Drivers speak on shutdown areas (2 Viewers)

[Alan]

Excellent article by Bobby and the Comp Plus team.

Drag Racing Internet Magazine - Competition Plus.com - DEMANDING CHANGES – RACERS SPEAK OUT ON SHUTDOWN AREAS

 

[Boo]

Hard to argue with anything that Bob Vandergriff had to say. I love my dragracing and of course I love it fast. But I want my race hero's here to be able to race another day!

 

[Tom]

Wow.

Just..WOW. I not only agree with EVERYTHING Bob Vandergriff had to say, but I think he ought to be the President of P.R.O. as well, because it's obvious Bernstein isn't doing his job. I love and respect the guy, but as a driver and team owner, as the President of a RACERS organization, I think he's in WAY over his head.

And what is with the secrecy bullsh-- by P.R.O. and NHRA anyway?? These are non profit corporations are they not??

 

[PJ]

I know there was never a public release of DR crash as promised but with the NJ police involved in this one, once the investigation is complete. If the NHRA doesn't release anything could the media get the police to release their findings through a freedom of information act?

 

[PJ]

Wow.

Just..WOW. I not only agree with EVERYTHING Bob Vandergriff had to say, but I think he ought to be the President of P.R.O. as well, because it's obvious Bernstein isn't doing his job. I love and respect the guy, but as a driver and team owner, as the President of a RACERS organization, I think he's in WAY over his head.

And what is with the secrecy bullsh-- by P.R.O. and NHRA anyway?? These are non profit corporations are they not??

I would think fear of insurance or lawsuits keeps them from releasing some things.



I had never thought of PRO in terms of oweners running it more than drivers. Bob has a very good point there. Maybe an outside person not tied to either group (owner/driver) would be best.

 

[Jim]

I know there was never a public release of DR crash as promised but with the NJ police involved in this one, once the investigation is complete. If the NHRA doesn't release anything could the media get the police to release their findings through a freedom of information act?

I believe the police report will be public record.

Jim

 

[Wes]

Bob is absolutely correct! The drivers are the ones that must make a stand regardless of penalty or retribution. No other voice, or combination of voices, is more prominent in drag racing than the men and women that choose to pilot the cars.

This pales in comparison to the tragedies we've seen at the professional level in the last decade or so, but in 1996 I was part of a "work stoppage" at a series event in which I participated. We were racing at a 1000' track in Arkansas...unsanctioned, mind you. One of our racers had a chute failure in his altered and went off the end of the track in first round of qualifying. I was just getting out of my car at the top end when I heard the tell-tale sound of rear tires bouncing and skidding. I turned around just in time to see this gorgeous orange 23-T flipping end over end out into a pasture. The track had no sand, no net, no nothing to stop a race car. Just a barb-wire fence. The driver was beat up but not seriously injured. The car was almost a total write-off.

You would think the fact that the track had no arrestment system in place at the end of the surface would have been the sticking point with us. Nope. There was not an ambulance on the grounds! Just a single EMT in a Ford Escort!!! Our series featured dragsters, altereds, and even funny cars with blowers, nitrous, alcohol, and who knows what else to go fast. You think there would have been just a little bit of consideration for "the show." Once we found out there was no ambulance and a lack of rescue personnel, we parked our cars. For four hours we sat until the track was convinced that an ambulance was indeed part of our event contract and that they still had to pay us if we all decided to leave. We got our ambulance. The race went on.

Contract or not, the most fundamental safety aspects must never be overlooked. And, if it takes the drivers, aka the TALENT, to refuse to perform then so be it. I've towed all the way to some unfamiliar track in the middle of nowhere, found out why I'd never heard of it (scary, unsafe, no insurance, etc.), never unloaded my car, and turned around and went home. It's my choice as a driver. There is no reason why our Top Fuel and Funny Car friends cannot make the same choice.

 

[Johnny Mopar]

I know there was never a public release of DR crash as promised but with the NJ police involved in this one, once the investigation is complete. If the NHRA doesn't release anything could the media get the police to release their findings through a freedom of information act?

