Is Bradenton Next? (1 Viewer)

8000 homes? Goodbye racetrack.
The county hasn't approved the application yet....

I'm sure the hundreds of thousands of emails (maybe more) that were sent to the Manatee County commissioners at the request of Cleetus won't go unnoticed.

Remember what happened when Palm Bach raceway closed in Florida? It was the track owners who insisted they wouldn't sell to anyone who wanted to re-open the track. I forget the exact details but the county didn't really want the track to close and they did not immediately approve the rezoning.... or whatever their meeting was bout. PBIR closed permanently strictly because that is what the owners of the track at that time wanted to do.

We'll see, I guess....
 
look at bradenton dragstrip on google earth and do the timeline back to 2016.......it's just being encroached on. it's too bad.
 
Let's see...emails from people who do not live in the town vs. 8,000 homes filled with people who pay taxes.
Yeah, I get it.... but Cleet said if you put your full name and address they have to put your email on the record. Just because some people don't live in that county, that doesn't mean those people never travel to, or spend money in that county.
 
I see this in the future of National Trails also. Half million plus dollar homes moving southward towards the track. And state route 40 and 37 single lane each way backs up quickly. No-one wants traffic or noise around them. I live close and can hear them run all season, I race there and sometimes it gets old. And before everyone says you moved near the track, no we have been here since 1960 the track was built in 1964. Also I am not complaining
 
Yeah, I get it.... but Cleet said if you put your full name and address they have to put your email on the record. Just because some people don't live in that county, that doesn't mean those people never travel to, or spend money in that county.

You are right Brian. Several years ago, Pacific Raceways in Seattle applied for a huge expansion including on site garages and an automotive innovation center. Somebody posted the email addresses of all of the King County representatives, suggesting you voice your support of the project(s).I did that and I got responses from most of them (along with unwanted junk emails from them for several years- worth the annoyance). I live in Canada 700 miles north of Seattle, but I have been going there and spending money, since 1970. They listened to my opinion (and everyone else's ) and the applications were approved.
 
It's a shame but money talks ...... We lost Hollywood Speedway and Moroso Motorsports Park , I mean Palm Beach Intl Raceway , here in S Fla. Sad.
 
Yeah, I get it.... but Cleet said if you put your full name and address they have to put your email on the record. Just because some people don't live in that county, that doesn't mean those people never travel to, or spend money in that county.
People who do not live in the town or county do not vote there. That's what matters most to elected officials.

There is also the issue of preventing landowners from doing what they want with their property. Blocking development could also block the landowners from making money off their property. The only sure way to stop development is for the track to buy the surrounding tracts of land. Of course, all the people who send in emails could chip in a few thousand dollars each to buy the land and let it sit undeveloped.
 
wonder if the orange grove owners who sell out to the developers are seeing big increases in their property taxes? as well the racetrack?
not to mention possible zoning regulations that get voted thru........what was once agriculture and industrial, is suddenly zoned for housing and retail as well.
 
People who do not live in the town or county do not vote there. That's what matters most to elected officials.

There is also the issue of preventing landowners from doing what they want with their property. Blocking development could also block the landowners from making money off their property. The only sure way to stop development is for the track to buy the surrounding tracts of land. Of course, all the people who send in emails could chip in a few thousand dollars each to buy the land and let it sit undeveloped.
Thanks for explaining how voting works. lol.

Also, if you can't prevent land owners from doing what they want on their land..... then how is it okay for a development to move in, then build a bunch of houses, then complain about the noise next door and they prevent the race track land owners from doing what they want on their land? How is it okay in one direction, but not the other?

You're correct. If the track owners could've purchased the land, all of this would've been a non-issue.... maybe Victor and Cleet were not offered the deal? Or maybe it was too much mosey for those guys to spend? We don't know the details...

Also, Like Cleet said in his public statement to the county commissioners..... If he went before the board off commissioners to have some of his existing land re-zoned so he could build two new loud race tracks right next to 4500 existing houses that have stood there for 50 years, the answer would ablsolutly be "no" because the two land uses are not compatible. Allowing this project to move forward most likely will prevent Cleetus and Victor from making money on their land in the future..... So when the deal is the exact opposite, why is it suddenly okay?

