Jim Head Racing / Maple Grove. (2 Viewers)

[Jim]

The major league sports teams have contracts to guarantee their appearance. There's also the difference between team sports and individual sports. Do all "Professional" golfers play at every PGA tournament: No. How about Bowling? Tennis? The issue of sponsor commitments can certainly enter into this, but the self-funded folks should certainly be able to pick and choose

Jim, you're wrong on your Steph Curry example. He, and most other NBA stars, do skip games during the season for rest. I'm sure it's disappointing for fans who attend to see Steph but it happens several times a season. I think he would still be considered a professional. NHRA needs all the racers it can get. I'd rather have a part time Jim Head, who is self funded, than no Jim Head.

Yes. Players skip games for rest. That's load management. The games they sit out is the decision of the coaches. The teams also have substitute players so they can field a complete team. No pro athlete skips games because they have something else they would rather do. NBA teams do not play with 4 players when one player is not playing.

It looks bad for any pro sport to not have a full field. That's why IndyCar made sure there were 33 cars for the Indy 500 this year. It would have been a negative to have only 32 cars.

 

[Jim]

Jim, funny you mention F1 as they race for zero prize money have a huge tv contract and the incentives to run every are pretty darn good.

I know. F1 has made sure that the sport pays for every team that participates. They even have budget limits to ensure no one team outspends the others by a huge margin.

Yes, they have a huge TV contract because F1 delivers a solid entertainment product every race and keeps fan interest going throughout the year.

NHRA needs to create incentives for teams to run every race.

 

[none]

I am surprised no one has mentioned Chad Greene. Didn't JHR take them out of the countdown? I wonder how they feel hearing JHR will not even be attending the race.......................

 

[GumbyWVU]

So then the question becomes...JHR makes the count down and goes to Italy?

Jim

1. Would it make you feel better if he hadn't made the countdown and still went on his overseas trip?
2. If we didn't have the countdown at all would your "alarm" be less?

I'm not sure I see the problem here - he can do what he wants to and none of us have a say in it. And fewer still likely have a care about it either. I like Jim Head and would be disappointed not to see him, but it's his call to make (since he's his own main sponsor too).

Enders skipped the western swing that one year, to save $$ I think, and that was her choice to make. Nothing to see here, let's all move along.

 

[Jim]

1. Would it make you feel better if he hadn't made the countdown and still went on his overseas trip?

No. If he wants to compete in pro racing, he should be a professional. If you don't want to commit, run a sportsman class.

2. If we didn't have the countdown at all would your "alarm" be less?

No. Professional sports requires commitment. If you don't want to commit, run a sportsman class.

I'm not sure I see the problem here - he can do what he wants to and none of us have a say in it. And fewer still likely have a care about it either. I like Jim Head and would be disappointed not to see him, but it's his call to make (since he's his own main sponsor too).

Enders skipped the western swing that one year, to save $$ I think, and that was her choice to make. Nothing to see here, let's all move along.

If NHRA wants to be a professional sport, it must be a professional sport. That means having professional participants, not hobbyists who show up when they want. Professionals show up...not just in sports but in everything.

The bottom line is that when you look at NHRA drag racing in comparison to all professional sports, it is a second-tier sport. As it exists now, it is not a good show. One reason for that is that it is just not run on the same level of professionalism as other sports.

 

[GumbyWVU]

No. If he wants to compete in pro racing, he should be a professional. If you don't want to commit, run a sportsman class.

No. Professional sports requires commitment. If you don't want to commit, run a sportsman class.


If NHRA wants to be a professional sport, it must be a professional sport. That means having professional participants, not hobbyists who show up when they want. Professionals show up...not just in sports but in everything.

Well I'm sure everyone on here is very glad you're taking attendance. Jim Head will surely make a note of your thoughts on the matter. The guy misses one event and he's no longer a pro. Switch to decaf eh?

 

[Jim]

The guy misses one event and he's no longer a pro.

Pros show up. Not just in racing and sports, but in everything.

Showing up and doing the job is what sets professionals apart from amateurs.

 

[camaro]

Remember a few years back when former (sponsored) full time Pro Stocker, Allen Johnson Skipped a race to go watch his wife participate in a 'Dance Contest' ! that's when i knew he probably wasn't getting that much dough from his sponsor. Of course, the all time statement of how some racers do not view drag racing, as that Significant, is when a newly crown pro stock champion quits and ops for nascars 3rd tier racing program instead (he's back this weekend)

 

[mick]

i'm biased towards jim samuel's comments throughout this thread. it leads back to something i've mentioned a time or two in other threads.
i don't particularly care if blake alexander, chad green, bobby bode, densham's, jeff diehl, etc., show up to race ........what i care about is if a fan buys a ticket to see a race with
a 16 car bracket, why on earth does nhra continually allow short fields? who cares if indy has 25 tf'rs! what about the other third of all your annual races that can't even fill the fields?
the product is a 16 car qualified field, with a 16 car single eliminations race on sunday. get 16 cars to each race. qualify them. race them. done. anything short of that is looking
a little amateurish....... and it has nothing to do with the countdown races, which have continually shown no increase in attendance or tv ratings.
i would rather see nhra hold 18 full field national events annually, than 20+ events with short fields.