The "Sunshine Act" makes these reports available to the public. I would call the County Courthouse and ask the sherriff's office for any information you'd like. Government is required to furnish any reports to the public.

 

[Tom]

The "Sunshine Act" makes these reports available to the public. I would call the County Courthouse and ask the sherriff's office for any information you'd like. Government is required to furnish any reports to the public.

Correct, and Non profit corporations are also under the same rules of disclosure. I am not sure if NHRA and PRO are Non profit corporations. My understanding is that they are. Can anyone confirm or deny?

 

[.]

CompetitionPlus.com sought answers to questions regarding Saturday's accident the next morning. This internet publication was denied the opportunity to talk to the NHRA's VP Director of Operations Graham Light regarding Saturday's accident. Comments from Light were included in stories from other publications. A spokesperson for the sanctioning body said the accident was under investigation and once complete the findings would be shared with the racing community.

Such a statement is likely to draw comparisons to the 2004 racing death of Darrell Russell. In that case, the findings from an NHRA investigation have yet to be made public.

Gee, there's a shocker, NHRA wouldn't speak to CompPlus. We have every right to be skeptical about NHRA coming clean about what happenned since they lied to us about releasing the investigation results about Darrell Russell.

 

[PJ]

Oh I didn't realize non profits and such were under that as well



Bob mentions one standard, I wonder if certain states would have a say in that as well. People mentioned how NJ seems to have its hand in things more than others. Were there issues in the shutdown area that were there by law of NJ?

 

[n/a]

I just read the article, ALL good comments by the racers...
and now I see that NHRA wants to address the 'Sand Traps' and some sort of standardization for all National event tracks...

Won't anybody just admitt that the fuel cars are just over taxing their equipment way beyond what current technologies can keep up with, and what current racetracks were designed for??

This is BS! Now we're talking about 'improving the sand traps'.... 6" here, 4' deep there... hell these cars are exploding way before thay get to the sand trap... IMO - Scotts death was probably caused by the cars engine explosion and concussion, not the sand trap

My guess is, that IF, NHRA were to mandate some NEW rules that would slow these cars down 30mph and maybe go to 1,000' racetrack, GOODYEAR Tire would be the first to applaud that decision. Keep asking these guys to come up with something better is a damn joke... they aren't making any money on these tf/fc tires now. What if they decide to walk awy from it all, what then?

For ME, I just want to see good, safe, side by side, competive Nitro drag racing. These cars don't have to go 330 to put on that show.

Larry

 

[Jake]

If the shutdown area at Englishtown is so dangerous and the only thing missing is a lake full of sharks why on earth hasn't Bob Vandergriff complained about this to NHRA, or track officials, or fellow race teams. Keep it off your race schedule if it is that bad.
Now that a tragic accident has happened it turns into a let's play the blame game, that is not right.

 

[Alan]

If the shutdown area at Englishtown is so dangerous and the only thing missing is a lake full of sharks why on earth hasn't Bob Vandergriff complained about this to NHRA, or track officials, or fellow race teams. Keep it off your race schedule if it is that bad.
Now that a tragic accident has happened it turns into a let's play the blame game, that is not right.

Do you think anyone from NHRA would have listened to Vandergriff or anyone else about the shutdown area? Not likely. And it's not a blame game per say, but there has to be responsibility somewhere for the objects placed in a shutdown area at any given track, don't you think?

 

[ctjstr]

Track safety and how the NHRA enforces it is pretty strange. There are specific written guidelines, developed with Wiesenberg or at least with their input, that dictate a lot of the aspects of track safety, e.g. wall height, length, obstructions, locations of the walls. But those are routinely ignored. THere are many NHRA tracks which don't meet the current standards, much less any new ones. It might be different for national event tracks, but there are lots of local tracks that aren't even close.
Incidently, try and get a copy of the wiesenberg standards and see how far you get. They get pretty angry if they find out that you have a set of them, which seems strange given that they are in existence for safety purposes.

