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Crazy Idea

Porkchop

Nitro Member
#41
Jerry,
Not arguing, just talking. You keep saying 1 pump. They have 1 pump now. It's a great fricken big one, but it is just one piece. So are you going to put a gallons per minute limit on it? Or something else.


Alan
For some reason I thought it was 2 pumps. So Yes you can set the pump to 75-80 gpm 100 gpm anything they want.
 

camaro

Nitro Member
#43
No points for a record, that changed a few years ago. Otherwise you would be correct.
Alan
ok first off, i 'm aware none of this is plausible but its fun doing the math. Ok, no points for a national record ey! what if the 2nd place guy runner ups, to the 23 race win guy, in the first 5 races of the countdown but out qualifies him every race (possibly up to 50+ points ). so going into the last race the lead could be as small as 80 or 90 pts, which the 2nd place guy could overcome if he ran the table and the 23 race win guy loses first round or dnq's. so i believe its mathematically possible to lose a championship despite winning the first 23 races ~:)~
 

none

Nitro Member
#44
ok first off, i 'm aware none of this is plausible but its fun doing the math. Ok, no points for a national record ey! what if the 2nd place guy runner ups, to the 23 race win guy, in the first 5 races of the countdown but out qualifies him every race (possibly up to 50+ points ). so going into the last race the lead could be as small as 80 or 90 pts, which the 2nd place guy could overcome if he ran the table and the 23 race win guy loses first round or dnq's. so i believe its mathematically possible to lose a championship despite winning the first 23 races ~:)~
James,
What's the last race you attended? Really, I'm curious.


Take the bonus points for winning the regular season, then add the 5 rounds for winning the first five countdown races, (even if your guy is runner up.) It's outta reach...... My guy might have to attempt a qualifying pass, but really, it's locked before we get there.
Alan
 

camaro

Nitro Member
#45
James,
What's the last race you attended? Really, I'm curious.


Take the bonus points for winning the regular season, then add the 5 rounds for winning the first five countdown races, (even if your guy is runner up.) It's outta reach...... My guy might have to attempt a qualifying pass, but really, it's locked before we get there.
Alan
no need to get snippy fella, i was just havin' fun. unless the bonus points for winning the regular season is more than 40 pts than my math still stands
 

none

Nitro Member
#46
no need to get snippy fella, i was just havin' fun. unless the bonus points for winning the regular season is more than 40 pts than my math still stands
Snippy? I thought we were having a fun discussion? I was going to invite you for a beer (at my expense) next time you came to an event. I was hoping your response would be "I go to Denver every year." Or something like that. Why so serious?
Alan
P.S. If you are figuring that your guy is #1 qualifier at every race and my guy is #16, your math doesn't work, because if my guy wins every race, then even if he is #16, then he beats #1 every week! LoL
 

Tybamf

Nitro Member
#48
Don't know if plausible but, what about an electronic cylinder pressure monitor? When or if a cylinder reaches a certain predetermined pressure, the mag is grounded out and the run aborted.

BTW, I am not in favor of limiting anything the teams can do pertaining to equipment. I think that needs to happen organically. When John Force gets tired of blowing his stuff up every weekend plus a trip to the hospital, he will adjust.
 

Bruno

Nitro Member
#49
For some reason I thought it was 2 pumps. So Yes you can set the pump to 75-80 gpm 100 gpm anything they want.
They used to run two 55 gpm pumps but now I believe it is one mega pump. I agree with you totally. Take fuel away. Then there is less to burn, less blower, less timing, less speed. Since going to 1000' the times are meaningless to me. How can the standing quarter mile be gone? It has always been what cars were judged by. For people to say the fans would not like the times and speeds if it slowed down is incorrect. Watch the fans when a peddlefest happens. You can actually watch the cars going down the track instead of a blur or heat waves and the fans go nuts! The video of Snake that was posted was so right on. Stuff will still get blown up. The fuses will just change in length but the explosions will not be as violent and we will race to the quarter.
 
#50
Everyone wants to pull 1 Mag from the equation, Smaller fuel pump, etc. why not change the rear gear to a taller ratio? That'll show them down.
 

camaro

Nitro Member
#52
James,
What's the last race you attended? Really, I'm curious.
well, since u asked. it was 2007 or 08. I'm holding out until they go back to 1320ft.:D I think there startin' to crack, as i thought i notice a couple of nitro cars stay in it well past the 1000ft finish line :p
 
#53
I've got friends who haven't gone since 1000ft too...
my issue has been usually weather, finances, or being sick....
Now E-town is gone and I put it off too many times...
 

Frank

Nitro Member
#56
10 years later....