 

[Mike]

JIm, budget limits in F1 are just comedy. That started a few years ago and the cream still rise to the top. $5 million for 5 years! Yep, thats budget control

Mike, NHRA doesnt allow short fields its just the nature of the beast. Myself, I go to see racing and it does matter the amount of cars, I came to see racing.

To your point of a shorter season, I agree but its not my call so I worry about things I can control

 

[SoCal Racer]

And during all this talk comparing Stick&Ball sports. Nobody has mentioned anything about the ridiculous amounts of MONEY spent by the city / County's for a playground for the pro ball sport team owners to play on.
Image an operation like JFR being funded by a major city.
I can see it now, I'd build a Funny Car and name it The Detroit Tiger.

Too late, already been done

 

[SoCal Racer]

Find a professional golfer who does not show up for the US Open if they are eligible. What tennis player skips a Grand Slam event because they have something they'd rather do instead? How many professional bowlers skip a championship tournament?
<snip>

Rory McIlroy is paid $35 million/year by his sponsors. Do you think they'd be upset if he took a trip to Italy instead of playing at Augusta?

Bottom line: If the racers are going to act like hobbyists or amateurs, it is an amateur sport.

This.
Will Jim Head's sponsors be upset if he skips a race? Well, considering HE is the sponsor, I think not. I'm betting he'd rather be be racing than not, but life has priorities. Same for any other self-sponsored team. Until sponsors outside the sport step up to this level - the insane amount paid pro stick and ball players - you can't expect teams to "be professional" by your definition of making every race. However, pay me $35M/ year and I'll have a top shelf pro team up and running ASAP and guarantee that we'll make every race!

In my mind the financial commitment for drag racing - or any motorsport - makes it very different than any other sport. Racers show up at a racetrack having made a substantial financial investment. Ballplayers show up with little more than their talent. The disparity of cost vs. reward between the two is astronomical - there's simply no comparison. If Rory McIlroy had to spend $37M to get paid $35M, would that make him an amateur? Because that's essentially the way racing financials work out for all but a few teams - it costs more than you can make. In the absence of major sponsors many racers supplement with their own money because that allows them to race, but I don't see how that makes them amateurs.

 

[Jim]

This.
Will Jim Head's sponsors be upset if he skips a race? Well, considering HE is the sponsor, I think not. I'm betting he'd rather be be racing than not, but life has priorities. Same for any other self-sponsored team. Until sponsors outside the team step up to this level

Perhaps how self-sponsored teams operate is part of the reason they do not have sponsors. How many of the self-funded teams have any idea what potential sponsors are looking for? How many know what it takes to create a good racing program that will attract and give sponsors an ROI? How many know what sponsors want to see in a proposal that will interest them? I've been on the other side of the sponsorship fence for two different NASCAR sponsorships. What they are looking for is not a match for at least some of the part-time teams.

- the insane amount paid pro stick and ball players - you can't expect teams to "be professional" by your definition of making every race. However, pay me $35M/ year and I'll have a top shelf pro team up and running ASAP and guarantee that we'll make every race!

I've said several times that NHRA must take a big role in ensuring teams can afford to run the whole schedule. It looks bad for NHRA when they cannot get a full field. That looks bad to sponsors and potential sponsors, and it looks bad on TV. Too often, NHRA seems to be working against teams for sponsorships, etc. Perhaps they need to be working with teams for sponsorship funds. Perhaps NHRA should be like the NFL and split the TV money. Perhaps they should be like IndyCar did this year and pull together money to help a team run the 33rd car in the Indy 500 when it looked like they might not have a full field. John Force has helped out other racers so those teams could keep racing. It should not be up to him. It should be up to NHRA.

In my mind the financial commitment for drag racing - or any motorsport - makes it very different than any other sport. Racers show up at a racetrack having made a substantial financial investment. Ballplayers show up with little more than their talent. The disparity of cost vs. reward is astronomical - there's simply no comparison. If Rory McIlroy had to spend $37M to get paid $35M, would that make him an amateur? Becaue taht's essentially the way racing fincials work out.

Beginning golfers have to make financial commitments to get started. They don't find sponsors without having played successfully in tournaments. They have to play in those tournaments on their own dime until they attract a sponsor. Rory McIlroy has sponsors who pay his way. Like most pro golfers, he started out as an amateur, then smaller sponsors helped fund his way into the PGA. Then as he got better, the sponsorship money got bigger.