 

[Jeff]

While non-profits are required to make limited financial disclosures public, I'm not aware of them having to make broad disclosures about decision-making or to have open board meetings, etc. However, non-profits are sanctioned by the states they are created within, and certainly each state has it's own rules. The IRC 501(c) designation (e.g. non-profit) comes after filing for a determination ruling from the IRS to see if the specific non-profit's charter allows in qualification under the IRS rules . . . that's what gets you the limited financial disclosure, but not much more than that.

Given some of the juicy stuff we never hear about from occasional odd goings on from organizations like the Boy Scouts and United Way I'd be shocked if their non-profit status got you much incremental information.

The FIA request probably would yield a preliminary report at a minimum, but beyond that is probably also less than a perfect process for an informed public.

 

[megadeth]

I agree with Bob there should be a standardized regulation that addresses all safety guidelines for the facilities they compete on.
I'm still miffed as to why they wouldn't give Competition Plus a statement or allow them access just like the other publications!
Excellent article thanks for sharing. I got a feeling we haven't heard the last of this horrific situation I hope to never see that again EVER.
This one was really hard to swallow. I hope all the powers to be put their egos aside and do what's right to protect all the competitors who put their collective hides on the line to entertain us......

 

[__]

From the perspective of this measly fan, several things went wrong. The engine exploded, the parachutes did not deploy and the track's safety precautions were insufficient. I'm not aware of any available safety device that is designed to withstand a +200mph head-on impact. Etown seems to be the only thing taking the criticism. It seems all are in agreement that Etown's shut down area is too short. For the sake of comparison, is there any available database on national event tracks that lists the length of the shut down areas, incline of shut down area (if any, I know Bandimere's is sloped upward), length of sand trap, etc?

For what's worth, I'm still struggling with the tragic event I witnessed. I can't believe Scott isn't home with his family. Darrell's loss was too much. Then Eric. Now Scott. I've been a life-long fan of NHRA drag racing. Unless something is drastically changed, I think I've gone to my last race. I'll never be able to look down track at Etown without thinking of Scott. Never be able to look at that big screen during a national event without getting chills. Never want to go through this again. I can't imagine what Scott's family and friends are going through. Can't imagine wanting to climb in a fuel car again. If that makes me a sissy, so be it. If I ever go to an NHRA race again, I'm going to have to believe "Dedicated to Safety" is more than a nostalgic slogan on a weathered sign available in the NitroMall for $9.95.

 

[Chuck]

If the shutdown area at Englishtown is so dangerous and the only thing missing is a lake full of sharks why on earth hasn't Bob Vandergriff complained about this to NHRA, or track officials, or fellow race teams. Keep it off your race schedule if it is that bad.
Now that a tragic accident has happened it turns into a let's play the blame game, that is not right.

Jared, evidently you didn't read the entire article. They quote Gary Scelzi saying that he has made many comments to NHRA officials and there was no action taken. What difference would it make if BV said something? I agree with Bob that a refusal to run will get more results than anything else. Also, I didn't see anywhere that Bob said Scott's death was the tracks fault, just that there were a number of obstacles that he felt shouldn't have been there. Did you happen to watch the eliminations on Sunday? If you did, you should have seen the curved concrete retaining wall, the steel poles and the trees when they panned down the track. I'm not saying the track is at fault, they have what NHRA's minimum requirements say they have to have in place. But, come on, a frigging concrete wall curving into the path of a possibly out of control, 330 mph rocket!!! WTF!!!!!!! I realize that there is a road beyond the trees, but damn, how about several nets to go through, NOT an f-ing wall!

 

[Jim]

Bob mentions one standard, I wonder if certain states would have a say in that as well. People mentioned how NJ seems to have its hand in things more than others. Were there issues in the shutdown area that were there by law of NJ?

In New Jersey, all motor racing is under the control of the NJ State Police. They have a director of motorsports and a group of state troopers who are either at every event or on call if an crash occurs.

When there is a fatality or severe injury, racing must stop until the police have examined the scene and give the okay for racing to resume. They often impound the car and collect evidence. The investigation can be very thorough and they look at all possibilities.

The NJ State Police investigation is routine and no one should read anything more into it.

Jim