Yep, Don Prudhomme is absolutely right and that's why I think the NHRA should consider some sort of an idea like I suggested earlier in this thread. Changing the engine configuration, reducing nitro percentage, shortening the track, etc., is just a stop gap. Not a real solution. If you change the rules so Top Fuelers are slowed down to running 4 flat instead of 3.60s, it's just a matter of time before they start trying to stretch every ounce out of the combination to try and run low 3.90s which will ultimately lead to parts failure. Granted, the explosions will be smaller with less fuel, less nitro percentage, whatever, but they're still going to happen.

Here is Ty Carptenter's quote from a few posts earlier (sorry I don't know how to quote multiple posts in my reply) - "BTW, I am not in favor of limiting anything the teams can do pertaining to equipment. I think that needs to happen organically. When John Force gets tired of blowing his stuff up every weekend plus a trip to the hospital, he will adjust."

I disagree with this sentiment. I think Don Prudhomme does as well. If it was going to happen organically it would have happened years ago, but like Prudhomme says in the clip, "we let things get out of hand." Instead, the opposite has happened. It costs even more money to play the game today and because of that only a select few players can play which is one of the reasons car counts are down across the board. Back in the day there was no oil down policy. If you blew an engine, the track was cleaned up and life moved on. Fast forward to the present day and the NHRA knows how detrimental long oil down delays are to the fan experience at the track, plus the live TV experience. I don't have the oil down policy timeline memorized so work with me here. The first policy was something along the lines of, you get two free oil downs, then after that we're chopping points. Then it was modified down to one freebie and both points and money could be taken away. Then the freebies were tossed out and an escalating scale of more points and more dollars lost for each infraction was put in place. Plus policies were put in place for the sportsman classes. The point being, NHRA has tried to send the message that 'grenading an engine is not acceptable' yet the teams continue to push harder and harder. The loss of points, the loss of money hasn't been enough of a deterrent. To me, disqualifying a driver for exploding during eliminations is the next step.

Alan Reinhart, I'll modify my idea to account for the valid point you brought up about qualifying. We can't have fans coming to the track on Saturday and they only get to see a handful of cars make runs because so many other cars hurt an engine on Friday. So, instead of one engine in qualifying and one in eliminations, I'll change it to two engines for qualifying but stick with the one engine on race day.
In summary, a competitor may use up to three engines during a weekend, BUT, whatever engine is in between the rails when they pull into the staging lanes on Sunday morning has to survive the day. If they win a round but blow it up, they are disqualified (except for the finals of course), and the quickest losing, clean run competitor from the same round, is reinstated.
 

none

Nitro Member
#57
Well,
Now that it's past noon on Saturday and I'm off my self imposed punishment for being snippy, Mr. Forney is correct, if a driver garnered all the qualifying points, and was runner up at the first five countdown races, while another driver could qualify 15th or so and win every race, he could still lose the championship. So back to Chris' original post, a guy (or gal) could win the first 23 and still lose the Championship.

Alan
 

none

Nitro Member
#58
Alan Reinhart, I'll modify my idea to account for the valid point you brought up about qualifying. We can't have fans coming to the track on Saturday and they only get to see a handful of cars make runs because so many other cars hurt an engine on Friday. So, instead of one engine in qualifying and one in eliminations, I'll change it to two engines for qualifying but stick with the one engine on race day.
In summary, a competitor may use up to three engines during a weekend, BUT, whatever engine is in between the rails when they pull into the staging lanes on Sunday morning has to survive the day. If they win a round but blow it up, they are disqualified (except for the finals of course), and the quickest losing, clean run competitor from the same round, is reinstated.
Just to continue the discussion, define engine. If it bangs the blower but doesn't hurt the block am I good? What if it torches a head? If I black the crank but don't hurt the block am I out? Or can I replace the crank? If I have to replace the crank, but run the same block it will be impossible to make a TV turnaround. There are many reasons to replace an engine even if it didn't blow up. You could have a lifter fail and change the engine for the simple reason that it's quicker and easier than changing the cam and cleaning all the metal shavings out of it. Would you disqualify me for that?

Here's where I see that going. I win round 1 and chuck the rods in the shutdown. Now I need to have a complete welding and machine shop at the track to fix the block so at least I get the points for showing up round 2. And if I'm trying to remove the engine, weld and machine the block, then thrash the engine back together and head back to the line in an hour. When the smart move and the safest thing would be to replace the wounded engine and send it back to the shop for a proper repair. I can see a lot of unintended consequences coming from that rule.

Just my opinion,
Alan
 

Dave

Nitro Member
#59
Fun fact - even without a countdown, a driver could win all 23 races and still lose the title in the 24th under the perfect scenario.
 

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