But like other forms of motorsports, PGA golfers get sponsored for doing a lot more than playing in tournaments. They do public appearances, Meet & greets with sponsor customers, both at tournaments and outside of tournaments. Endrosement deals. Appear in advertising. Both sponsors I worked with had show cars and driver appearances at trade shows that had nothing to do with racing.

Drag racing needs to change or it is going to continue to whither away. The worst reason to do something is because that's the way it has always been done, yet that seems to be a common thread in drag racing.

 

[SoCal Racer]

Perhaps how self-sponsored teams operate is part of the reason they do not have sponsors. How many of the self-funded teams have any idea what potential sponsors are looking for? How many know what it takes to create a good racing program that will attract and give sponsors an ROI? How many know what sponsors want to see in a proposal that will interest them?

I don't disagree, but isn't this a chicken and egg thing? You need to do well to attract sponsorship; but you can't afford to do well without sponsorship. It's a tough deal. Getting an operation going requires starting on your own dime, and how far you get is somewhat dependent on how many dimes you can spare. For most, pro level racing is simply out of reach, but many independent teams are trying to get there. That gives us underdogs to root for

 

[M Jones]

Yes. Players skip games for rest. That's load management. The games they sit out is the decision of the coaches. The teams also have substitute players so they can field a complete team. No pro athlete skips games because they have something else they would rather do. NBA teams do not play with 4 players when one player is not playing.

It looks bad for any pro sport to not have a full field. That's why IndyCar made sure there were 33 cars for the Indy 500 this year. It would have been a negative to have only 32 cars.

So jim head skips race because of financial load or for business that keeps load manage levels that can keep him racing how’s that different, not sure that is what he is doing just asking for clarification on your points

 

[Butch]

Too late, already been done
View attachment 11367

I know that I was saying that as a joke.

 

[z28]

If NHRA was really worried about full fields then Camping World as a sponsor could spread some money around. NHRA as an org is not in a position finacially to do that. If they were they wouldn't be selling drag strips and office buildings. In this day and age drag racing is a niche sport. BTW looks like a sellout at the Grove today.

 

[Custom Body Fan]

Jim, you have done a great job complaining about the way things are. But you have done nothing to say what should be done to fix the problem. Do you think NHRA should ban teams that skip races? Should they come up with enough money (and tell us from where) to make it a no brainer for teams to show up (US Open tennis paid $2.6 million to the winner.). What are your practical (emphasis on practical) solutions to the problem? Just complaining isn’t effective.

 

[glofria]

This is dumb. NHRA is a sanctioning body and race promoter, not a league. They hold events and encourage teams (semi-pro and pro) to enter in those events so long as they have cars the fit the class. So they encourage more participation, not less as you suggest Jim. If someone like Jeff Diehle or Jim Maroney has only the budget to run a handful of races each year, should they be denied?

As Chris says above, let see your business model and how you would implement it. As of now, NHRA is the only option,

 

[BOO BOO]

This.
Will Jim Head's sponsors be upset if he skips a race? Well, considering HE is the sponsor, I think not. I'm betting he'd rather be be racing than not, but life has priorities. Same for any other self-sponsored team. Until sponsors outside the sport step up to this level - the insane amount paid pro stick and ball players - you can't expect teams to "be professional" by your definition of making every race. However, pay me $35M/ year and I'll have a top shelf pro team up and running ASAP and guarantee that we'll make every race!

In my mind the financial commitment for drag racing - or any motorsport - makes it very different than any other sport. Racers show up at a racetrack having made a substantial financial investment. Ballplayers show up with little more than their talent. The disparity of cost vs. reward between the two is astronomical - there's simply no comparison. If Rory McIlroy had to spend $37M to get paid $35M, would that make him an amateur? Because that's essentially the way racing financials work out for all but a few teams - it costs more than you can make. In the absence of major sponsors many racers supplement with their own money because that allows them to race, but I don't see how that makes them amateurs.

This.
Will Jim Head's sponsors be upset if he skips a race? Well, considering HE is the sponsor, I think not. I'm betting he'd rather be be racing than not, but life has priorities. Same for any other self-sponsored team. Until sponsors outside the sport step up to this level - the insane amount paid pro stick and ball players - you can't expect teams to "be professional" by your definition of making every race. However, pay me $35M/ year and I'll have a top shelf pro team up and running ASAP and guarantee that we'll make every race!

In my mind the financial commitment for drag racing - or any motorsport - makes it very different than any other sport. Racers show up at a racetrack having made a substantial financial investment. Ballplayers show up with little more than their talent. The disparity of cost vs. reward between the two is astronomical - there's simply no comparison. If Rory McIlroy had to spend $37M to get paid $35M, would that make him an amateur? Because that's essentially the way racing financials work out for all but a few teams - it costs more than you can make. In the absence of major sponsors many racers supplement with their own money because that allows them to race, but I don't see how that makes them amateurs.

Jim Head is not the only sponsor ! They also have Pronto which I believe Blake Alexander brought on board. So is Pronto ok with this?