....Because county commissioners make all their money in "backroom deals". It has nothing to do with allowing the land owner to use his land however he wants, it's all about how much money he paid the commissioners in the back room before the meeting. lol.

And lastly, if those guys want to cut me in on their profits at the end of every year, or pay a nice interest rate until I'm paid back, I will gladly throw in a few thousand dollars for their land purchase.
 
the track would have to purchase an insane amount of land. I am 2 miles from the track and on a quiet night when they are running I can hear them clearly.
 
Thanks for explaining how voting works. lol.
Obviously, people who thnk elected officials care about what out-of-towners think do not understand voting.

Also, if you can't prevent land owners from doing what they want on their land..... then how is it okay for a development to move in, then build a bunch of houses, then complain about the noise next door and they prevent the race track land owners from doing what they want on their land? How is it okay in one direction, but not the other?

The developers or the current landowners will not complain about the noise. They will have made their money and be long gone. If the town does anything to prevent them from developing their land, there will be lawsuits against the town, and ultimately the landowners will win. As for the track owners, development like that around the track will make their land more valuable to sell to anther developer.

You're correct. If the track owners could've purchased the land, all of this would've been a non-issue.... maybe Victor and Cleet were not offered the deal? Or maybe it was too much mosey for those guys to spend? We don't know the details...

If the land around the track is too valuable for them to buy, that makes their land very valuable too.

Also, Like Cleet said in his public statement to the county commissioners..... If he went before the board off commissioners to have some of his existing land re-zoned so he could build two new loud race tracks right next to 4500 existing houses that have stood there for 50 years, the answer would ablsolutly be "no" because the two land uses are not compatible. Allowing this project to move forward most likely will prevent Cleetus and Victor from making money on their land in the future..... So when the deal is the exact opposite, why is it suddenly okay?

Approving the development plan does not prevent the track owners from operating the track. In addition, they will still have the land that they can sell or use for other purposes.

It may not seem fair, but property owners have the right to do what they want with their property—within zoning laws—to make money.
 
Obviously, people who thnk elected officials care about what out-of-towners think do not understand voting.
I never said they did care..... I said the county would be forced to put it on official record..... according to Cleetus.
The developers or the current landowners will not complain about the noise. They will have made their money and be long gone. If the town does anything to prevent them from developing their land, there will be lawsuits against the town, and ultimately the landowners will win. As for the track owners, development like that around the track will make their land more valuable to sell to anther developer.
Cleetus does NOT make his money the traditional way by operating a race track. The race track is a tool that he uses to make content for the internet . Between live streaming his own events on his website, ad revenue from YouTube, products from his merch store, and of course whatever sponsorship deals he can get, and probably many other sources of income all add up. He doesn't just rely on track revenue alone. I have no inside numbers but I'm willing to bet that even if he sold his property for TOP dollar to the land developers, he would ultimately lose money in the long run. So, raising the value of his property may look and sound great, but that doesn't mean he would sell his land/race track. Would you sell your tool that you use to make money.... especially for a loss in the long run? I doubt it. Remember, Cleetus is still in his 20's, he's got a long carreer ahead of him. He's not an old guy looking to retire soon.
If the land around the track is too valuable for them to buy, that makes their land very valuable too.
Again, that's great on paper, but why would he sell his track which is a major tool that he uses to make content for the internet?
Approving the development plan does not prevent the track owners from operating the track. In addition, they will still have the land that they can sell or use for other purposes.
Right, it won't prevent them from using the track TODAY, but ultimately it WILL prevent them from using the track sometime in the relatively near future..... and probably prevent them from using it forever. Cleetus doesn't want to sell the land, or use it for other tings.... He wants to create content at his race track and eventually hand the track down to his son. Selling it, or using it for other purposes is not a satisfactory alternative for him. As a loand owner, he should be able to use his land for whatever he wants, remember?
It may not seem fair, but property owners have the right to do what they want with their property—within zoning laws—to make money.
The land in question is NOT zoned for residential.... That's the problem! The current land owner wants to get it rezoned. That's like playing a game and then asking for a rule change after the game starts. The current land owners and his/her family purchased agricultural land (way back when?) and now after many decades they want to get it re-zoned so they can cash out with millions in profit...... even though it will potentially put his/her neighbor's race tracks out of business. They knew it was zoned for ag back when they purchased it, why should it suddenly be re-zoned today? They bought it as ag land, and they can sell it as ag land. What's the problem?

