with how the organization was managed. Also remember that at that time Wally was viewed as a benevolent dictator, one who would watch over us and the sport we loved. So therefore, if Wally thought we should send in our proxies, we’d do it.
Regarding Bruce Edwards’s rant encompassing sponsorships and tires, his information on the former is inaccurate, and as to the latter, while we may not like it, Goodyear has paid for the privilege of being the sole supplier of tires for T/F, F/C and P/S. And let’s be real here. Without Goodyear’s involvement there is no drag racing on the top levels because if they bail out there’s probably not going to be another tire manufacturer eager to lose the millions of dollars Goodyear loses on drag racing tires every year. We need ‘em.
At the risk of losing my credibility as an NHRA-basher, Mr. Tichener states; “…where the board members have taken some shady steps to fully eliminate any member input is not a healthy or fair situation.” Please define those “shady steps.” Your comments would make it appear as if NHRA did something illegal. They didn’t. What they did do was take advantage of our naiveté.
Is Bruce Edwards ever right. He succinctly defines our “rights” as “members.” We have none.
However, Bruce, if you follow other forms of racing you know there’s the same kind of domination. In the Indy car racing there’s Penske, Ganassi, Andretti-Green and the also-rans. In NASCAR it’s Hendrick, Roush-Fenway and then the rest. Why would you think drag racing would be any different?
By the way “Fast” Tim Charlet wins the prize on Lampington’s, and he will receive something appropriate. Costly, too!
Jon Asher
I’m not for a second suggesting that my memory of this is any better than Mike’s, and without meaning to offend him or anyone else who provided the Board with their proxy vote, I think we were all a helluva lot more naïve about the business side of drag racing than we are now.
Again admitting that this is my memory and mine alone, I’m pretty sure that the way NHRA worded the documentation that came with the proxy form left the reader with the impression that if we didn’t provide those proxies there might be dire results. Did they scare us into supporting them? Maybe, but who remembers the details at this point?
And Mel Smith is correct in suggesting the vote was voluntary. It absolutely was. But as I wrote in an earlier post on this subject – and it was even more so then – the vast majority of NHRA members (probably about 50,000 at the time) were far more concerned with lane choice, horsepower factoring, class indexes, entry fees, and avoiding being hassled by someone at a points meet than they were with how the organization was managed. Also remember that at that time Wally was viewed as a benevolent dictator, one who would watch over us and the sport we loved. So therefore, if Wally thought we should send in our proxies, we’d do it.
Regarding Bruce Edwards’s rant encompassing sponsorships and tires, his information on the former is inaccurate, and as to the latter, while we may not like it, Goodyear has paid for the privilege of being the sole supplier of tires for T/F, F/C and P/S. And let’s be real here. Without Goodyear’s involvement there is no drag racing on the top levels because if they bail out there’s probably not going to be another tire manufacturer eager to lose the millions of dollars Goodyear loses on drag racing tires every year. We need ‘em.
At the risk of losing my credibility as an NHRA-basher, Mr. Tichener states; “…where the board members have taken some shady steps to fully eliminate any member input is not a healthy or fair situation.” Please define those “shady steps.” Your comments would make it appear as if NHRA did something illegal. They didn’t. What they did do was take advantage of our naiveté.
Is Bruce Edwards ever right. He succinctly defines our “rights” as “members.” We have none.
However, Bruce, if you follow other forms of racing you know there’s the same kind of domination. In the Indy car racing there’s Penske, Ganassi, Andretti-Green and the also-rans. In NASCAR it’s Hendrick, Roush-Fenway and then the rest. Why would you think drag racing would be any different?
By the way “Fast” Tim Charlet wins the prize on Lampington’s, and he will receive something appropriate. Costly, too!
Jon Asher
Jon have great respect for your opinion. What you articulate is so very true. In my humble opinion the NHRA should be about inclusion not exclusion. The more sponsors we can get into the sport more exposure the sport receives. As far as other motorsports are concern its always been a rich mans game in Indy cars, same for Formula 1, SCCA, but the beginnings drag racing and NASCAR started at the grassroots level. I beleive there should room for the Petty's and Prudhomme's in their respective sport. Cory Mac will not get ride this year, why is the younger JR Todd racing Pro Mod because you just don't need dollars you need cubic dollars race in any Pro class. This is a function of leadership at the top to have vision of what its members want the sport to look and feel. Just at first blush what have here is the banking industry get what you can and damn the intended and unintended consequences. I want the NHRA to be like a union, pay dues, give me the right to race safely, and lookout for the membership both large and small. Might be a fantasy in 2011 but I hope and pray that some good comes from these circumstances. One additional point there way more Sportsman Racers than there are Pro's. The little people put this sport on the map.
vegasnitro
Nitro Member
I had a thought driving home from work today. Why release the anonymous letter sent to the IRS to the media? What is the motivation there? It makes it much less likely you stay "anonymous" and you give NHRA a chance to get all their ducks in a row or lawyer up or essentially do whatever they need to before the IRS does anything. Seems to me it would have been much more prudent to keep it on the down low ...