And yep, even race track owners have the right to do what they want with their own property..... and not be sued by the new neighbors for doing what's already been done on that property for the previous 50 years.
 
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The land in question is NOT zoned for residential.... That's the problem! The current land owner wants to get it rezoned. That's like playing a game and then asking for a rule change after the game starts. The current land owners and his/her family purchased agricultural land (way back when?) and now after many decades they want to get it re-zoned so they can cash out with millions in profit...... even though it will potentially put his/her neighbor's race tracks out of business. They knew it was zoned for ag back when they purchased it, why should it suddenly be re-zoned today? They bought it as ag land, and they can sell it as ag land. What's the problem?
As the property owners, they have the right to ask for rezoning for their property to do what they can do to make money. If the rezoning is denied, they have to deal with it. The town is going to do what is best for the town. So the question is, what is best for the town: a drag strip surrounded by empty land, or 8,000 homes that pay property taxes? The town could decide not to approve the zoning on the basis of what it would mean for the local school district or surrounding infrastructure.

Why would the current property owners want to rezone now after decades of owning ag land? The market is different now and there is more money in residential uses than ag use.
 
I never said they did care..... I said the county would be forced to put it on official record..... according to Cleetus.
Why does it being on the "official record" matter? Who is going to look back and criticize the local government for ignoring what people from out of town said?
Cleetus does NOT make his money the traditional way by operating a race track. The race track is a tool that he uses to make content for the internet . Between live streaming his own events on his website, ad revenue from YouTube, products from his merch store, and of course whatever sponsorship deals he can get, and probably many other sources of income all add up. He doesn't just rely on track revenue alone. I have no inside numbers but I'm willing to bet that even if he sold his property for TOP dollar to the land developers, he would ultimately lose money in the long run.

Perhaps. Or perhaps YouTube changes its policies again and demonetizes his channel. I think you are overestimating the value of YouTube channels, streaming and content marketing. Don't forget that when you pocket a lot of money from land sales, you can just invest it. In addition, his content business is not sufficient reason to block others from making money off their land.

So, raising the value of his property may look and sound great, but that doesn't mean he would sell his land/race track. Would you sell your tool that you use to make money.... especially for a loss in the long run? I doubt it. Remember, Cleetus is still in his 20's, he's got a long carreer ahead of him. He's not an old guy looking to retire soon.

1) You don't know that selling the property would lose him money in the long run. 2) Pocketing a lot of money from selling property gives people the freedom to do other things. And again, the other property owners have the right to do what they want with their property.
Again, that's great on paper, but why would he sell his track which is a major tool that he uses to make content for the internet?

Right, it won't prevent them from using the track TODAY, but ultimately it WILL prevent them from using the track sometime in the relatively near future..... and probably prevent them from using it forever. Cleetus doesn't want to sell the land, or use it for other tings.... He wants to create content at his race track and eventually hand the track down to his son. Selling it, or using it for other purposes is not a satisfactory alternative for him. As a loand owner, he should be able to use his land for whatever he wants, remember?

Do you know his plans for the track and business? Do you know that his son wants the business?

Property owners cannot do whatever they want with a property. Their planned use has to fit in existing zoning lands and municipal planning. Planning and zoning changes over time. I wonder if the track could even be built there now under the current plan, or if it is just grandfathered in.
 
Why does it being on the "official record" matter? Who is going to look back and criticize the local government for ignoring what people from out of town said?


Perhaps. Or perhaps YouTube changes its policies again and demonetizes his channel. I think you are overestimating the value of YouTube channels, streaming and content marketing. Don't forget that when you pocket a lot of money from land sales, you can just invest it. In addition, his content business is not sufficient reason to block others from making money off their land.



1) You don't know that selling the property would lose him money in the long run. 2) Pocketing a lot of money from selling property gives people the freedom to do other things. And again, the other property owners have the right to do what they want with their property.


Do you know his plans for the track and business? Do you know that his son wants the business?

Property owners cannot do whatever they want with a property. Their planned use has to fit in existing zoning lands and municipal planning. Planning and zoning changes over time. I wonder if the track could even be built there now under the current plan, or if it is just grandfathered in.

Cleetus' son is about a month old so you can ask him if he wants the track but you will not get an answer.
 
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