Bill
Nitro Member
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
For one thing, not everyone in the USA own a computer with a printer. Some who own them, don't know how to retrieve a document online and print it out. Not everyone has those capabilities. Where does this leave them? Without a rulebook, I would think.
Traditionally, the NHRA SENT you a rulebook as part of your membership benefits. That went on for longer than I can remember. Wonder what bean counter decided they might be able to cut that benefit and nobody would notice??? Did he get a bonus??? You would think that all the unnecessary and distracting ads in it would pay for its printing.
They don't send them out, anymore. Did membership dues decrease to reflect this lessening of benefits, or did NHRA hope this dirty little trick would just be absorbed into the woodwork along with other take-aways?
I didn't notice my dues going down... did you?
Apologists for NHRA and their unceasing greed have a big job on their hands...
Good luck, guys.
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Treeshaker
Nitro Member
Joe, only the naive and misinformed believe that Goodyear loses money selling tires to the pros at NHRA events. Our team paid $1,602.00 per pair of slicks at Charlotte this year, which equates to $801.00 per tire. Our total cost for the tires used for the weekend was $8,811.00. If we were just average, then the gross sales of tires at that event to the nitro cars was approx $300,000.00. I guestimate that with tires for other classes, that NHRA is somewhere in the $10 million per year gross side business for Goodyear.
This is a little off topic, but again, unsubstantiated statements are being thrown around by the misinformed.
TR
Nitro Member
I agree with Bill, this rule book deal stinks. I still order one every year and pay extra for it, because I have to have it in hand, just old school I guess. I don't like the download stuff and as a member I am entitled to my opinion.
Rick
Virgil, since I first posted this I remembered the Julie Russell Lawsuit! Did that ever go through? Having said that....$800 per Tire is Insane!
mw6789
Nitro Member
I agree with you Bill, and I think you would agree that money is at the root of all this "evil". Every credit card company I do business with wants to email my statement to me. Why?----because it saves them money of course. Our postal service is fast fading into oblivion because paper mail is fast becoming a thing of the past in the digital age. I too miss the good ole' days (although I dont go back quite as far as you do buddy LOL) when you could run a professional category for less that the GNP of a small country. Unfortunately Wally Parks is no longer with us, and lets face it, the sport we all love is basically powered by cubic dollars----from the $100K stocker you earlier made reference to, all the way up to a top fuel team with a $10M budget. And I am quite sure that Mr. Parks recognized long before he went to that big drag strip in the sky, that the NHRA could no longer be run by car clubs and racers who loved the sport. NHRA is in the BIG business of entertainment. And the entertainment business is driven by MONEY---and lots of it. And unfortunately, NHRA is now a big business, and no longer run by people who love drag racing and drag racers, but by people who are interested in the end result----the bottom line. And big money always creates BIG problems. I personally dont like the ideal that NHRA is being waved in front of the IRS pack of money hungry wolves and dont know of anything the government money collectors have ever touched that was better off when they got done with it (or anything else the government touches, but I will shut up before I get whisked away to the politics room). Those that chose to open Pandora's box are entitled to their opinion just as those who think it is a mistake are entitled to ours. Bottom line is the old NHRA from the glory days is gone, dead, and buried----and ain't coming back. Just my 2 cents worth and probably overpriced at that.
As several post have eluded to its a raw deal no matter how you slice the cheese. Ido not beleive all is lost either. I think with the right restructing of the NHRA we can get back to competition between cars and not the show. For my druthers I think we3 org should like this:
Managing Director /w Div 1-7 to assist
Chief Financial Officer hired from the outside of NHRA
Competition Committee consisting of previous World Champions to meet in the off season.
Membership Director with two types of membership 1) Competitor 2) Fan
The Managing Editor of National Dragster is in charge of communications
We can start with this foremat an reform into the future.
In regards to Goodyear Virgil is right, make lots of cheddar off of the drag racers, is not competition in businness a good thing which ccould lower cost, Goodyear has a captive audience and charges what hell they want
Managing Director /w Div 1-7 to assist
Chief Financial Officer hired from the outside of NHRA
Competition Committee consisting of previous World Champions to meet in the off season.
Membership Director with two types of membership 1) Competitor 2) Fan
The Managing Editor of National Dragster is in charge of communications
We can start with this foremat an reform into the future.
In regards to Goodyear Virgil is right, make lots of cheddar off of the drag racers, is not competition in businness a good thing which ccould lower cost, Goodyear has a captive audience and charges what hell they want
